The atmosphere is so good that I actually imagine some roleplaying going on . Specially among my party members.
If you're role playing in your head, why do you need a game at all? It's day-dreaming, no? I know it's a fine line, but IWD2 (or the original) don't cross that line and were completely uninspiring.
'Cause I like creating characters, though not necessarily create the whole scenario =D
I never got into it because there was no story or, you know, ROLE PLAYING. It was just a dungeon crawler. I need a story to keep me interested in games.
The atmosphere is so good that I actually imagine some roleplaying going on . Specially among my party members.
Odd that people say IWD had no story. Maybe they didn't play the game. Not only does it have a story, but its much more of a railroad than BG. What I missed in IWD was the kind of exploration BG allows. And yes, the atmosphere is great, especially the first IWD. BG is a much longer, layered story, but IWD certainly has one, and the role playing is what you make it, as in any RPG.
I didn't mind the game, yeah not as good as BG or IWD but I do remember reading that the makers wanted to make the game more puzzle based ie the god awful ice palace. In all an average effort with good music I seem to remember
First time playing, I couldn't wait to get out of Targos, but once I got out, I realized Targos is pretty much the most fun/interesting location in the game.
Wasn't for me either. Tried them both but couldn't get into IWD and IWD2. But then again I also couldn't get into Planescape: Torrment either, which by everyone's account is an amazingly good game.
I couldn't get into Planescape: Torment either. I like the music, but not the setting, or the characters.
I also never managed to muster any real enthusiasm for IWD or IWD2 - had I played them before the BG games things may have been different, but after them the IWDs just felt empty and devoid of immersion by comparison. NWN ended up a big disappointment too, while NWN2 and MotB were pleasant surprises.
Wasn't for me either. Tried them both but couldn't get into IWD and IWD2. But then again I also couldn't get into Planescape: Torrment either, which by everyone's account is an amazingly good game.
I couldn't get into Planescape: Torment either. I like the music, but not the setting, or the characters.
We must havebeen influenced by different stuff in our lives. I absolutely love torment! (music, setting AND characters)
Wasn't for me either. Tried them both but couldn't get into IWD and IWD2. But then again I also couldn't get into Planescape: Torrment either, which by everyone's account is an amazingly good game.
I couldn't get into Planescape: Torment either. I like the music, but not the setting, or the characters.
Same, but for me it was because I couldn't work around the combat. I got killed way too much and I never really got far enough to get to the amazing story that everyone talks about.
In the BG series many characters use your CHARNAME in dialogue. It also appears in bounty notices and other places. This gives a sense that your character is not only embedded into the story but the main motivation for it. This is missing in both IWD stories where your party is very much the nameless outsiders that have been called in. There is no CHARNAME in IWD as you don't have a main character. But you do have a party. And this party lacks a name. People do give parties names - like the Marauders of the Undermountain (is that right?) in the Helm and Cloak inn. In IWD2 there are the Iron Collar Mercenaries in Targos. If there was a remake of these games I'd request a feature where you can name your party. And then some dialogue could actually refer to your group as though they've become a known entity.
IWD games are more dungeon-crawling, less plot-driven.
BG games are plot-driven, with less dungeon-crawling.
As combat in D&D games are often extremely tedious and really simple, I feel that's why IWD games fall a little flat. Every fight for me degenerated into "lob more fireballs." Waves and waves and waves and waves of guys is not really fun when every last encounter is that way. Fighting an uber powerful wizard because he kidnapped my childhood friend and wants to steal my soul? I'll do that any day.
THAT SAID, I like IWD2 a lot. From a pure gameplay experience, it's the most challenging and dynamic IE game. You can't munchkin your character by rerolling til he is god-mode. Character creation is robust and dynamic. Combat is legitimately challenging because you're always just a crit away from your guy dying. You can't skip from a crappy regular weapon to a +3 katana that stuns people on hit just because you know where to get it.
Wasn't for me either. Tried them both but couldn't get into IWD and IWD2. But then again I also couldn't get into Planescape: Torrment either, which by everyone's account is an amazingly good game.
I couldn't get into Planescape: Torment either. I like the music, but not the setting, or the characters.
We must havebeen influenced by different stuff in our lives. I absolutely love torment! (music, setting AND characters)
I only like Ignus.
I just find the setting extremely depressing, a city you can't escape, pretty much. Starts in a morgue, moves over to a dumpster, then a sewer, I guess. I love colors but most if not the entire game seems to be so brown and grey. Death, misery it feels overall anti-social. I mean, characters that wear giant razor blades on their armor, some even get pissed off if you try to talk to them, the Lady of Pain who I guess is Sigil's caretaker, hates attention too. There's characters who can't die, here and there and those who really wants to. Like Ignus love, hugs him and burns alive, just like that. No hesitation. Nobody seems happy, I mean how could they be?
I like things that are different and alien, but I'm much more home in a silly, epic fantasy adventure.
@Secria , for opposite reasons I hate NWN2 - it was all too colourful and comfortable , all I thought was "this was supposed to be more dramatic and decadent"!
IWD2 was certainly fun to play, I liked the effort that went into supporting 3.0, and all in all it was beautifully done -- but the final battle (and thus the "point" of the game) just wasn't that interesting in my opinion. Having defeated a truly ancient evil in IWD1, going up against those petulant wannabees did nothing for me. I felt very similarly about NWN2 -- great game, but totally lame ending. I liked IWD1 better, although I agree with others that I felt less personally invested in it than the BG series.
OTOH, just to add to the Planescape comments -- I've played that game so many times that I'm amazed that there aren't holes burned into my CD-ROM copy. My favorite game ever...
I found my IWD2 cd in a box I was unpacking. I only got halfway through the first time I played - then gave up. I don't know why it didn't click. Maybe it was: The 3E rules I didn't understand.
I really hate that ruleset. Its a lame shortcut to make a good entertaining system , so-to-say by stealing from reality... And to no surprise it ended not real... So confusing... IT caN "NOT" be real!!! It's just a game! Game : (noun) About the verbs "to play" , "to have fun" , "to waste time" , "to forget" ???
i did not really get into IWD2 as much as BG2 mainly because i felt there was a lack of interaction with my party members since they were all created characters they felt like they lacked a backstory and the lack of party banter was badly apparent after enjoying BG2 vastly.
I guess i was spoiled by BG2 and could not go back to the days of no party interaction like in the gold box AD&D games like pool of radiance etc
I recently did an IWD2 run through about the first half of the game, and I enjoyed it very much (at first). I used the IWD2 NPC Project, so I had plenty of character interaction, and I personally love the 3rd edition version of the engine.
What kills the game for me about halfway through, such that I never care to finish it, is that it turns into a very tedious (to me), and no-fun series of huge, labyrinthine puzzle dungeons. (Throw this switch here, push this button on the other side of the labyrinth to open a door into a new labyrinth, figure out the exact sequence of levers to pull here, out of twelve levers (you *were* writing down all those clues scattered all over the labyrinth, that were not put into your journal, right?).
Were it not for the focus on puzzles, I would love IWD2. But it is a solve-the-puzzles game for its entire second half, and I can't stand it. So, I'll never finish it. For me, it's just no fun after the first few straightforward areas.
IWD2 was the first IE game I ever did play, and the first D&D game I ever did play as well. Additionally, the first of both I ever finished completely. It would be a decade before I completed another.
I loved the ability to create your entire party from the ground up. The advantages outweighed the cons, to me (and in some ways still do). Sure, the humor is lax and the story could be better, but I would recommend it to anyone and would dance a thousand times over if it were to become EE'd.
I personally find some restrictions of the 2E rules to be annoying and stifling, which is probably another reason while I adore IWD2 so much.
I personally find some restrictions of the 2E rules to be annoying and stifling, which is probably another reason while I adore IWD2 so much.
I was talking about single-player and/or for a complete stranger who had a past background of HoMM or Ultima. It could be liked though in that case also , however , personally , 3E may be good only if ignored , so , with a multiplayer or with some backseat gaming. It goes bear shackles on the chest aside that - it is like a new country's law-book which you drop amongst the mein-landers of.
I have no idea why I can't make it all the way through the game. I like the ruleset, I like creating my party, and for a while I have a blast playing (except for the incredibly tedious intro section that is). But then out of nowhere I start losing interest and then boom, yet another failed playthrough. But I swear, one of these days (or years) I will manage to make it through the whole thing, if it's the last thing I do.
The story was blah. And who ever did the area work, I hope they didn't quit their day job, because they sucked. Which ruined my immersion with the game. Plus the areas were small compared to the vastness of the BG games and IWD.
I didn't mind the 3E rules, I enjoyed playing the subraces of elves and dwarves.
Its one of the IE games that I rarely replay and if I do, I usually don't play long.
No idea why either! It's the best IE game, the tactical gameplay is way more nuanced than in BG2, the story is p. much the best, and also it's super pretty.
Comments
And yes, the atmosphere is great, especially the first IWD.
BG is a much longer, layered story, but IWD certainly has one, and the role playing is what you make it, as in any RPG.
There is no CHARNAME in IWD as you don't have a main character. But you do have a party. And this party lacks a name. People do give parties names - like the Marauders of the Undermountain (is that right?) in the Helm and Cloak inn. In IWD2 there are the Iron Collar Mercenaries in Targos.
If there was a remake of these games I'd request a feature where you can name your party. And then some dialogue could actually refer to your group as though they've become a known entity.
BG games are plot-driven, with less dungeon-crawling.
As combat in D&D games are often extremely tedious and really simple, I feel that's why IWD games fall a little flat. Every fight for me degenerated into "lob more fireballs." Waves and waves and waves and waves of guys is not really fun when every last encounter is that way. Fighting an uber powerful wizard because he kidnapped my childhood friend and wants to steal my soul? I'll do that any day.
THAT SAID, I like IWD2 a lot. From a pure gameplay experience, it's the most challenging and dynamic IE game. You can't munchkin your character by rerolling til he is god-mode. Character creation is robust and dynamic. Combat is legitimately challenging because you're always just a crit away from your guy dying. You can't skip from a crappy regular weapon to a +3 katana that stuns people on hit just because you know where to get it.
I just find the setting extremely depressing, a city you can't escape, pretty much. Starts in a morgue, moves over to a dumpster, then a sewer, I guess. I love colors but most if not the entire game seems to be so brown and grey. Death, misery it feels overall anti-social. I mean, characters that wear giant razor blades on their armor, some even get pissed off if you try to talk to them, the Lady of Pain who I guess is Sigil's caretaker, hates attention too. There's characters who can't die, here and there and those who really wants to. Like Ignus love, hugs him and burns alive, just like that. No hesitation.
Nobody seems happy, I mean how could they be?
I like things that are different and alien, but I'm much more home in a silly, epic fantasy adventure.
OTOH, just to add to the Planescape comments -- I've played that game so many times that I'm amazed that there aren't holes burned into my CD-ROM copy. My favorite game ever...
Well, NWN2's ending is literally this.
I guess i was spoiled by BG2 and could not go back to the days of no party interaction like in the gold box AD&D games like pool of radiance etc
What kills the game for me about halfway through, such that I never care to finish it, is that it turns into a very tedious (to me), and no-fun series of huge, labyrinthine puzzle dungeons. (Throw this switch here, push this button on the other side of the labyrinth to open a door into a new labyrinth, figure out the exact sequence of levers to pull here, out of twelve levers (you *were* writing down all those clues scattered all over the labyrinth, that were not put into your journal, right?).
Were it not for the focus on puzzles, I would love IWD2. But it is a solve-the-puzzles game for its entire second half, and I can't stand it. So, I'll never finish it. For me, it's just no fun after the first few straightforward areas.
I loved the ability to create your entire party from the ground up. The advantages outweighed the cons, to me (and in some ways still do). Sure, the humor is lax and the story could be better, but I would recommend it to anyone and would dance a thousand times over if it were to become EE'd.
I personally find some restrictions of the 2E rules to be annoying and stifling, which is probably another reason while I adore IWD2 so much.
I didn't mind the 3E rules, I enjoyed playing the subraces of elves and dwarves.
Its one of the IE games that I rarely replay and if I do, I usually don't play long.