Importing Old Custom Model into NWNE Need a Bit of Help Please

GruffbaneJoe

I'm trying to import some old models into NWNE.
This is an old model I made in blender from the c_balu.mdl model in the original CEP.

In 2.65 this model is called zcp_balu.mdl, but when I changed the name of my modified version to zcp_balu.mdl and imported it, nothing happened.
I tried instead to import it with the model name of an Ancient Black Dragon. This time it worked but I get this strange crystalline texture.

So I imported it as an Invisible Creature, hoping I could use the "tail tints" to give it a skin. I got the same crystalline type of texture, as you can see in the pic below.

Maybe I accidentally hit a button in Blender that keeps it from being skinned?

Any help highly appreciated.

I am basically trying to have an Elasmotherium in-game. instead of or in addition to having a Baluchatherium.

People actually met the Elasmotherium in the Paleolithic Period, and anyway I think it's cooler because of the unicorn horn.

[Deleted User]

In appearance.2da and tailmodel.2da, under the ENVMAP column, is it set to "default" - if so, try changing it to "****" in both 2das.

GruffbaneJoe

I changed it in the appearance.2da, it was already **** in the tailmodel.2da Still nothing, but thanks for trying.

GruffbaneJoe

If you look closely you can see how it is taking a different texture on the right front hoof and the little giraffe horns on the models head. Is it just because the creature is Huge and so its only covering part of it? The replaced CEP model Invis_CreatureL_010 was set to huge in the 2da, as well as the source model zcp_balu. And of course it's the same size as zcp_balu...

[Deleted User]

Hard to say without having the model to play around with. Could be the bitmap reference is wrong - that'll cause that too.

GruffbaneJoe

I could upload it to the vault if you want to play around with it

GruffbaneJoe

Here's the google drive url, permissions should be open for download. ..let me know if you have any problems. https://drive.google.com/open?id=11G6-6UGdRGFGCSXnwOzVHnPSWd02EAJ4

GruffbaneJoe

Where is the bitmap ref contained? How can I find out if it's wrong?

[Deleted User]

The bitmap reference is inside the mdl file. Open it with a text editor and do a search for "bitmap." Each object in the model will have a bitmap reference that points to the texture it uses. If the texture doesn't exist in the game, the engine renders a metallic looking empty texture.

In any event, I've got the model. I'll see what's up with it.

[Deleted User]

OK, your texture name - "BronzeCopper0086_1_S" - is too long. The engine will not read texture names beyond 16 characters. Thus, it is only reading "BronzeCopper0086" and when it doesn't find it, it applies the metallic empty rendering you see in the screenshot you posted.

[Deleted User]

The colored foot and "giraffe" horns was caused by the "ambient" and "diffuse" parameters not being set to "1.0 1.0 1.0."

Here is a screenshot of the creature in the toolset with a dummy texture I named "c_balu." As you can see, with the correct texture name and the ambient and diffuse set to "1.0 1.0 1.0" on all mdl objects, the model renders correctly.

[Deleted User]

Found another issue. The model's animation scale - "SetAnimationScale" - was set to "3.4" This should be set to "1.0" for a model that uses "NULL" as its "SetSupModel."

Here is a link to a "fixed" version of the model.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1t54BbekX6o_OuSQfdpaI93cOtZ01VdBI/view?usp=sharing

Also, it is not a good habit to change the filename of a mdl file without also changing the mdl file's internal name references as well. This can cause errors in the game.

GruffbaneJoe

Thanks so much for the help! I understand what you mean about the parameters now, but I'm still having trouble with some of the other instructions.

You said "Here is a screenshot of the creature in the toolset with a dummy texture I named "c_balu."

Where did you name it "C_balu?" Inside the .mdl? I understand that the engine can now read the texture name, but where does it then look for it? Do I need to import a separate texture file instead of using one that already exists in the game?

Sorry I'm sooo rusty and never was very good at this before...

I also don't quite understand what this means :

"Also, it is not a good habit to change the filename of a mdl file without also changing the mdl file's internal name references as well. This can cause errors in the game"

Should I just make a new creature in the appearances .2da on a new line, instead of trying to import it in to replace invis_creature_10?

I imported your model but its still showing up with the metallic texture. I still have the .2da reference changed to "****" instead of "default," could that be it?

Thanks again!

[Deleted User]

See this example TXT file - I marked up pertinent lines that should answer all your question. You'll need a copy of Textpad to see the formatting displayed correctly.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1s45YOv-VPwXlWL471rOymt50x-bfxij0/view?usp=sharing

GruffbaneJoe

Thanks for this, it's making things much clearer. However, I'm still having problems. I changed the name of the model you sent me back to c_balu and added it in the appearances.2da, making sure all the data matched up. It shows up right before zcp_balu in my toolset's appearances list now, but without texture or color. All of the info pertaining to mesh and color looks good on the .mdl, and the same exact model with the same exact data shows up fine in your module...so I don't get it.

[Deleted User]

If the internal bitmap reference has a corresponding texture than it should be textured in the game. Are you sure the bitmap reference in the MDL file is pointing to the correct texture (I assume c_balu)?

GruffbaneJoe

Here is the original appearances entry for zcp_balu:

:
05 "Baluchitherium* (CCP)" **** Baluchitherium zcp_balu **** R S 1 1 1 1 NORM 6 8 3 3 1 3.4 4.2 H 0 13 1 0 po_balu 5 9 1 2 1 60 30 Tri_head 0 1


Here's the one for my new creature:

9999 "Baluchitherium* (CCP)" **** Baluchitherium c_balu **** R S 1 1 1 1 NORM 6 8 3 3 1 3.4 4.2 H 0 13 1 0 po_balu 5 9 1 2 1 60 30 Tri_head 0 1


I'm using the model you sent me, unchanged except for the file name (now correctly named c_balu.mdl).

I'm pouring over it, comparing the model to the example you provided, but it just doesn't make any sense why this thing shouldn't be working.

GruffbaneJoe

OH! I bet the CEP renamed the bitmap to zcp_balu !
I don't know where to find bitmaps in NWNE, but I'm going to try and change the ref to zcp_balu in the mdl to that and see what happens.

GruffbaneJoe

Actually I do know how...extract zcp_balu from the CEP and open in notepad, see what the bitmap ref is.
Maybe I'm catching on....

GruffbaneJoe

Oh wait, the new version (CEP's zcp_balu) is in binary.
Or is it "not-binary?' Anyway, they've changed it to the kind of .mdl you can't read with notepad.
Maybe this is part of the problem?
Could I just change the fie name and all parent, bitmap, etc references inside it to zcp_balu and then convert it?
Or should I convert the CEP's version and see what they use for the bitmap?

(just changing the bitmap ref to zcp_balu didn't work, so I guess they've changed it to who knows what)

[Deleted User]

If its binary, its compiled. You need to decompile it. In NWN Explorer, click on zcp_balu in the cep hak, click ASCII in the window under the viewport, then click EXPORT up on the top toolbar and click EXPORT TEXT. It'll create a TXT file you can read.

You can also scroll through the text in NWN Explorer and just look at the bitmap reference.

You can get NWN Explorer from here - you want v1.81

https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/76541/tools-nwn-explorer-1-8

GruffbaneJoe

I haven't been able to get NWN explorer to work with NWNE. I've downloaded several versions that say they work with NWNE, but none tell you where to put the exe file. I keep getting error messages about unexpected file locations. I've only been able to use the NWhak in the Utils section of the official download.

GruffbaneJoe

I put it in the data folder with the dialogue.tlk and the key file like you say in the thread but I still get "Unable to find dialogue.tlk and blahblahblah.key in the expected location. Please go to file options and select a location."
But when I click on "File" in the upper left there's no "Options" on the tab.

[Deleted User]

That thread is obsolete as Virusman has fixed the issue with it not being able to set and store the file path. The latest version can go anywhere. I put all my utilities in \Documents\Neverwinter Nights\utils - you'll have to create the \utils folder.

Here's a copy of NWN Explorer v1.81 from my PC. Extract it to the \Neverwinter Nights folder in \Documents - it'll create a folder called \utils with another folder inside it called \NWN Explorer.

If you have the Steam version of NWN, it should work without any need to set the file path under File>Options. If you have the Beamdog version, you'll have to set the file path to the game files under File>Options.

I don't have the Beamdog version installed, so I'm not sure what the path is to the game files.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/14LQkeYeB5c44z1CYDwRWYlRMTgZzR4mI/view?usp=sharing

GruffbaneJoe

I think the Beamdog version may be the problem. In the NWexplorer options, it says "Look for NWN in the specified location."
Well, there is no NWN folder in the Beamdog Version. The path to the game files goes "User>Beamdog Library>00785

In 00785 the bin, data, lang, ovr, and utilities files can be found.

GruffbaneJoe

Ok I changed the name 00785 to NWN and it works!

However, I dont have an Export Text option. Up top under resources it has an Export Button, but nothing else. If I right click on the .mdl file I get a choice between exporting it or exporting .tga, but no text option.

GruffbaneJoe

Correction: I DO have an EXPORT TEXT OPTION, but it is not lit up (won't click) for this particular model, or any of the others with the zcp_ prefix. They are definitely binary though because if you click on any of them with notepad you get complete gibberish.

[Deleted User]

Check out the screenshot...

GruffbaneJoe

OK that worked! The bitmap names on zcp_balu are all ccp_tri. However, I replaced the bitmap names in c_balu with ccp_tri and got this:



This is getting ridiculous. The CEP team must have changed a hundred things between c_balu and zcp_balu.
I guess it would be easier to just re-learn blender modeling and put a horn on zcp_balu.

Your patience has been amazing.

GruffbaneJoe

When you chose a dummy bitmap for it on your toolset, did you do it in GMax? Or how did you know it would work? No bitmap I can find works, although one of them (c_sbrtooth?) put a skin on the torso.
What dummy bitmap did you use, and did you have to manually enter it in all the instances the c_balu mdl asks for a bitmap or will GMax do it for you?
Thanks so much again!

[Deleted User]

All I did was copy a tga fur texture I had, changed its name to c_balu, opened the mdl file in a text editor and changed all the bitmap references to c_balu. Then I dropped the mdl and tga files in the /override folder.

I know a lot of people on here will cringe at this, but get yourself a copy of gMax - its free and a hell of lot simpler than Blender. It runs fine under Windows and will do everything you need for NWN modeling. You'll also need a copy of gMax Plus - Michael Darkangel's version of NWgMax import scripts.

In gMax, you can drag a texture directly into the viewport onto an object, then use either the UVWMap or UnWrap UVW modifier to skin it. If you use UVWMap, check "box" under the map type. There are also a ton of written documentation for gMax and more than a few dinosaurs such as myself that are more than glad to help you.

Before you go further down the modeling rabbit-hole, you might want to read these:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ZHNMybkSNkXM4hSbwCGeGZiv2hmljBhu/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1vC1dKZyyzprB1s9pQb6lh4WXENHJBt6W/view?usp=sharing


Both are files I put together to document my experiences with NWN and various tools. Since you are using EE, you'll want to look at NWN Miscellany EE first as it has info pertinent to Windows 10 and EE. The other document is an older version written for Windows 7/8 and NWN 1.69. For tools you'll need, use the links in the NWN Miscellany EE.