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Back Again with More Q's

ArcnNKDArcnNKD Member Posts: 28
in BGII:EE Mods
It's me again - I have a feeling people on this forum are going to get tired of seeing my name, but maybe I'll ask some questions that others are thinking and don't want to ask lol. This time I have a few more questions regarding modding/kit building that Google searches have been incredibly unhelpful with (downside to this game's age; all searches keep directing to the same links).

So, essentially, I understand there are some things that are just hard-coded and have not been externalized for player/modder use - like whether a class can cast arcane or divine spells; what UI buttons a class has available to them; the Shadowdancer's HiPS ability. And I understand that some things can be worked around - such as manually removing/leaving mage spells from a mage kit and/or adding the cleric spells so they become a 'cleric' (would be useful for making pseudo-Fighter/Cleric/Thief or Cleric/Mage/Thief characters).

What I'm looking into as one of my many projects/ideas, is trying to create a Priest of Mask kit for the cleric that essentially takes the Shadowdancer/Cleric multiclass that you can 'create' with EEKeeper and turns it into a kit. The major points of the kit being:
- Ability to cast divine spells
- Access to thief skills
- Restriction to Cleric ethos (backstabbing with clubs and quarterstaves), but specialization in those weapons (I'm a sucker for weapon specialization or higher.. it is just so sad that so many classes are gimped without Fighter being attached to them, due to only having proficiency)
- Hide in Plain Sight ability
- Possible reduced thief skill points per level (so the class focuses more on stealth instead of the locks/traps thief).

Now, some issues I keep running into:
- If I base the class off of Cleric; I cannot figure out a way to grant them thief skills.
- If I base the class off of Thief; I cannot figure out a way to grant them divine casting or Turn Undead.
- If I base the class off of Ranger and forgo non-stealth thief skills; I cannot grant them divine casting from level 1 instead of level 8/9; or Turn Undead.
- If base the classs off of anything, even Shadowdancer itself; I am not certain the class will even have access to Hide in Plain Sight if they are not specifically a Shadowdancer (boo internalized abilities, boo).
- I cannot figure out how/if I can use WeiDU's ADD_KIT function and tie the kit to a multiclass in order to circumvent these issues (like, creating a 'kit' based off the Cleric/Thief but selectable as a single class option under Clerics).

So is this concept futile? Does it go beyond the abilities of what the devs have allowed us or the engine/modding programs can create? I have a feeling the majority of ideas I have are going to be unable to be recreated because of engine/externalization limitations.

Would it just be better for me to bite the bullet and create my Priest of Mask as a personal-play-only character using EEKeeper to just play a multiclass Shadowdancer/Cleric; instead of making it a kit that others can enjoy?

Thanks in advance.

Comments

  • TygaranTygaran Member Posts: 41
    While I personally haven't done much in the way of coding kits, there is one workaround to adding divine spells to a thief-archetype class that I'm aware of. The catch is that this idea would have to use the innate powers button rather than the spellcasting button. You can add an innate power which starts a dialog... you can have that dialog allow you to 'memorize' spells by adding innate powers instead. It's clunky, I know.

    I've also seem mods which actually list new kits under some of the multiclass selections. In other words, you'd select Cleric/Thief and a sub page would appear which would let you pick either the original Cleric/Thief OR your custom Kit. Not sure how it's done exactly, but the Might and Guile mod does this for a number of pseudo bard kits.

    More advancer/experienced kit coders might have better information.
  • SkitiaSkitia Member Posts: 1,084
    edited August 2020
    My Vienxay mod required me to basically figure all of this out, except with Thief/Mage instead of Thief/Cleric.

    - If I base the class off of Cleric; I cannot figure out a way to grant them thief skills.
    - If I base the class off of Thief; I cannot figure out a way to grant them divine casting or Turn Undead.
    - If I base the class off of Ranger and forgo non-stealth thief skills; I cannot grant them divine casting from level 1 instead of level 8/9; or Turn Undead.
    -
    The above three are really easy to solve if you are using the qd_multiclass library. You need to include it (INCLUDE ~%MOD_FOLDER%/lib/qd_multiclass.tpa~, replacing lib with wherever it is stored in.) You'd basically add this code after your kit stuff:

    LAF qd_multiclass
    STR_VAR
    kit_name = KITNAME
    kit_clab = KITCLAB
    base_class = ~T~ //T for Thief!
    mc_dir = ~%MOD_FOLDER%/spells~
    END


    - If base the classs off of anything, even Shadowdancer itself; I am not certain the class will even have access to Hide in Plain Sight if they are not specifically a Shadowdancer (boo internalized abilities, boo).

    Yes, sadly if it is not Shadowdancer, then it won't work. But honestly, I would not give a Priest of Mask Hide in Plain Sight anyway. I would instead give them one of the versions of the invisibility every five levels if I were doing the kit in a Baldur's Gate style format. This is what I sort of ended up doing with Vienxay's Shadow Jump spell, it turns her invisible, jumps her to X target, and increases her backstab by 2 for 12 seconds. If she hits, she's bound to cause a lot of damage. Innate Invisiblity in general is a good substitute for hide in plain sight shadow-based classes.

    - I cannot figure out how/if I can use WeiDU's ADD_KIT function and tie the kit to a multiclass in order to circumvent these issues (like, creating a 'kit' based off the Cleric/Thief but selectable as a single class option under Clerics).

    I would download my Vienxay mod and look at the vien_bg1, starting around line 35. I think it would help you! It also has the qd_multiclass library and the library for adding a custom kit that you would need for this work anyway.

  • ArcnNKDArcnNKD Member Posts: 28
    Skitia wrote: »
    My Vienxay mod required me to basically figure all of this out, except with Thief/Mage instead of Thief/Cleric.

    - If I base the class off of Cleric; I cannot figure out a way to grant them thief skills.
    - If I base the class off of Thief; I cannot figure out a way to grant them divine casting or Turn Undead.
    - If I base the class off of Ranger and forgo non-stealth thief skills; I cannot grant them divine casting from level 1 instead of level 8/9; or Turn Undead.
    -
    The above three are really easy to solve if you are using the qd_multiclass library. You need to include it (INCLUDE ~%MOD_FOLDER%/lib/qd_multiclass.tpa~, replacing lib with wherever it is stored in.) You'd basically add this code after your kit stuff:

    LAF qd_multiclass
    STR_VAR
    kit_name = KITNAME
    kit_clab = KITCLAB
    base_class = ~T~ //T for Thief!
    mc_dir = ~%MOD_FOLDER%/spells~
    END


    - If base the classs off of anything, even Shadowdancer itself; I am not certain the class will even have access to Hide in Plain Sight if they are not specifically a Shadowdancer (boo internalized abilities, boo).

    Yes, sadly if it is not Shadowdancer, then it won't work. But honestly, I would not give a Priest of Mask Hide in Plain Sight anyway. I would instead give them one of the versions of the invisibility every five levels if I were doing the kit in a Baldur's Gate style format. This is what I sort of ended up doing with Vienxay's Shadow Jump spell, it turns her invisible, jumps her to X target, and increases her backstab by 2 for 12 seconds. If she hits, she's bound to cause a lot of damage. Innate Invisiblity in general is a good substitute for hide in plain sight shadow-based classes.

    - I cannot figure out how/if I can use WeiDU's ADD_KIT function and tie the kit to a multiclass in order to circumvent these issues (like, creating a 'kit' based off the Cleric/Thief but selectable as a single class option under Clerics).

    I would download my Vienxay mod and look at the vien_bg1, starting around line 35. I think it would help you! It also has the qd_multiclass library and the library for adding a custom kit that you would need for this work anyway.

    That's useful information, though the qd library is honestly a little more confusing to me than I'd like it to be (I'm still fresh when it comes to WeiDU kitting and stuff anyway); but my issue with Invisibility vs HiPS is: yes, invisibility probably has a better flavor or a better utility to it, but they lose out on the idea of slipping away into the shadows in the middle of a fight and reappearing with a deadly backtab that HiPS provides continuously as long as Hide succeeds. Granting it every so often turns it into - gain a one/two/etc.-time opener for a fight vs. continuously available ability to hide and backstab without having to run/break line of sight.
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