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What are your favorite class synergies for party or favorite solos and why?

NeoNeo Member Posts: 127
edited November 2019 in Baldur's Gate II: Enhanced Edition
So I've played BG1 several times (vanilla a long time ago, EE over the last couple of years), did 1 SoD playthrough, 1 IWD EE playthrough and am currently doing my 2nd BG2 playthrough.

There are still some kits or classes I haven't played around with but I've tested and know a bit about most of the ones that I was most curious about.


For example, in my current playthrough, I have a Darkmoon Monk (charname), Archer, Shaman, Wizard Slayer, Fighter/Thief, Inquisitor (Keldorn). I have no arcane caster which makes some things a bit weaker at times (no haste/improved haste, mass improved invis, breach, etc.). I'm still liking this party so far overall. The shaman is my only healer/support. I try to go lighter on buffs and magic this time around, use Keldorn's Dispell Magic a lot more and have a lot of physical damage. The synergy and idea is to dispell stuff, have the Wizard Slayer and Insect Swarms from the shaman neutralize enemy casters and win with brute force.


I love AOE damage spells but aside from late game Abi Dalzim in BG2 (not party friendly in IWD) or maybe some of the HLAs, I can't remember too well, I often was very limited using those (Skull Traps, fireballs, lightning, clouds, etc.) because I often had at least 2-3 melee based characters. This led to my Sorcerer or Mage often ending up mostly buffing the party, debuffing enemies and dispelling enemy defenses with occasional damage output which I wasn't too happy about. Have some of you come up with interesting party compositions where you can often blow up enemies with AOEs? I was thinking maybe only 1 front line and some other ranged classes like Archers?

What are some of your favorite party setups or even just 1-2 classes that synergize well together that aren't a typical "balanced" party (tank/healer/mage/thief)? For example, Shaman (or Druid)'s fireseed having some high synergy potential with Wizard Slayer as the AOE seed can apply his debuff.

What about solo? I know most people prise the Kensai/Mage or Sorcerer. Do you have to avoid several situations or enemies when soloing (depite leveling faster, there are many situations in BG2 that even with a full party, I'm sometimes missing some key abilities that would help a lot or be needed, sorcerers grow in power but might struggle vs magic immunities or only have sword summons for physical damage).
Post edited by Neo on

Comments

  • NeoNeo Member Posts: 127
    edited November 2019
    That's an interesting composition. For free action, my Monk (Darkmoon but I'm pretty sure every monk gets it) can't be slowed although it may not apply to web (but he has crazy magic resistance already at lvl 18 he's at 94% but I'm using ring of Kangaxx that gives +10, amulet + 5 and a mod allowed me to recoved my old Cloak of Balduran which adds an other 25) so that should be good enough for it.

    I didn't realize cloudkill was a poison and that poison immunities would make them unaffected by it. Not having an arcane caster right now, I can't use cloudkill anyways but I'll keep that in mind for a future playthrough for sure.

    As for the heavy thief composition, it's mostly for the HLA? My F/T is turning out to be a much better damage dealer than I had expected her to be. Her backstabs are strong (x5 dmg reached now) and her lower THAC0 than Keldorn and my Wizard Slayer doesn't seem to be hurting her that much so far. She's also using 2 of the strongest +3 weapons in the game (katana that stuns and the one that adds an extra attack) but I think those will not work anymore later on in the game in which case I plan on using staff of the Ram or putting points into warhammers or longswords. However, I feel like I've reached my maximum thief combat potential by now (lvl 13+) as I have the maximum backstab bonus and good enough HiS/MS at 100+, 100 find traps and unlock, spending extra points into setting traps now but I don't think I'll use that much. I'm thinking that going to thief up to lvl 12-13 and then dual to fighter would have been stronger in the end for extra weapon points and better THAC0 (couldn't get half-orc 19 str but some items might overcome that late game anyways).
  • Humanoid_TaifunHumanoid_Taifun Member Posts: 1,063
    @Neo The combat potential of the thief is not in direct combat. Traps are effective against just about everyone. Later you will get Time [Stop] Traps and Spike Traps. The former will allow you to slash at helpless enemies, while the latter deal damage on the same level as level 9 wizard spells, except they do physical damage and cannot be defended against with elemental or magic resistance. A high level thief has exceptional survival abilities and can even function as a wizard, donning the Robe of Vecna and casting from spell scrolls. Between scouting, kiting, backstabbing, trapping, and using whichever item will get the job done, a high level thief is a party unto herself.
  • NeoNeo Member Posts: 127
    I never really used the traps, don't I need to set them up somewhere and try to lure melee enemies to step over it (I fail to see how it can be that useful in most combat situations unless you know where the enemy will spawn and can set it up in advance in certain situations). I guess I'll see how good these things are late game, I didn't have that Use All Items in my last playthrough I think.
  • Humanoid_TaifunHumanoid_Taifun Member Posts: 1,063
    If enemies are within your line of sight (even if they are invisible to you), you cannot hide in Shadows or set traps. So in a straight-forward battle traps are not very useful.
    As I said, thieves do not really go for straight-forward battle. If all you want to do is click on the enemy and watch your goon swing their weapon at them, you would be better served with a pure fighter.

    One of the problems with using a thief effectively is that it changes the way your entire party engages the enemy. That is why many players have to consciously force themselves to play thieves before they can unlock the profession's potential. The thief could scout the enemy then go elsewhere and set up traps for them and lure them in, but if your main group then directly charges the enemy, and never gives them a reason to follow the thief into his ambush spot, the traps will end up useless.
    On the other hand, if you lead your party to that ambush spot, then you can open the fight with traps and then attack the weakened enemy with a concentrated effort.
    If you go further and first divide the enemy group into individuals by carefully kiting them away from each other, then you can lead each one of them into such an ambush and give none of them a chance of even fighting back.

    The second problem with using thieves is that you technically do not need your party for this. So it is very easy to forget about the rest of your group while you are murdering the enemy forces one by one.
    I think the best way to counteract this problem is to form teams fully dedicated to this style of combat. I am tempted to try a game with a party of: Stalker, Thief/Illusionist, Assassin, Shadowdancer, Cleric/Thief and Bounty Hunter-Fighter, or something similar. Next time maybe.
  • NeoNeo Member Posts: 127
    edited November 2019
    I see, maybe my party isn't ideal for this and playing on Core Rules also might make the encounters too easy for this to be needed right now. I did all or most of the quests in chapter 2 along with most quests from party members you can add so I might have strong gear and items for where I'm at in the game right now (about to go to city of caverns). Every encounter is overkill, I don't even really need my shaman at all, I mostly just use her to heal back 1-2 party members after an encounter if they've taken a hit during a fight. I don't really need to use summons, potions or anything. My monk alone could solo most of the content, Keldorn's dispell magic can take care of most of the casters. I can just easily overpower the enemies with the F/T backstab into double katanas, Keldorn, Wizard Slayer, Darkmoon Monk and Archer (previous playthrough was with heavy magic users).

    I might give a party built around thieves for traps like what you suggested above more an other time. Otherwise, I'm guessing the need for these traps and ambushes might be more for if I want to try playing on the harder difficulties or if I want to try to solo the game with a thief variant because right now, there isn't much point for me to set all of this up when I can just go in and explode the enemies with a few swings while resisting their spells due to high magic resistance (monk is currently at 97% at lvl 19).
  • NeoNeo Member Posts: 127
    That party from the previous comment is close to what I'm running right now except that I'm heavier on melee and have 6 characters (Darkmoon Monk, Wizard Slayer, Inquisitor, F/T, Archer, Shaman). The monk doesn't really need buffs later on (I ocasionally will use the Darkmoon Kit's Blur and Mirror Images but it's not a must have and the +2 frost dmg per hit isn't that big of a deal if it were to get dispelled later on, more useful in BG1 where the Monk is weak and has much lower fist damage).

    I haven't messed around with the AI stuff, I only toggled it off because I disliked it but I could look into what it does.

    I'm curious about Stalker and did like Valygar or whatever his name was when I picked him up shortly to do his quest in Act 2. The only thing was that I already had a F/T which was quite similar and my F/T could also get rid of traps and unlock stuff on top of getting a stronger backstab. So I'm still not quite sure I fully understand the role or advantages of having a Stalker aside from early game maybe (compared to a F/T or a Dual F/T class). It confuses me a bit that it is in the ranger category as I always thought that meant he was supposed to be more of a ranged character. I realize now that the Ranger category was probably more based around rangers like in LOTR where they can also fight well in melee, it's just that most games nowaday ranger = archer. The item mod I have also transfers some SoD items onto the vendor and there are some really nice Stalker gloves that give some bonuses, one of which is +1 backstab multiplier (I think it's still 1 behind the thief when maxed out if I remember well or else it was just that you get max backstab damage at lvl 17+ while thief gets theirs at lvl 13+ but I'm not sure anymore).

    My shaman does feel like it's becoming more and more a dead weight (she's close to lvl 17). The most important utility spells she's got are negative plane protection and death ward. For level drain, I already have 3 items (mace of disruption, amulet, headpiece from killing the shadow dragon) and the spell's duration is short so I'm not even sure I really needed her for that. Some of my other party members still got level drained a few times, she can't restaure it but I can use the scrolls that I bought. Death ward, I haven't really needed so far, my Monk has 100% magic resistance, Keldorn's resistance is also above 50% and the saving throws are starting to get good, maybe I'll need it eventually (I only have the Drow city left to do in Underdark right now). Otherwise, the lvl5 insect plague and lvl7 creeping doom are decent vs casters but most of the time might be overkill or not truly needed for my party. Her shaman dance is useless, especially since I already have 4 melee characters. Her fire elemental summons are alright but I never truly need them. So the only thing I truly use her for is healing after fights but I've got around 180 potions of extra healing and can often sleep so maybe I could do without her.

    I'm just curious though as to how to handle healing without a Cleric, Druid or Shaman (at least in BG1). Druid in IWD was better than in BG1-2 and I liked the greater werewolf form (it was cool but unfortunately the THAC0 was too weak for it to be truly effective in melee and the damage was decent but not scaling and still about half of what my Undead Hunter and Berserker were doing), still I'm not enjoying the clerics/druid/shaman so much. Maybe I just don't know how to play them right but if I could manage to not need one on my next playthrough, it could be nice. I'm just way too conservative with my consumables and end up hoarding them, maybe I underestimate the use of more healing potions and you need to sleep more often?
  • AerakarAerakar Member Posts: 1,052
    @JGP how would you equip an assassin as an alternate above? Tuigan?
  • JGPJGP Member Posts: 26
    edited November 2019
    Aerakar wrote: »
    @JGP how would you equip an assassin as an alternate above? Tuigan?

    Yep, only way to go, which is a pity because the Archer with Tuigan is the best casting interrupter period. I really lament the Assassin implementation and could go on at length about it, but here's the bottom line: You only need HALF of a thief in the entire saga, as little as 5 Swashbuckler levels dualled to fighter will do it. A full thief is a waste of a slot and to really build it out you need to devote those limited (esp for Assassin) resources to stealth, gimping the necessary find traps and open locks. So another thief in the party? AAAAUGH. As noted in a million other posts, that backstab goes down in usefulness as the multiplier grows and when it does work a fair share of that inflated attack evaporates into the ether as the target is already dead. THEN a brute clubs your assassin over the head and you have to micromanage some sort of invis and get out of melee. It makes me want to cry.

    EDIT: I didn't mean to imply in the above that an Assassin in my party uses his thievery points for stealth or even bothers with backstab. It was just rantish griping.

    Don't get me wrong on Thieves - there are plenty of flavor parties to be built full of rogue-ish goodness where that Assassin scores a crit against a big bad and validates the entire run, but in the context of a back row bowman like my mage slayers, the best he will ever do is use his poison to keep a caster from getting off spells while your other chars are disabled or occupied in a multiple target fight. I'll buy my Fighter/Thief some poison arrows and use my imagination. ;)

    @Neo: You may have inferred by now that I think the Stalker is the real Assassin in the game, but you make a valid point in comparing his role to that of a Fighter/Thief. The prob is that a F/T is across the board worse at the tasks of the lead role in the party. First, the Stalker is the best at stealth right out of the box and a F/T must spend all his thief points just to keep up. Points in find traps, open locks AND stealth? You're just bad at all of em. Second, full THAC0 and HP, the F/T never catches up. Thirdly, the best dual wielder that can both hide and backstab. Those extra pips make a difference, believe me, esp early, mid-game BG2 when you don't have mace yet. If you want to add an exotic for flavor, a katana for example, you've got to give up something else. A Fighter can be a better slicer/dicer, a Shadowdancer a better sneak, an Assassin the best backstabber, but you want to have all those things? Stalker.

    Finally, yes, healing comes in a bottle and is plentiful and cheap. As a general rule, I only rest at Inns or safe spots, which, laughably, leads to sometimes having to fight through a dungeon with fatigued chars cause I've forgotten to rest up. A small price to pay for the satisfaction of not abusing the 8 hour dungeon nap. ;) Hoarding problem? Get some therapy, I beg you.
    Post edited by JGP on
  • NeoNeo Member Posts: 127
    edited November 2019
    I'll probably give the Stalker a try on my next playthrough. The main reason for my F/T mostly was because I always have had a thief variant in my parties (except for one BG1 run where I did a solo Kensai/mage) viewing the thief for find/disarm traps and unlock (quite an extra chunk of XP on top of its obvious uses) mandatory.

    It often was Imoen in my BG1 runs, last run I can't remember as I had a full Evil party with the Dark Moon Monk. Can't remember with SoD but I probably had one. In my 1st BG2 playthrough it was Imoen again (Thief/mage dual), I didn't like it much but it was taken care of. In IWD, I think I made a Thief/Cleric, it was already better but I still wasn't too happy with the class as a whole. This time around (2nd BG2 playthrough), I decided to try F/T and it's doing better than I had anticipated. I only need 100 in lockpicks and find traps so I've had that covered a long time ago already and I also have 100 in hide in shadows and move silently (plus a ring that bumps these an other +20%) and now traps are at 85% if I remember well (ring bumps it higher again) and I'm near the end of Underdark. I haven't used traps yet but am fully functionnal to find any trap and unlock anything and I can always hide in shadows and move around unseen without any problem (the F/T is lvl 13/16). Turns out with the backstab and double katanas, my F/T's one of my best damage dealers but she's the squishiest. Her armor is a bit weaker but not by a lot (shadow dragon armor), THAC0 also weaker but good enough to land hits without problems (-1/-1, Keldorn is at -5, Wizard Slayer -8, Archer -12, Monk -13, Shaman 3).

    I'm guessing what you're talking about with the F/T not being as effective because they have to spend points in many things would be more relevant to BG1 where I didn't have one. The only thing though if I take a stalker is I'll still need a thief variant on the team unless I decide to lose out of the xp from disarm/unlock and deal with those in other ways (Knock, and walk into traps I guess).

    I think there might be some power curve if I were to do the whole series with a Stalker and a F/T. Stalker would certainly start out stronger for battle (a bit more hp when it matters more in BG1 early game, better THAC0 and better stealth) while the F/T could handle traps and unlocks. Then mid game, the F/T ends up with a stronger backstab and might catch up to a certain point in combat effectiveness. Late game I'm not sure. The bit of extra hp might not be that important. Stalker would probably have a better THAC0 and a few low lvl divine utility spells vs F/T being able to disarm traps and unlock stuff, have a bit stronger backstab and then I guess it'd mostly be about the HLAs. The F/T having access (I think?) to Use All Items or the strong traps depending on playstyle might be a big deal but I don't know, I have never played with those yet.
  • JGPJGP Member Posts: 26
    @Neo: I don't really want to go down this kind of char comparison path, but let me just say this. A Stalker is a stealth warrior and in my view the best, but stealth warriors will always play a specific role. They do not even possess the utilitarian value of an non-kitted fighter and certainly do not belong in every party, as a thief does. Even posing the comparison is a dicey proposition without a role and context in mind. Designing a party is a different thing than designing a char, an oft overlooked thing on these forums where you'll see 6 uber builds that add up to less than the sum of 4 simpler builds designed to work together.

    My post was really just about a particular style of play involving swift killing after an anti-magic blast by a small group of warriors. That's a PARTY strategy. A more apt comparison, say, would be to ask if a different type of char would fit better in that number one slot, like maybe a Berserker. And guess what? Yeah, not only does that Berserker flourish in the anti-magic environment, but overall kicks more ass than the Stalker does and is much sturdier to boot. That stealth warrior role doesn't even exist in the party strategy anymore, but hey it's now something I don't like playing as much (anyone who's ever hit the Rage Button and felt it should more properly be labelled "Win" knows what I'm talking about ;).

    I hope you see what I'm getting at here. I can tell you enjoy the discussion and don't want to spoil your enthusiasm, just pointing out what my own particular perspective is. It's just there to consider and not enter into some kind of best build competition. Cheers.
  • NeoNeo Member Posts: 127
    edited November 2019
    I totally understand. I also didn't want to try to argue saying F/T is flat out better (especially since I've never truly played a Stalker myself) but was mostly trying to figure out the main pros of having a Stalker that other classes/kits can't match. It's one of the kits I overlooked and forgot about until this current playthrough so I'll most likely want to try one out on my next playthrough, possibly for the entire series since I think it could be a decent fighter through BG1 and SoD as well (compared to my Dark Moon Monk that was garbage through BG1, not very good in SoD and is now basically a God with 100%+ immunity, high dmg, poison immunity, immunity to normal weapons, etc.).

    I had never really played with rangers actually so my current Archer's the 1st time I'm looking into their kit (and enjoying the archer so far). The only other class I've never touched now is the Bard because the class never really appealed to me but I think it's a bit like a mix of a thief and a mage with some buffs that probably requires him to stand still like the Shaman's spirits (but useful buffs while shaman spirits are totally useless in my current party despite having 2 shaman unique items that buff them with +10hp and permanent bless).

    --

    Now that I finally accessed the HLAs, the Thief looks much stronger than I originally thought for late game. There are the really strong traps, Assassination for massive single target dmg (but won't work much in ToB from what I read), Use All Items that unlocks tons of possibilities, etc. I used the console command to raise Valygar to 3000000 XP and compare him with my thief (making him equip most of the same gear, etc.). He has lower hp (probably due to my F/T being half orc with 19 con) but I would expect a Stalker equivalent to have a bit more hp than the F/T. With the SoD gauntlets (unofficial item pack transfering it onto the BG2 merchant), his backstab can match the thief's backstab at x5 at lvl 17+ (3mil XP is lvl 18) in exchange for the gauntlet slot (those gauntlets also add 1 Dex and 30% more hide in shadows if I remember well) which would definitely be worth it. The only real advantage I see him having is around +4 THAC0 over the F/T (was +4 with Katana and with Crom Faeyr but the Stalker had 1 pip in warhammer while the F/T currently has none, not sure if UAI had something to do with the fact that the F/T's THAC0 was also just 4 worse than the Stalker's since he has no pip in warhammers ATM).

    So considering I can get the SoD stalker gloves to match the F/T's backstab damage and assuming I would have the same Con, I guess in the end, the Stalker's only real advantages late game would be something like 4-5 more THAC0 and a bit more health. The thief is totally fine with the hide in shadows and move silently at 100/100 on top of the thief ring that adds an other 20% and I could have pushed those higher if I didn't put many points into traps (that I haven't used yet but I want to eventually try out the HLA ones). So mainly 4-5 THAC0 vs F/T can use a bit stronger armor if needed and can't backstab enemies well anymore, crazy HLAs like Use All Items (big deal for me since I have no mage/sorcerer in my party, F/T can now use wands of spellstriking, book of golem, mage scrolls, cheese with simulacrum helm + clone with wands or scrolls although I read SCS would get rid of that if I were to use that mod eventually, etc.), Assassination, Time Stop traps, High damage trap, unlock anything, find and disarm traps.

    Overall, I understand that there are too many classes and possible kit mixes, dual/multi for it to be all balanced. I personally haven't played D&D since the 2nd edition so I don't know how much this has improved nowaday with the 5th edition. I also understand that this game isn't only about powergaming and making the strongest possible class (Sorcerer, Kensai/Mage and Berserker comes to mind). For instance, I really wanted to try out a Wizard Slayer. His magic resistance is just starting to finally kick in at 3mil XP with lvl 20 (now every 2 lvls he gets +4% instead of only +1%) but I still think in most situations, my previous Berserker was straight up better. So yea, it would seem like the F/T loses very little and gains a ton compared to the Stalker at around 3mil XP+ but I definitely can see how the Stalker could be a stronger stealth fighter early/mid game (BG1 up to early BG2). I just wish that it had unique advantages going for him... but that could be said about a lot of kits (including my poor current Wizard Slayer).
    Post edited by Neo on
  • gorgonzolagorgonzola Member Posts: 3,864
    i have a different approach:
    for me a good synergy is FMT, CM, F9(kensai or berseker)->M and blade
    or, using npcs, charname sorcerer, aerie, jan and haer dalis.

    all them but the sorcerer can be effective in mlee, can use arcane protections and i have a potential of 4 spells/round before HLA.
    they level fast, in a 4 people party even the triple class is not a drag, and i can fight with parties like those almost all the vanilla battles and many hard modded ones in the way i want, going mlee, ranged, magic only or mixing the things.

    and the sorcerer or the dual into mage will be the real engine of the party quite fast as in 4 the xp for improved alacrity is reached quite fast.
    but even at low levels they shine, i can dance around dragons turning them to stone or feeblemind them after only a couple of minor quests and on hard modded setting they are perfectly capable of defeating the 2 litches, every litch with a bunch of undead helpers and a demon that spawn a copy of imself every few rounds, right after a couple of minor quests in town.
    and i don't import from previous games so they have like 400k less xp then a party with charname imported from sod.

    about the skull traps i use them extensively, the problem is not to have a party friendly aoe spell, is to have a hasted (boots, spells, whatever) and smart party.
    they are buffed and in mlee then, in a split second, they gain some distance from the enemy and drop 4 skull traps at once, then go back to mlee if somenoe survived the bombing :)

    i also never use a healer, even if i value very much clerics. i simply find them more useful doung other things, buffing and protecting themselves and the party, crushing heads with big flails and maces, they are really good at it if properly buffed, and so on.
    usually i don't have them memorize more then 1 single heal spell each day, cause i can maybe need it, even if my goal is to end each battle without a single scratch, goal that i reach in most of the situations thanks to the arcane protections and effective fighting tactics.
    to heal i rely on potions, regeneration items and on hard settings sometimes on the wand of resurrection, that has limitless charges if a clone uses it and can anyway be recharged for free by my thief (i always have a thief in the party if i am not soloing something other).

    now every approach is good as long as it works, but if you ask for synergy in the 2 parties i named i see a lot of synergy, and also a lot of flexibility, that gives me the freedom to fight each battle depending on the mood i am at that moment, not having to stick at what the party can do, as they can fight in each way they like.

    i also use
  • BananoBanano Member Posts: 10
    First time I played EE I tried dualclassing, and dual classing is so much easier with a small party.

    My charname was a female chaotic good fighter going to be a cleric, so in bg I went along with Viconia and Imoen. Good match... being a c/g couldn't side with the Flaming Fist arbitrary execution attempt, and I found her very useful. Plus, I have the "Charlie's Angel" complex. When I play female char, I have to have a three girls party... and that made me (the player, not the character) kind of a Bosley.

    BTW I (the character, not the player) was a dualwelding hammer fighter, not so good AC, not good at ranged... so Viconia stored a lot of healing, some buff and some evil-smithing damage spell. Useful for occasional and cute "save suicidal Imoen" moments and brief tanking (AC so better than mine). With Gauntlet of Ogre power good in melee too. Works fine.

    In Bg2 at the beninning the formula was the same, with Yoshimo/Jan instead of Iomen in early chapters (I heard "I'll do it, for a turnip" an awful lot of times), while my charname was now a level 1 cleric mace and shield (warrior hp, good AC: good thank, mediocre damage). Of course, being a c/g, couldn't stand for pubblic arbitrary execution of Viconia, so I sided with her once again. Then once I succesfull dualclassed a fighter-9/cleric-10 and, well, charname could deal quite everything in the game except traps and locks.

    ***

    Actual run since is even easier. Now I know that Viconia is hot, because SoD and BG2 portaits are a lot better than the one of BG1, and that alone could be enough for my lustful Halfling c/g fighter/thief. I did a lof of BG1 just alone with her, adding Neera just because she was fun. Once again, Vic supporting and useful for cute "save suicidal Neera" moments, and Neera firing loads of magic missle.

    Halfing f/t are fun, even if damage output is below average due -1 str and lack of mastery. So, sometime I used full buffed Vic for thanking and charname with his deadly and apparently nevermissing +x sling with +x bullets. When you expect the fight, the thief side of my charname is priceless... hide, scout, find enemy, going back, place trap, hide, backstab, going back, wait for traps... the 90% of the times my char name was pissed he had to share his exp with his two magical sidekick gals.

    Now he's getting HLA in BG2. Dudes, traps are good. Too good in metaplaying, still damn good in legit playing. Party become kinda of a optional. Still keeping Viconia, BTW. It's kinda fun when she praise my charname's halfling body.

    In any case, reading this thread, I realize BG is a great game. Greater than I knew.
    You build your own way to play it. You can power play. You can metaplay. You can roleplay, writing your own biography (it has game affect? Yes. 50% of roleplay happens in your head). You can set an army of two party, a six element troop or going solo. For each of this choises you have many options, and is hard very to screw something once you get the mechanics.

    @sarevok57 wants a balanced classic party? He can do it.
    @JGP wants a magic-free s.w.a.t. kind of party? He can do it.

    Someone love to do a kansai 19 then switch to thief just to complete dual in time to deal a single 200dmg backstab before every bosses become immune to it. Do you find it funny? You can do it.

    Problem is when games become boring, because it does soon or later, depending on how well you designed your strategy or what difficulty are you playing.



  • gorgonzolagorgonzola Member Posts: 3,864
    edited December 2019
    i greatly appreciate how you use your FT, the way imho a thief should be used, and yes as he can clear whole dungeons almost alone sometimes make you feel that his party mates are only a drag, but there are situations where you are lucky if you have them and running a small party you get plenty of xp any way.

    for the boredom problem, after some time it will kick in, i find many cures. i am stronger in playing some classes and combos, playing the other ones, the ones i am not so capable to play, give me the chance to learn, improve and find again challenge.
    also mod quests, i like very much elistrae's song that taught me a lot about drow's lore, npc mods, keto has a great RP content and tashia gives you an interesting romance and some challenging battles, can help.
    as well as self modding npcs using EEkeeper, i had a bard imoen, a kensai9->M nalia, an arher valygar, a cleric of lathander11->M aerie (the last with a little stretch both to lore and game rules) can help.

    and as you are perfectly right about the utter flexibility of the game, that can be soloed, played with 6 strong hitting fighter types or a magic heavy party, why don't profit of it and run a party that is the opposite of your ideal one?

    this way for me every play trough is something new, as i have something new to learn, something to improve, even after almost 20 years of playing. also taking pauses is a great help for me, sometimes i stop playing, then after some months or even a couple of years i come back to the game, recharged and ready for a new adventure in the magic fr world.
    ie i used to mod my game with the worst difficulty mods, lately i am playing mostly vanilla, that is really easy after all those almost impossible battles, and i really enjoy it. i have still to try no reload and i know that when i will do it it will a new way to defeat boredom when it will kick in again.
  • BananoBanano Member Posts: 10
    @gorgonzola ...Italian dude?

    BTW, I appreciate you appreciate, but honestly there's no so many options when it comes playing a thief in 2nd edition, and on videogame you have fewer. 3rd edition is whole different story, having a lovely skill system and that makes every stat and skill (and rogue has ton of it) somehow relevant, so you really can build whatever you want everytime you play a char.

    As for boredom, well... it happens and it's normal. And you got bored after a LOT of hours of game, But, mind you, even if I born as PC player, I am now a console one. No mods, no extra stuff. Only lately I bought a PC, and steamed a lot of Bioware classic. And that's how I fight boredom. Playing other games. Ciclically. Always the same pattern:

    1) choose a game;
    1) playing the first time as it comes (for very first run usually good oriented character, usually roguish);
    2) playing the second one, adding some metachoises (usually evil oriented character, usually best class build, usually at highter difficulty).
    3) back to step one.

    Soon or later I go back to the same game. It's best way, above all for Biowarish games, and Biowarish games are my cut of tea, with some notable exception (Witcher III on the top... dude, first and last game I played at highter difficulty, and it's kinda of hell... but supreme script writing, imho, first time after a long time I felt a setting). Cos, you know, you can fight game's boredmeness, but not the story boredomness.

    And why I should fight boredom for BG2 when there's NWN and Planescape:Torment I never played? That's absurd. A game based on my favourite system (D&D, 3rd ed) and the acclaimed best rpg evah, and I didn't play it.

    So, don't worry. I will embrace boredomness when it will came back, because it will be time of 3rd edition power building. When boredom will come again, it will be Night City time. But, soon or later, I will go back in Candlekeep... or Ostagar. Maybe Kirkwall again. But when I will come back in Candlekeep, it's elf fighter/mage time. ;)



  • gorgonzolagorgonzola Member Posts: 3,864
    Banano wrote: »
    @gorgonzola ...Italian dude?
    yep, italian, nice to meet you paisà :)
    up in the alps, very close to switzerland, surrounded by the snow and ice now, but very italian.

  • BananoBanano Member Posts: 10
    down in the south, sorrounded by the sea and sun... and my "paisà" is regionally legit. :D
    I don't feel italian, but lucky or unfortunatly is what I am (G. Gaber... and, as link to other thread, that's an example why I don't volunteer for localization).
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