@rossbach451 If you're in Shadows of Amn, the Aerie wings talks don't have a specific chapter requirement. The recurring talks should start as soon as she's a high enough level to cast Regenerate (as a cleric) and the full NPC conversations require the NPCs to know specific spells as well.
It's also a 10 day timer between wing talks so it takes awhile even when she gets the spell.
I just wanted to log in (or make a new account really, though I thought I had an account already!) to say thank you for this quite elaborate and detailed mod!
I've been away from these games for several years, but something prompted me to return :-) I've been somewhat surprised (pleasantly!) to see that there is still a quite active modding community :-)
Though, I do have a single question:
I chose to let Bodhi join me in chapter 6. This had consequences in my party, to be sure, but my assassin was willing to oblige and adapt and at the end of SoA, I chose the option to let her change to her old elven self. I was quite pleased with the interaction between Bodhi and Ellesime in that segment. However, here is my issue; when my party is transported into ToB, she vanishes from the party in the Sacred Grove. She is there when the party enters the grove and TOB starts (with the elven portrait) but a few seconds later, she disappears with no warning, and all her equipment is on the ground. Is this normal? Is she meant to join you later?
@BenofAvalon Thank you very much. I'm glad you've been enjoying it.
For your question, I think that is intentional and she'll return later. But let me verify with @BCaesar since he did all the coding for that part of the mod.
I chose to let Bodhi join me in chapter 6. This had consequences in my party, to be sure, but my assassin was willing to oblige and adapt and at the end of SoA, I chose the option to let her change to her old elven self. I was quite pleased with the interaction between Bodhi and Ellesime in that segment. However, here is my issue; when my party is transported into ToB, she vanishes from the party in the Sacred Grove. She is there when the party enters the grove and TOB starts (with the elven portrait) but a few seconds later, she disappears with no warning, and all her equipment is on the ground. Is this normal? Is she meant to join you later?
She's supposed to talk to you at some point in the grove before you leave. What happens is the old Bodhi character vanishes and drops inventory and a new one is created who finds you and talks to you.
She should be at coordinates 743.427
I chose to let Bodhi join me in chapter 6. This had consequences in my party, to be sure, but my assassin was willing to oblige and adapt and at the end of SoA, I chose the option to let her change to her old elven self. I was quite pleased with the interaction between Bodhi and Ellesime in that segment. However, here is my issue; when my party is transported into ToB, she vanishes from the party in the Sacred Grove. She is there when the party enters the grove and TOB starts (with the elven portrait) but a few seconds later, she disappears with no warning, and all her equipment is on the ground. Is this normal? Is she meant to join you later?
She's supposed to talk to you at some point in the grove before you leave. What happens is the old Bodhi character vanishes and drops inventory and a new one is created who finds you and talks to you.
She should be at coordinates 743.427
Let me know if you still can't find her.
Yep, everything was as you said :-) If I had just continued my gameplay just a few moments more, I would have known that ;-) the reason I stopped playing where I did, was that I wanted to start a new playthrough of BG/SOA with another character/class/party setup, and then resume playing once I got to ToB with the new party :-)
So, thank you for the answer, and sorry for the inconvenience ;-)
I chose to let Bodhi join me in chapter 6. This had consequences in my party, to be sure, but my assassin was willing to oblige and adapt and at the end of SoA, I chose the option to let her change to her old elven self. I was quite pleased with the interaction between Bodhi and Ellesime in that segment. However, here is my issue; when my party is transported into ToB, she vanishes from the party in the Sacred Grove. She is there when the party enters the grove and TOB starts (with the elven portrait) but a few seconds later, she disappears with no warning, and all her equipment is on the ground. Is this normal? Is she meant to join you later?
She's supposed to talk to you at some point in the grove before you leave. What happens is the old Bodhi character vanishes and drops inventory and a new one is created who finds you and talks to you.
She should be at coordinates 743.427
Let me know if you still can't find her.
Yep, everything was as you said :-) If I had just continued my gameplay just a few moments more, I would have known that ;-) the reason I stopped playing where I did, was that I wanted to start a new playthrough of BG/SOA with another character/class/party setup, and then resume playing once I got to ToB with the new party :-)
So, thank you for the answer, and sorry for the inconvenience ;-)
All good. That's what this thread is for. Mostly I'm just relieved that it's working the way it was supposed to. I really didn't want to have to get a save to that point, and dig through old code trying to find the error.
At first we put new Bodhi near the bottom, but it was too easy to run up to the battle and miss her entirely. So now the way it is it's nearly impossible to avoid her.
Heh. If we'd ever bothered to make a proper guide to our mod for how to start all the different segments, we wouldn't get half so many questions. But that's too much work 😉
@Ratatoskr I am discovering your mod and starting to dig in the readme to gather some infos about install order and if it may fit to my next EET playthrough.
Let me resume what i understood to be sure i swim in the right direction:
- Install after major quest and NPC mods but before your tweaks (to help crossmod NPC content to work properly)
- Better after romance mods to avoid getting duplicate TOB epilogues.
- If you plan to use the NPC Flirtpack or any romance mod that adds Player-Initiated Dialogues for existing NPCs, you should install those after all other banter/romance mods.
- This mod doesn't match thematically with some listed mods...
Basically, part of my install order should be like that ? :
...
New Npcs mods and NPCs continuation mods
Npcs expansion mods (friendship / Romance / PID romance mods)
All Things Mazzy mod
Crossmod content IEP Extended Banters
Banter Pack
Crossmod Banter Pack for BG2
...
@Mordekaie
The order you listed there should work. Mod order isn't an exact science, but if you install AllThingsMazzy as the last of your romance mods, things should function fairly well.
My general install order goes:
Any non-Weidu mods
Major story/quest expansions
Item mods
New NPC mods (sometimes you have to fiddle with the order to get all the crossmod content installed)
Friendship and Romance mods (AllThingsMazzy can go last here)
Crossmod banter stuff
Class kit mods
Tweaks
I generally don't worry too much about mods with Player-Initiated Dialogues to start with. I just stick them toward the end of the NPC/Romance section depending on what kind of mod they are.
Just be aware that they can break the game if not coded with enough failsafes. So if you start getting endlessly repeating dialogue, that may be the cause.
Heh. If we'd ever bothered to make a proper guide to our mod for how to start all the different segments, we wouldn't get half so many questions. But that's too much work 😉
Questions are convenient. They keep the mod on the first page.
May they never cease. I can afford to take five minutes once a week and check back here.
Planning to include your mod in my "big" EET install. I will probably remove Mazzy Friendship.
The components 2-7 don't appear on Project Infinity. Does it mean that they are included in "0 - All Things Mazzy" and will be automatically installed ?
2. Keepable Clara (Human Hexxat) NPC: A mod to rescue Clara from Hexxat and have her join your party.
3. Darkside Anomen: An expansion for Evil Anomen
4. Minsc-Neera Romance
5. Flying Aerie
6. Dorn-HaerDalis Romance
7. Jaheira-Wilson Romance
I played through soa and tob with both and did not encounter any issue, nor would I expect to. The two really have nothing to do with each other except that they both feature aerie.
@Mordekaie To be honest, I have no idea how our mod is listed on Project Infinity. While our mod code should work with EET, I didn't make that listing so I can't speak to the details.
That said, parts 1-7 in the first page listing are all part of the default mod. Installing them isn't optional, though you can choose not to do them in game. So all of those should be included in any ATM install as long as Project Infinity has the most updated version of the mod.
As for "wings", if Fishmalk_1 played through both, they'll be the expert here Neither @BCaesar nor I have played through the newer mods for BG2EE and that's not one I had installed while coding ATM.
Project Infinity parses the tp2 and generates the list of mod components at mod selection from it's download folder. It's not like BWS which supplies external descriptions and metadata for components and only able to work with mod (component)s it was prepared for.
But if Project Infinity just lists the components based on the tp2 file, then sections 1-7 should definitely be in its main "All Things Mazzy" component. There's some additional content in ForTheGood and ForTheEvil for some of those sections, but the majority is in the base mod.
Planning to include your mod in my "big" EET install. I will probably remove Mazzy Friendship.
The components 2-7 don't appear on Project Infinity. Does it mean that they are included in "0 - All Things Mazzy" and will be automatically installed ?
2. Keepable Clara (Human Hexxat) NPC: A mod to rescue Clara from Hexxat and have her join your party.
3. Darkside Anomen: An expansion for Evil Anomen
4. Minsc-Neera Romance
5. Flying Aerie
6. Dorn-HaerDalis Romance
7. Jaheira-Wilson Romance
I'm thinking that if you install "All Things Mazzy" that should install all those things as that's the way our mod is set up. We don't make any of those things optional installs, they're just optional to do in game (there's options to turn them off in the dialogue shortly after they start)
Then if you install "For the Evil" and "For the Good" it'll install more things.
For the Evil is optional because parts of it are possibly disturbing, but as long as that's not an issue install it.
For the Good is optional because it's mostly Mazzy and your other good characters objecting to you doing evil things and trying to kill you and that's annoying if you like to do bad things. So if you're planning an evil party then don't install it. Otherwise it just adds more content. For the Good is strange since if you're good you won't see most of it and if you're evil you won't want to install it. I wrote and coded it all in a fit of insanity. .
First of all, I want to say that I very much enjoy the Mod, the contents to which it provides (especially Clara and her characteristics) and thank you for making it.
That being said, I have a bit problem with the timer for Clara to chat with everyone. In my game, it took very long for her to chat with the members in the team and it happened so random. There was one time that Clara talked to Aerie, but I messed up the run and had to reload. Upon reloading, the dialogue never happened again. The other time when she opened up to Rasaad, it took like around 15 days ingame (when I first recruited him) for the first dialogue to happen (which seemed to happen with Aerie that occurred roughly 10 days after Aerie was recruited).
My question is: is it usually to take that long for Clara to trigger dialogues with the rest of the cast? Or will the romance between her and Anomen take higher priority over other dialogues with party members?
To answer your question, the vast majority of Clara's dialogue with other NPCs is coded as banters, which means there is no set timer for when it occurs. Banters run off the game's own internal banter timer, which triggers talks pretty much randomly. It's entirely possible for a specific banter to trigger in one run of the game and then not trigger until the end in another.
This is different than how the main Anomen-Clara dialogue is coded, which does occur on a set schedule and at certain points in game. The one doesn't triggering doesn't affect the other.
If you want to see more banters, about the only thing you can do is install one of the banter accelerators, which speed up how often the game triggers the check. That makes them more common, though it doesn't affect the randomness. I think the Gibberlings3 Tweaks mod includes a banter accelerator among others.
@Ratatoskr
Thank you for answering my questions. I'm glad that it is the way it was coded and not some game bugs coming from me tinkering mods around that might have messed up the game (currently I'm having a problem with extra dialogues of Jaheira and Hexxat's dialogues being Invalid with tag numbers).
@RinWickwit Ah, yeah, the invalid issue can happen if you uninstall/install mods and then load an existing save. The string numbers get disconnected. That's a quirk of the game structure itself, generally not specific to any one mod.
But banters are their own special beast and the timing on them shouldn't be affected by tinkering. We've got everything coded with as much backup as possible so that it's hard for conversations to simply break entirely. It's probably still possible, but we did our best to make it foolproof
Whelp, Beamdog decided to crash while I was making an update to this mod and deleted 90% of the first post.... I'll get it back up, but it may take me a little bit.
On the bright side, it now appears to be allowing me to upload the entire zipped mod to this thread again.
All righty, Wayback Machine is a beautiful beautiful thing and totally saved my hide on this one. The main difference in this version is the addition of an optional portrait for Mazzy, courtesy of Edvin. Who may also be doing another translation for this mod at some point.
I love this mod and am thinking of using it again in a future run (I've used it twice before). However, I have a small question about the installation order (I think I know the answer, but I just want to confirm).
The Read Me states:
"We recommend installing the mod after major quest and NPC mods but before your tweaks. [...]
- HOWEVER, if you plan to use the NPC Flirtpack or any romance mod that adds Player-Initiated Dialogues for existing NPCs, you should install those after all other banter/romance mods."
So ATM should be installed *before* the NPC Flirtpack, right? (Again, I just want to confirm I'm not misreading this somehow.)
@Thrasymachus Glad to hear you're still enjoying this mod 😄🙏
To answer your question, that's correct. AllThingsMazzy should be installed before the NPC flirtpack and any other mod with player initiated dialogues. It's possible for PIDs to be coded so that they don't hijack other mod triggers, but it's generally best if mods with PIDs are installed last just to be safe. Otherwise you can end up stuck in dialogue loops.
@Endarire I don't have a detailed list of every mod and install order is more of an art than a science, to be honest. If a mod mentions player initiated dialogues, install it after ATM is pretty much the best advice I can give.
You'd also want to install ATM after any mod we list crossmod content for. Otherwise, that content may not be installed.
@Endarire Player-initiated dialogues are a specific type of NPC dialogue where you can manually click talk on an NPC in your party and start a conversation. Hence, player-initiated. They show up most often in romance mods, and they'll usually be mentioned in the ReadMe or mod details if they exist.
Comments
Thanks!
I've been away from these games for several years, but something prompted me to return :-) I've been somewhat surprised (pleasantly!) to see that there is still a quite active modding community :-)
Though, I do have a single question:
For your question, I think that is intentional and she'll return later. But let me verify with @BCaesar since he did all the coding for that part of the mod.
She should be at coordinates 743.427
Let me know if you still can't find her.
Yep, everything was as you said :-) If I had just continued my gameplay just a few moments more, I would have known that ;-) the reason I stopped playing where I did, was that I wanted to start a new playthrough of BG/SOA with another character/class/party setup, and then resume playing once I got to ToB with the new party :-)
So, thank you for the answer, and sorry for the inconvenience ;-)
All good. That's what this thread is for. Mostly I'm just relieved that it's working the way it was supposed to. I really didn't want to have to get a save to that point, and dig through old code trying to find the error.
At first we put new Bodhi near the bottom, but it was too easy to run up to the battle and miss her entirely. So now the way it is it's nearly impossible to avoid her.
Let me resume what i understood to be sure i swim in the right direction:
- Install after major quest and NPC mods but before your tweaks (to help crossmod NPC content to work properly)
- Better after romance mods to avoid getting duplicate TOB epilogues.
- If you plan to use the NPC Flirtpack or any romance mod that adds Player-Initiated Dialogues for existing NPCs, you should install those after all other banter/romance mods.
- This mod doesn't match thematically with some listed mods...
Basically, part of my install order should be like that ? :
...
New Npcs mods and NPCs continuation mods
Npcs expansion mods (friendship / Romance / PID romance mods)
All Things Mazzy mod
Crossmod content
IEP Extended Banters
Banter Pack
Crossmod Banter Pack for BG2
...
I am quite confused at the moment ...:)
The order you listed there should work. Mod order isn't an exact science, but if you install AllThingsMazzy as the last of your romance mods, things should function fairly well.
My general install order goes:
Any non-Weidu mods
Major story/quest expansions
Item mods
New NPC mods (sometimes you have to fiddle with the order to get all the crossmod content installed)
Friendship and Romance mods (AllThingsMazzy can go last here)
Crossmod banter stuff
Class kit mods
Tweaks
I generally don't worry too much about mods with Player-Initiated Dialogues to start with. I just stick them toward the end of the NPC/Romance section depending on what kind of mod they are.
Just be aware that they can break the game if not coded with enough failsafes. So if you start getting endlessly repeating dialogue, that may be the cause.
Questions are convenient. They keep the mod on the first page.
May they never cease. I can afford to take five minutes once a week and check back here.
The components 2-7 don't appear on Project Infinity. Does it mean that they are included in "0 - All Things Mazzy" and will be automatically installed ?
2. Keepable Clara (Human Hexxat) NPC: A mod to rescue Clara from Hexxat and have her join your party.
3. Darkside Anomen: An expansion for Evil Anomen
4. Minsc-Neera Romance
5. Flying Aerie
6. Dorn-HaerDalis Romance
7. Jaheira-Wilson Romance
Any issue between "5. Flying Aerie" and Wings ? https://www.gibberlings3.net/forums/topic/33687-wings-bg2ee-mod-v100/
I played through soa and tob with both and did not encounter any issue, nor would I expect to. The two really have nothing to do with each other except that they both feature aerie.
That said, parts 1-7 in the first page listing are all part of the default mod. Installing them isn't optional, though you can choose not to do them in game. So all of those should be included in any ATM install as long as Project Infinity has the most updated version of the mod.
As for "wings", if Fishmalk_1 played through both, they'll be the expert here
But if Project Infinity just lists the components based on the tp2 file, then sections 1-7 should definitely be in its main "All Things Mazzy" component. There's some additional content in ForTheGood and ForTheEvil for some of those sections, but the majority is in the base mod.
I'm thinking that if you install "All Things Mazzy" that should install all those things as that's the way our mod is set up. We don't make any of those things optional installs, they're just optional to do in game (there's options to turn them off in the dialogue shortly after they start)
Then if you install "For the Evil" and "For the Good" it'll install more things.
For the Evil is optional because parts of it are possibly disturbing, but as long as that's not an issue install it.
For the Good is optional because it's mostly Mazzy and your other good characters objecting to you doing evil things and trying to kill you and that's annoying if you like to do bad things. So if you're planning an evil party then don't install it. Otherwise it just adds more content. For the Good is strange since if you're good you won't see most of it and if you're evil you won't want to install it. I wrote and coded it all in a fit of insanity.
That being said, I have a bit problem with the timer for Clara to chat with everyone. In my game, it took very long for her to chat with the members in the team and it happened so random. There was one time that Clara talked to Aerie, but I messed up the run and had to reload. Upon reloading, the dialogue never happened again. The other time when she opened up to Rasaad, it took like around 15 days ingame (when I first recruited him) for the first dialogue to happen (which seemed to happen with Aerie that occurred roughly 10 days after Aerie was recruited).
My question is: is it usually to take that long for Clara to trigger dialogues with the rest of the cast? Or will the romance between her and Anomen take higher priority over other dialogues with party members?
I'm glad you enjoy the Clara portion of it mod.
To answer your question, the vast majority of Clara's dialogue with other NPCs is coded as banters, which means there is no set timer for when it occurs. Banters run off the game's own internal banter timer, which triggers talks pretty much randomly. It's entirely possible for a specific banter to trigger in one run of the game and then not trigger until the end in another.
This is different than how the main Anomen-Clara dialogue is coded, which does occur on a set schedule and at certain points in game. The one doesn't triggering doesn't affect the other.
If you want to see more banters, about the only thing you can do is install one of the banter accelerators, which speed up how often the game triggers the check. That makes them more common, though it doesn't affect the randomness. I think the Gibberlings3 Tweaks mod includes a banter accelerator among others.
Thank you for answering my questions. I'm glad that it is the way it was coded and not some game bugs coming from me tinkering mods around that might have messed up the game (currently I'm having a problem with extra dialogues of Jaheira and Hexxat's dialogues being Invalid with tag numbers).
But banters are their own special beast and the timing on them shouldn't be affected by tinkering. We've got everything coded with as much backup as possible so that it's hard for conversations to simply break entirely. It's probably still possible, but we did our best to make it foolproof
On the bright side, it now appears to be allowing me to upload the entire zipped mod to this thread again.
The Read Me states:
"We recommend installing the mod after major quest and NPC mods but before your tweaks. [...]
- HOWEVER, if you plan to use the NPC Flirtpack or any romance mod that adds Player-Initiated Dialogues for existing NPCs, you should install those after all other banter/romance mods."
So ATM should be installed *before* the NPC Flirtpack, right? (Again, I just want to confirm I'm not misreading this somehow.)
To answer your question, that's correct. AllThingsMazzy should be installed before the NPC flirtpack and any other mod with player initiated dialogues. It's possible for PIDs to be coded so that they don't hijack other mod triggers, but it's generally best if mods with PIDs are installed last just to be safe. Otherwise you can end up stuck in dialogue loops.
You'd also want to install ATM after any mod we list crossmod content for. Otherwise, that content may not be installed.
What do you mean by "player initiated dialog?" Properly understanding that would help many.
Thankee!