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My ferret familiar can nuke targets.

Just south of the Friendly Arm Inn, I (ie. my elf f/m/t Lateralus) went hunting for a rogue ogre. Snuck up on it, casted Color Spray, and promptly angered it. Without a backup plan and nothing but a shield for defense, I tested my luck toe to toe. Immediately smacked for 15hp of damage! So me and my 1 good hp stumbled back to the north where I left my ferret with the ogre in pursuit. I accidently eft buttoned (xbox format) and there was a wand of heavens and a wand of magic missiles in my quick slots! I paused to figured it out. Those items were stolen by my familiar in Obes X-man cave, I never put him back in my pack, and the items must have defaulted to his quick slots! I clicked the WoH and sure.enough, that little clepto saved my bacon with 35hp 🔥 damage! Oh...the possibilities!

Permidion_Starksarevok57StummvonBordwehrAerakarJuliusBorisov

Comments

  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    After some experiments, it appears to only works with items that have been picked from NPCs not currently in the party. The familiar doesn't always put items into quick slots, my theory is that it quickslots items that are currently in its first 3 inventory boxes. It's a "fun bug" and it really adds to solo run fun!

    I'll run some more tests, I'm curious to learn if it will quickslot potions of thievery, taking its kleptocracy to new lows! Also scrolls, and usable items like cloaks.

    Balrog99
  • jmerryjmerry Member Posts: 1,536
    Incidentally, your ferret is cheating. It's a mage/thief, which shouldn't be able to equip a wand of the heavens.

    JuliusBorisovKvotheRM8
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 6,795
    jmerry wrote: »
    Incidentally, your ferret is cheating. It's a mage/thief, which shouldn't be able to equip a wand of the heavens.

    Maybe it's high enough level for Use Any Item. Boo's got nothin' on that ferret!

    Permidion_StarkJuliusBorisovKvotheRM8
  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    @jmerry That is a very astute observation, thats what made the discovery so alarming because I mistakenly thought it was in Lateralus's QS!

    I'm naming the ferret familiar "Glitch", for conversations sake.

    New information:

    1. It 100% doesn't matter if Glitch steals from NPCs that are in the party or out of the party. So if you want your Glitch to equip new items into it's quickslot, it's best if you have him "steal" it from a party member.

    2. Any item that Glitch steals, and then returns to you, cannot be stolen again. I know that doesn't make sense, a lot of things don't make sense. But I have throughly tested this and it's a fact. So if it had a Wand of Heavans quick slotted, make sure you expend all of its charges before returning your Glitch to your pack, or asking for it to cough up stolen goods. Because you could remove all equipment from a party member except for that exact same wand in a general inventory square, and it will never be able to steal it back. It's a quirky little ferret.

    3. Glitch will only quick slot the top 3 items in its inventory. So if it successfully stole 5 items in a row, in the following order: Wand of Heavans, 20 darts, potion of speed, wand of MM, scroll of color spray. Its quick slots would look like this: 1.WoH 2.Blank 3.potion of speed and thats it, it would never be able to use items 4 or 5 because of rule #2 above.

    4. Visibility: Glitch doesn't automatically quickslot items, which is perhaps why this is a little know thing. I was able to have it show newly stolen items by (remember only usable items in its first 3 general inventory squares-which by the way you cannt see or manage-will appear in its quick slot) saving and reloading. There may be other ways it shows, but that is the only proven way I have discovered.

    5. What items can Glitch use? So far I have successfully equipped wands (class restrictions dont matter to Glitch), potions (master thievery works), scrolls, and the Shield Amulet.

    My experiments continue, in the meantime keep in mind that this is probably more of an annoyance to most players because its vert tricky to manage. And having your familiar constantly exposed to danger is EXTREMELY risky and quit frankly not a wise move. If your playing hard-core runs, I do not recommend this. If your doing a laid back solo run, this is with playing around with.

    I'm interested in discovering how stackable items work with Glitch (a stack of potions of invisibility would be beneficial) and just how effective a Glitch can be at picking locks and finding and removing traps with the aid of potion stacks.

    JuliusBorisovBalrog99Grond0
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 6,795
    I'm interested if the cat familiar can do this as well. It has a much lower pickpocket skill, but theoretically it should work, correct? If so, the cat has much better survivability due to it's high stealth skill...

    KvotheRM8
  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    I'm interested if the cat familiar can do this as well. It has a much lower pickpocket skill, but theoretically it should work, correct? If so, the cat has much better survivability due to it's high stealth skill...

    It it does, the draw back would be that it would take longer to "steal" (equip) items from party members which would be more annoying. And stealing from NPCs would rarely work unless you buff it with potions.

  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 6,795
    edited September 2020
    KvotheRM8 wrote: »
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    I'm interested if the cat familiar can do this as well. It has a much lower pickpocket skill, but theoretically it should work, correct? If so, the cat has much better survivability due to it's high stealth skill...

    It it does, the draw back would be that it would take longer to "steal" (equip) items from party members which would be more annoying. And stealing from NPCs would rarely work unless you buff it with potions.

    I'm thinking about solo runs without thieves (bards, sorcerers or wizards) that would benefit from Glitch's skills. If rabbits could pickpocket some potions of perception that would synergize nice with their high disable trap skill. Cats can't disarm traps except maybe with potions that boost that skill, but they have very nice stealth skill. I'm curious enough to play around with this myself now. Does it work on PC or is this a console only exploit?

    KvotheRM8
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 6,795
    Also, does the rabbit have a '0' pickpocket skill? If so, would a luck spell boost it by 5% making it possible to pickpocket? Just trying to look at this from every possible angle...

  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    KvotheRM8 wrote: »
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    I'm interested if the cat familiar can do this as well. It has a much lower pickpocket skill, but theoretically it should work, correct? If so, the cat has much better survivability due to it's high stealth skill...

    It it does, the draw back would be that it would take longer to "steal" (equip) items from party members which would be more annoying. And stealing from NPCs would rarely work unless you buff it with potions.

    I'm thinking about solo runs without thieves (bards, sorcerers or wizards) that would benefit from Glitch's skills. If rabbits could pickpocket some potions of perception that would synergize nice with their high disable trap skill. Cats can't disarm traps except maybe with potions that boost that skill, but they have very nice stealth skill. I'm curious enough to play around with this myself now. Does it work on PC or is this a console only exploit?

    I've been playing this game since its original release on every single format its made on, this is the first time I've ever noticed this and I am indeed on console. Good luck!

  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Also, does the rabbit have a '0' pickpocket skill? If so, would a luck spell boost it by 5% making it possible to pickpocket? Just trying to look at this from every possible angle...

    I do not know what the base PP skill is for rabbits, but Luck adds 5%, but only for a single round. Could work, but it requires testing.

  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    Apologies for my numerous typos, I'm using a tiny phone screen so its going to happen again and again, hopefully you are proficient in "typoese"

  • jmerryjmerry Member Posts: 1,536
    edited September 2020
    A rabbit familiar has 18 Dex, 0 base PP skill, and the thief class. It should have a PP score of 25. A cat familiar has 18 Dex, 0 base FT skill, and the thief class; it should be able to find and disarm traps with a score of 10. In general, with any of the neutral familiars, if their skill at an aspect of thieving isn't in the description, it's 0 base skill with 18 Dex.

    On not being able to steal something twice - I suspect the "hand things over" action sets a flag on the item so it can't be pickpocketed. This is mainly so that items you give to NPCs for quests can't be pickpocketed back, but it's splashing to here.

    (Added in edit)
    I ran a couple of quick tests... an item I let a familiar steal and then take back picks up a "not stealable" flag. An item (Zhurlong's boots) that I handed over to an NPC and then took back by force also has that flag. The hypothesis looks good so far.

    Post edited by jmerry on
    Balrog99KvotheRM8JuliusBorisov
  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    New information:

    6: Stack "stealing" works. If the only item(s) in your party members invertory is a stack of 50 Elixers of Health and your Glitch snags it. They will all be snagged as one. This is important because I find that using one slot to heal, one slot to escape (invisibility), and one slot to nuke makes for a happy familier.


    I'm getting a Mandolorian vibe from this solo run, a lot of attention is being paid to keep Glitch alive but when things are most dire thats an epic ace up your sleeve.

    Balrog99JuliusBorisov
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 6,795
    edited September 2020
    Unfortunately, after extensive experimentation, I cannot get this exploit to work on my PC. Darn it, was going to try a FMC solo with surprise thief skills if this worked out... 😢

    Edit: For you console folks I did confirm that you can get a rabbit to pick pockets. It takes a little while but you can definitely do it, which opens up a much better disarm traps familiar. I assume the cat can do it as well with better pickpocket and much better stealth but lower disarm traps...

    KvotheRM8
  • jmerryjmerry Member Posts: 1,536
    So I guess it's a platform-specific bug. It probably should be formally reported, then.

    For now, enjoy your run - and maybe tell the story for the enjoyment of others?

  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Unfortunately, after extensive experimentation, I cannot get this exploit to work on my PC. Darn it, was going to try a FMC solo with surprise thief skills if this worked out... 😢

    Edit: For you console folks I did confirm that you can get a rabbit to pick pockets. It takes a little while but you can definitely do it, which opens up a much better disarm traps familiar. I assume the cat can do it as well with better pickpocket and much better stealth but lower disarm traps...

    That sucks! :(

    Balrog99
  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    jmerry wrote: »
    So I guess it's a platform-specific bug. It probably should be formally reported, then.

    For now, enjoy your run - and maybe tell the story for the enjoyment of others?

    I'm not reporting it because I don't want it "fixed" it literally enhances the game without breaking it!

    I just wish there was a way to equip a wand of fire in a pseudo dragons quickslot!

    I'll keep sharing the story of Glitch, random encounters are somewhat terrifying now lol hes been murdered twice

    Balrog99
  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    The cat moves way slower than ferrets (console thing?) so its annoying waiting for it to catch up, and unless you are managing its stealth it can get attack without any back up nearby (cats, am I right?). Not a big deal that me and Branwen are max level, I just cast invisibility on it and leave it to do whatever. I equipped it with Wands of Fire and Heavans (Ring of Invisibility in the final slot). I just make sure its out of danger and invisible, then call in an air strick if needed.

    The best way to manage this playing style on a hard core run, is to keep it in the pack until you have access to the heavy fire power and plenty of invisibility options. Then, do as above.

  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 6,795
    edited October 2020
    Interesting update. In my latest game I decided to play a Bounty Hunter/Mage with a ferret familiar (LN). I hadn't been able to replicate the OP's feat of equipping a wand on my familiar before so thought it was a console-only exploit. However, just now I was using my ferret to pickpocket The Great Gazib for his scrolls and noticed that the scrolls were put in the ferret's quick slots! It only works after a quick-save reload from what i've been able to glean so far. My ferret now has a scroll of Blind and a scroll of Agannazar's Scorcher that it can cast at will. The ferret can't pickpocket Charname (probably because I'm a thief and there's some kind of penalty) but I'll try to pickpocket a wand off of Kagain later and see if it equips it. This could be a game-changer for no-reload mages, bards, sorcerers or mage multi/dual solos so thought I'd let everybody know...

    Edit: Windows 10 in case anybody was wondering.

    Post edited by Balrog99 on
    JuliusBorisov
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 6,795
    Update: When you put the familiar in your backpack it empties its quickslot scrolls into your backpack so it's annoying, but with some work it's potentially an extra spellcaster for those tough encounters...

    KvotheRM8JuliusBorisov
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 6,795
    KvotheRM8 wrote: »
    The cat moves way slower than ferrets (console thing?) so its annoying waiting for it to catch up, and unless you are managing its stealth it can get attack without any back up nearby (cats, am I right?). Not a big deal that me and Branwen are max level, I just cast invisibility on it and leave it to do whatever. I equipped it with Wands of Fire and Heavans (Ring of Invisibility in the final slot). I just make sure its out of danger and invisible, then call in an air strick if needed.

    The best way to manage this playing style on a hard core run, is to keep it in the pack until you have access to the heavy fire power and plenty of invisibility options. Then, do as above.

    I'll let you know if my familiar can equip wands using my method once I have a chance. I'm doing a solo and it can't pickpocket me because I'm a mage/thief. I'll need to add a low dexterity NPC like Kagain and see if it can pickpocket a wand from him. Might not get back to Beregost until tomorrow...

  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Update: When you put the familiar in your backpack it empties its quickslot scrolls into your backpack so it's annoying, but with some work it's potentially an extra spellcaster for those tough encounters...

    Yeah you have to remember that the ferret has the same inventory boxes as a character, and whichever quickslottable items are in its first 3 slots will be shown. Also, once you give items back they can't be restolen. A lot of micromanaging

    Balrog99
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 6,795
    KvotheRM8 wrote: »
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Update: When you put the familiar in your backpack it empties its quickslot scrolls into your backpack so it's annoying, but with some work it's potentially an extra spellcaster for those tough encounters...

    Yeah you have to remember that the ferret has the same inventory boxes as a character, and whichever quickslottable items are in its first 3 slots will be shown. Also, once you give items back they can't be restolen. A lot of micromanaging

    It does work with wands too!

    Now if only there were Wands of Lockpicking, and Wands of Disarm Trap my elven Fighter/Mage would be complete!

  • jmerryjmerry Member Posts: 1,536
    No, but there are thieving potions. Your ferret has 15 skill in FT and 0 skill in OL. Add 25 OL and 10 FT for being an 18 Dex thief, and the ferret can pick locks and disarm traps with scores of 25 each before buffs.

    OK, that's a lot of potions of perception/mind focusing if you want to disarm the tougher traps. Even traps like the web traps in the Cloakwood are out of reach for a ferret with one buff potion.

    Balrog99
  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 6,795
    edited October 2020
    jmerry wrote: »
    No, but there are thieving potions. Your ferret has 15 skill in FT and 0 skill in OL. Add 25 OL and 10 FT for being an 18 Dex thief, and the ferret can pick locks and disarm traps with scores of 25 each before buffs.

    OK, that's a lot of potions of perception/mind focusing if you want to disarm the tougher traps. Even traps like the web traps in the Cloakwood are out of reach for a ferret with one buff potion.

    A rabbit would work though. On the flip side, pickpocketing is harder with a bunny.

    Post edited by Balrog99 on
  • KvotheRM8KvotheRM8 Member Posts: 54
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    KvotheRM8 wrote: »
    Balrog99 wrote: »
    Update: When you put the familiar in your backpack it empties its quickslot scrolls into your backpack so it's annoying, but with some work it's potentially an extra spellcaster for those tough encounters...

    Yeah you have to remember that the ferret has the same inventory boxes as a character, and whichever quickslottable items are in its first 3 slots will be shown. Also, once you give items back they can't be restolen. A lot of micromanaging

    It does work with wands too!

    Now if only there were Wands of Lockpicking, and Wands of Disarm Trap my elven Fighter/Mage would be complete!

    Like jmerry said potions, but potions of perception. Its not easy, but if it consumed 5 real quick you could navigate traps in durlags 100%.. pot of thievery and power would also help. Always use the 3rd slot for invisibility either the ring or a stack of potions or scrolls. A familiar could potion buff and then crawl through an entire dungeon level unseen and find and disarm every single trap. Now that's a useful pet. It does take micromanagement and also the trade off is that it always stays out of the pack (and is in danger).

    Balrog99
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