Fighter to Mage or pure Mage
BookofBlade
Member Posts: 0
First off I will be playing only multiplayer will a full group of friends once bgee is released. I volunteered to be the groups mage and was wondering what you all thought my best option for filling this role would be.
my initial thoughts are to either make a gnome illusionist or a human fighter and swap to mage early enough to still have all the mage potential sense we will need it late in the game
any and all thoughts are greatly appreciated and thank you in advance for your sugestions
my initial thoughts are to either make a gnome illusionist or a human fighter and swap to mage early enough to still have all the mage potential sense we will need it late in the game
any and all thoughts are greatly appreciated and thank you in advance for your sugestions
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Comments
Currently a fighter / mage dual class isnt a very good option in BG1. Fighter / Mage multiclass is better, but loses out on level 5 spells, which if you are going to be the only caster you are going to need.
The best way of dual classing to a mage in BG1 is from a level 6 thief, or with kits available a swashbuckler with 100 points in open locks and disarm traps, as this still leaves you with enough EXP to gain to reach level 9 mage and cast 5th level spells.
This build should not enter melee after the first part of the game (I would put maybe 3 pips in crossbows, or sling, if you want to use a shield), and is more of a buffed mage than a fighter/mage, but its still better than a straight mage. Only downsides really are that you can't specialise and get the extra spells, though at least you won't have any spell restrictions. Illusionists can't cast necromancy spells, which sucks IMHO. A human Necromancer or Conjurer would be okay too, though the latter misses out on Identify I think, which sucks if you're meant to be the helpful party mage...
If you want more of a genuine fighter>mage you need to dual at 7,9 or higher, which is too long to wait in my book. Or you could be a fighter/mage multiclass, but you won't be as strong a party mage overall.
I think either go Specialist Mage, Dual Early, or Multiclass would be better for a party Mage in BGEE
It's worth noting that gnome and elf have their own individual benefits however I don't think their bonuses are worth more than 3 levels of fighter especially since you can dual class into a specialist mage in BG1.
As far as multi VS dual class goes, a dual class mage serves a completely different purpose from a multi class one. The goal generally when you dual into mage is to have enough XP to hit max spellcasting level whereas a fighter/mage multi serves more as a self buffing flexible fighter. The XP cap in BG1 is very restrictive so you cannot have an efficient buff fighter ala kensai/mage from BG2.
Although a Wild Mage sounds fun =3 Specialist Wizard with a really crazy downside XD
either that or take xan, dump him when you dual and get another fighter in. fudge it, with your dualled fighter/mage you won't even need a 6th party member.
I'd agree with that
Early levels if you're worried about it, just start with the sleep spell and a ranged weapon. Your party will love it. Higher levels just blast things to smithereens... Plus with the right protections you can never go wrong. Fighter levels aren't needed.
Personally, I prefer being able to use both spells and weapons. If I run out of spells or get attacked in close quarters, I can still function and have a reasonable chance to survive. I will also get more HP with a Fighter/Mage than I will with a single class mage, which can make a big difference in the early game and in some of the harder battles in the later game.
I've never liked dual class because it permanently limits you to whatever class level you were when you dualed your character. I like to continue to rise in power, so forcing my character to never advance any further seems rather pointless. Think if you eventually import your character to BG2. Will you still want them to be a really low level, or would you want them to have the ability to keep going? If you dual class you will never have the option to keep going, at least not in the original class. That is why I prefer the muli-class option.
I ditched Minsc out of the party because it was gaining measly HP/level, only Dynaheir had less HP than him
Also, with dual you can control how much XP you put in fighter and how much goes in mage. If you are going to continue over BG2+ToB, higher mage levels will be ultimately more important than fighter levels.
Having level 4 to dual as a reference, I see the comparison like this, this is just an insight so anyone else may make more precise calculations:
1) Until the moment of dual, the single classed fighter will be more effective than the multiclass
2) During the learning period, multiclass is clearly superior
3) When the fighter abilities are recovered, the dual is again superior to multiclass
4) The multiclass catches up and eventually surpasses the dual in THAC0 by the end of BG1, although he may lag in spell progression
5) For the first part of BG2 the multiclass is better
6) By the later part of BG2 the dual becomes more powerful
And at last, if you are going to roleplay a human, multiclass is not an option
The idea behind taking fighter levels is to correct the issues of mage survivability. A fighter dual to mage will have access to the same amount of spells as a pure mage if dual classed correctly but still be able to wear armor, shields, helmets and have somewhat more HP than a regular mage. For example:
A level 2 Fighter dual classed into Conjurer will still reach level 9 of Conjurer, cast just as many spells as a single class one and racial bonuses asside will be superior in every aspect. This character can wear elven chain mail in BG2, pick up 2 points in sword and shield style for extra missile protection, use tower shields, wear helmets, etc.
Wearing a helmet, Boots of avoidance, tower shield +1 +4, 2 * sword and shield style, and you basically have a mage that's immune to arrows in BG1, which is by far the biggest threat to mages in the entire game. Even with just the boots, masteries and a non magic tower shield you can tank the bandit camp no problem as a mage. This lets you cast freely and saves you from having to deal with constant interruptions and death by arrows
Because 2 fighter levels don't mean anything in terms of total XP, there's no real detriment to doing this. You don't want this character to fight hand to hand, you just want to expand a mages ability to equip items and make them a bit more durable. Whereas a fighter/mage multiclass is a character you actively want to fight with instead of just sitting back and casting spells.
Of course kensai/mage and some BG2 specific dual class options are not used for this but, as far as BG1 goes I consider them characters that serve different purposes.
Under the current experience cap of ToSC (161,000 I believe) you could get away with leveling your Mage to 5 before being forced to Dual Class over to Mage (in order to gain maximum spell slots in the game). But if you are only intending on filling one role (the Mage) and you wish to contribute to your group as a Mage early on, I would suggest taking Fighter to level 3. Here's why;
1. Relatively quick turn around when Dual Classing. You are looking at only 4,000 XP until you become a Mage. Early on in the game the group isn't missing out really by not having an arcane caster in the group and they benefit more by you tanking during those early levels.
2. Assuming the proficiency allocation rules don't change you could have 3 points into a single weapon group (or weapon given the enhancements). The downside is that this bonus will go away untill you have accumulated 10K XP (Level 4) as a Mage. This isn't an issue if you are only really concerned abou the Fighter's HP benefit, but it is worth noting. I would suggest 3 in your melee weapon and 2 in your ranged weapon or vice versa depending on your play style and intentions.
3. Small bonuses to you Saves and your THAC0. Minimal, yet bonuses nonetheless. Decent considering the relatively small amount of XP needed to gain them when compared to your Dual Class.
If your companions are good at their roles, there may be very few times you need the proficieny and THAC0 bonuses. But, having them can mean the difference between life and death and only adds to your character's resilience.
I hope this perspective contributes to your decision. Have fun!
Adam
Sometimes I want a character who'll shoot arrows and cast spells, then I'll dual him from fighter 3 to mage. On the other hand, sometimes I just want a specialist , in that I'll have him just as a spellcaster.
If you like to be active in combat, even as a mage, I'd have him dual early .
Why can't he be a specialist mage ?
In vanilla BG you were able to dual in a mage kit.
I DO expect they'll still allow this in this version !
You also have to seperate what works with BG2s EXP cap, and what works in BG1s. Why make a 6 / 7 dual class for BG1 when you can have a 7/7 multi with an extra 1/2 attack per round?