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Character Attributes

ShangerooShangeroo Member Posts: 84
I know there are a couple threads of what’s the highest roll and everyone of course will try to get the highest possible roll. But really, wondering how significant of an impact it makes to completing the game? My guess probably not significant. So I’ve recently done this one solo run which I call the “average guy”. I made an enchanter and took the very first 75 roll I got (I think 75 is the lowest possible) and didn’t even modify any of the attributes distributions I want to see how an average guy can become a god lol. Here’s my starting stats that I randomly received.
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Im in chapter 3, lvl 6, easy so far. But we’ll see.

Zaghoul

Comments

  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 1,192
    I've never tried it myself but I imagine the biggest difference would just be that you use more of the stat boosting items the game provides.

    Looking forward to hearing how this treats you.

  • DJKajuruDJKajuru Member Posts: 3,222
    I'm currently playing with a gnome fighter/thief who's got str 15, dex 12, con 12, int 16, wis 7, cha 18. Physically quite average, but the other stats give such a roleplaying flavour that it made me go along. The good thing is that you don't need to be average all the time as you can actually invest on potions, stat boosting spells and items... for my gnome I might have him wear gauntlets of dexterity but on the long run it won't matter anyway because his thac0 and thief skills will continously progress, so by the end of the game his badassery will shine as much as others.

    In your case it's even easier : spellcaster don't really need any relevant stat as long as you drink a genius potion here and there to memorize your stuff. In fact, that would be a great roleplaying idea: the mage who is totally inapt but dares to progress by using potions , I would even pick the least intelligent dialogue options just to make a point.

    As for my gnome, I'm roleplaying that he uses his great charisma and intelligence to manage his team well so he doesn't really need outstanding physical skills, but eventually his wisdom will grow to 10 (tomes of wisdom) so he'll start reflecting on things that he previously denied .

    StummvonBordwehrAerakarmonico
  • DJKajuruDJKajuru Member Posts: 3,222
    edited February 29
    I don't mean to flood the post, but I just remembered another character of mine : a blade bard who had str 11, dex 18, con 09, int 14, wis 10, cha 15 . By BG standards he is definitely average, but by AD&D standards he is totally heroic , and I roleplayed his stats as a light footed and acrobatic bard who is actually good in his chosen profession.

    Aerakar
  • ShangerooShangeroo Member Posts: 84
    DJKajuru wrote: »

    As for my gnome, I'm roleplaying that he uses his great charisma and intelligence to manage his team well.

    In chapter 5 so far and just killed Shandalar. Still mostly easy. Agree if you have a team, attributes aren’t really important with the exception if you want to dual class and need to meet those requirements. But I’m running my guy solo, no team. In solo runs, regardless of class, I’ve found that having strength 19 is important in BG1 for thac0 purposes, although less so in BG2. The fact is regardless of what tactic you use, some enemies such as mustard jellies and those golems in the cave are immune to magic and need to be physically killed. Not having the set trap ability either, in this current playthough, I just run away, too lazy to find those red strength potions.

    So far having a 99+ vs 75 attribute total doesnt make a significant different. I’m really enjoying this playthrough and having to utilize different tactics and spells (I can’t web and cloud kill my way through now). But I found that I love the Emotion spell. Never realized how good it was.

    Zaghoul
  • monicomonico Member Posts: 476
    With any type of spellcaster, attributes are not that important:

    I'd say it depends on your class. As a wizard or even more as a sorcerer, stats are really not important (they can bring welcome benefits, but nothing gamechanging).
    As a divine spellcaster, physical abilities can be buffed with spells, WIS only brings more spells/day (very nice to have, but you can do without).
    Just remember that as a wizard with your 15 INT, you'll only be able to scribe spells up to 7th level in BG2EE. Which is not a problem since you can just gulp a potion of Genius to boost your INT and do a high-level-scroll-scribing session.

    As a warrior class though, I'd say that physical stats are more important though:
    - STR: depending on the difficulty, even +1 thac0 can become really important, especially solo. In BG2, not so much with all those STR enhancing belts.
    - DEX: +4 AC at 18 DEX is nothing to scoff at (can be read as 20% less chances for enemies to hit you), especially in BG1. Can even be buffed to +5 or +6 AC with potions/Draw upon Holy Might. Contrary to a wizard/sorcerer who has many ways to simply evade being hit or taking damage altogether, as a warrior class, you go melee and take hits. And AC brings more survivability. Off course, depends on your difficulty settings too. Also important is that as a solo-warrior, you might often want to rely on ranged attacks, and DEX lowers your thac0 significantly. Again, can be just "useful" depending on difficulty, or definitely mandatory (Legacy of Bhaal for example).
    - CON: again, as a warrior, you take hits. Especially if you don't min-max DEX for better AC, you'll take more hits. I'd say that CON is even more important than STR if your DEX is lacking. If you don't play with max HP at lvl up, without any CON bonus, you would face Sarevok with an average of 45 HP. Off course, you can boost it temporarily with potions/DuHM, but as a solo warrior you can't drink a potion of fortitude before each encounter just to hope to survive more than 2 hits (that you'll definitely take since your AC is lacking).
    Now, with +5 HP at 19 CON, that's +40HP guaranteed at BG1 level cap, almost doubling your random HP rolls. If no random HP rolls, you still went from 80HP to 120HP, although I agree that in this case, 80 HP could allow you to survive a few hits.

    I'm not saying it can't be done with a low stat roll and no mix-maxing attributes, but any warrior type would find the difference pretty significant IMHO.

    ShangerooGrond0Daevelon
  • ShangerooShangeroo Member Posts: 84
    edited March 3
    monico wrote: »

    As a warrior class though, I'd say that physical stats are more important though:
    quote]

    Reflecting back on my solo kensai run, I agree that Str, Dex and Cons are very important. Yes, that guy was always drunk on potions, but for all the reasons you mentioned those added +1's I'm sure helped a lot in getting through some fights. But for spellcasters, I still think that , Strength 19 is important in solo runs because of those enemies you can't kill with spells (there's no way to lower resistence in BG1). I hate running away from enemies, but in this run I had to because not sure how I'd kill them otherwise.

  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 5,872
    Shangeroo wrote: »
    But for spellcasters, I still think that , Strength 19 is important in solo runs because of those enemies you can't kill with spells (there's no way to lower resistence in BG1). I hate running away from enemies, but in this run I had to because not sure how I'd kill them otherwise.

    Casters have summons available to deal with the very few enemies that can't be hit directly by spells. You can also just use buffs to boost your own attack and defense for the short time necessary to kill something like a mustard jelly.

    monico
  • monicomonico Member Posts: 476
    edited March 5
    Agree with @Grond0 . Spellcasters don't need STR even solo, if the enemy is immune to your magic, get summons, or buff yourself (lvl2 Strength spell or lvl4 polymorph self spell, or both).

    High STR is convenient on a solo arcane caster (for transporting loot, getting recruited by Teven to access the Bandit Camp without fighting, some other dialogues check STR in SoD), but I either rely on the generic strength potion (raises it to 18, enough for those purposes), or cast the lvl 2 Strength spell.

    In fact, I think a Sorcerer with the lowest stats could complete the game without much more difficulty than if he had 25 in all attributes. Well, 3 STR & CON would make it a hassle for weight allowance and very VERY low HP, not sure it would be much fun, but at "average" numbers (no malus), the game wouldn't be any more difficult (the INT minimum score is 9, so you can still use wands)

    Grond0StummvonBordwehr
  • jsavingjsaving Member Posts: 732
    On a warrior, going with the usual 18/00, 18, 18 for physical stats is like moving the difficulty slider two notches toward story mode when playing BG1. Next to ankheg/golem farming that's probably the single most broken/OP decision you can make as a player.

    Next would probably be a 19-strength half-orc who goes cleric or cleric/thief. Their low APR limits the damage to game balance but that's still equivalent to moving the difficulty slider one notch toward story mode when playing BG1.

    For wizards and sorcerers, on the other hand, stats barely matter as long as (if a wizard) your casting stat is high enough to scribe spells.

    As to @Shangeroo and his question about die rolls, in none of these examples would it matter in the slightest how many points you rolled. You only need 64 points to break the game's difficulty as a warrior (19/18/18/3/3/3) and a still-low 79 if you also want to max a mental stat.

    It's actually pretty entertaining to do a run-through where you max physical stats at 14, don't use any strength-boosting spells or potions, and don't farm any areas for XP.

  • jmerryjmerry Member Posts: 475
    A fun fact: dragon disciples don't have a minimum Int score, so you can actually build a legal arcane character that can't use scrolls or wands unless they drink a potion. That's probably more challenging than the hypothetical minimum-stat sorcerer.

    I've also thought a bit about the 75-point elf ranger. What's challenging about that? 70 of those points go to mandatory class/race minimums, with all six stats covered. You start at 13/13/14/8/14/8, with five discretionary points to improve it. 18/xx strength, 18 Dex, or a hit point bonus - choose one.

    Ludwig_IImonico
  • DanacmDanacm Member Posts: 757
    As i know there is no balance between classes, back to time when adnd releases and when bg1 rules implemented it wasnt the rock, paper, scissors idea behind it as nowdays. As the attribute bonuses also not used in the meaning as we no now (after dnd 3rd edition) where every stat allocates a bonus to some other area. In pnp if you have one or two above 16 score, you gain bonuses and you were happy to have something, but most of diced characters doesnt have much bonus ftom it, maybe it was an issue.

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