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Best weapons for Fighter/Thief in Throne of Bhaal?

Currently dual-wielding shortswords as a 'lore-friendly' weapon for a fighter/thief and because I'm using Kundane for him, but I was wondering if it's a good strategy to slowly transition into Two-handed weapons to use Carsomyr when I get UAI. Since backstabs are mostly pointless in ToB I felt a two-hander who attacks behind my tank (Jaheira) would deal more damage. I'd probably stick to Black Dragon Armor for my Charname so I can use thief abilities.

Team:

- Charname
- Imoen
- Jaheira
- Minsc
- Aerie
- rotating with eventually settling for Sarevok

So since I'm not getting Keldorn I can free up Carsomyr. However, are there any better strategies for using a fighter/thief that isn't just "spam trap here?" What kind of weapons have you guys used for an end-game fighter/thief?

Comments

  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 5,510
    i had fighter/thieves use carsomyr before and it was great, also you can wear the white dragon armor and it will not disable thief abilities and it's armor class is 3 better

    ConwanDonald
  • lollerslollers Member Posts: 96
    I think you should learn staves. They can backstab, one of them has very good damage too. Carsomyr isn't really a thing you need to be good at. Just quick slot and pull it out if you have magic problems.

    Conwan
  • jmerryjmerry Member Posts: 1,550
    Incidentally, if you're not backstabbing regularly, you don't need to use thief abilities in combat - except for Detect Illusion, which isn't impeded by armor at all. My last fighter/thief specialized in scimitars, daggers, dual-wielding, and katanas in that order, and wore heavy armor (nonmagical full plate) regularly in both BG1 and BG2. With her late-game proficiencies, she added staves and two-handed style, for big damage when backstabs were called for. Of course a lack of proficiency didn't stop her from occasionally throwing Azuredge, off-handing the Mace of Disruption, or using a longbow to shoot her teammates with dispelling arrows.
    Her end-game weapons: main-hand either Celestial Fury or Spectral Brand depending on the enemies, off-hand the Ninjato of the Crimson Brotherhood (a +3 weapon with +1 APR and poison, but you need UAI for it).

    Short swords ... the problem with short swords is that you don't get much damage out of them. The Short Sword of Mask has on-hit abilities that look cool, but you'd be better off nearly all the time with a bit of elemental damage. There are a few short swords, available early, with interesting abilities, but they're just not very good as a melee mainstay.

    The party, despite having Keldorn, did not use Carsomyr. I like Purifier better anyway; that was Keldorn's off-hand weapon in the late game.

    Strategies ... thieving skills are mostly about utility in this game. "Thief" is not a combat role. In combat, you're going to be a fighter with a few extra tricks, and that's fine.
    And just because some bosses are immune - that doesn't mean you can't take advantage of backstabbing. If you open a battle by removing a key target, that's a big help even if you didn't backstab the main boss. Or if you build for it, you can go for repeated stab-retreat cycles and single-handedly destroy groups of enemies. Even my heavily armored fighter/thief went for stabs on occasion. The upper level of Yaga-Shura's lair was particularly good for that - you can stab a giant, then retreat where they can't follow.

    Conwan
  • ConwanConwan Member Posts: 28
    @sarevok57 Good suggestion. I'll try to find it. Thanks.

    @lollers I haven't done ToB yet (slowly getting there), but I've heard that backstabs are mostly useless since all enemies can see you when you're invisible and the like. So in that sense staves are kind of useless, no?

    @jmerry Oh don't get me wrong. I'm in SoA right now and I'm using every trick in the book. Backstabbing mages and priests before the battle begins (or during after chugging a pot of invisibility) is my go-to strategy. I also rely on traps more than I'd imagine and half of the spell slots on Aerie are invisibility spells. Things of that nature. So don't worry when I say that I'm using the utility half of the fighter/thief to its full potential.

    However, I haven't done ToB yet before and I've read that backstabs become all but useless at that point. So I was wondering if it were a good idea to somewhat change my character into a two-handed utility warrior at that point. Spamming traps, disarming traps, unlocking picks, etc.

    As for the shortswords, I know. While I'll probably get the Sword of Mask +5 by the end of the game I'd probably keep it as my "off-hand" weapon. And it was for lore reasons more than metagaming. But since I have been burned before by focusing on lore too much I was wondering if Carsomyr was a good idea.

  • jmerryjmerry Member Posts: 1,550
    Conwan wrote: »
    ... and I've read that backstabs become all but useless at that point.

    Don't believe what you've read. Sure, there are enemies you can't backstab, and enemies that see through invisibility. Then again, you've been facing enemies like that for ages. Kuo-toa see through invisibility, and beholders are immune to backstabs. Does that mean that backstabs are all but useless in the Underdark? No.

    Conwan
  • ConwanConwan Member Posts: 28
    jmerry wrote: »
    Conwan wrote: »
    ... and I've read that backstabs become all but useless at that point.

    Don't believe what you've read. Sure, there are enemies you can't backstab, and enemies that see through invisibility. Then again, you've been facing enemies like that for ages. Kuo-toa see through invisibility, and beholders are immune to backstabs. Does that mean that backstabs are all but useless in the Underdark? No.

    Ah, that's very good to know. Would it be better than to put those four pips into Bastard Sword and Scimitar to use Foebane and Scarlet Ninjato?

  • jmerryjmerry Member Posts: 1,550
    They're fine weapons, but I wouldn't go for both on the same character. The main value of those weapons is in passive bonuses (magic resistance, +APR), and neither of them can backstab. Great in the off hand, less so in the main hand. For your main hand weapon, you want backstab capability, raw damage, and/or on-hit bonus effects. That's why I went with Celestial Fury and Spectral Brand for the character I mentioned - on-hit stun in the first case, high damage and added cold in the second.

    That, and I divvied up weapon choices by character. Keldorn got the long swords and bastard swords, Korgan got the axes and hammers, Mazzy got the flails, protagonist got the katanas and scimitars, Rasaad didn't use weapons, and Haer'Dalis didn't attack. The more warriors you have in the party, the more it pays to plan your weapon choices in advance and avoid conflict. There are excellent, endgame-worthy weapons in practically all categories - but only one or two each.

    Conwan
  • ConwanConwan Member Posts: 28
    edited January 18
    Ah, then maybe I should explain what I'm doing/planning for my other characters:

    Imoen: Bow of Gesen
    Jaheira: Scimitars. I want to give her the Belm and Spectral Brand so she can do some solid dual-wielding.
    Minsc: Flail of the Ages and Defender of Easthaven.
    Aerie: Sling of Erevard with a shield and Mace of Disruption for when I want her to off-tank (playing around with this right now). I want to see if she and Minsc can become my undead banes.
    Sarevok: whatever two-handed weapon I can get. Maybe halberds. Ravager looks interesting. Otherwise two-handed sword since he comes with it naturally.

    So within that I originally planned to focus on shortswords, but both Carsomyr and Foebane are interesting options I considered because, as you said, shortswords are kinda weak.. Though I did assume I couldn't backstab when I thought of them, so hence me asking you now.

  • BracchusBracchus Member Posts: 24
    playing legit: Staves for backstabbing, no question. Outside of backstabbing my favorites are dual wielding Celestial Fury+Scarlet Ninja-to.
    Not playing legit: I edit CF in NearInfinity to be able to hit enemies that require +4 because I don't like carrying around items to play silly weapon swapping games for the sake of a few encounters.

    That's for when I did a F/T.
    Personally I don't like backstabbing and find it tedious so my mainchar thief of preference is a cheated dual class halfling F9/Swashie to abuse the AC cap with. I also ignore the traditional +APR offhand because I'm lazy and just keep picking WW HLA to cap out APR when I feel like it and like to dual Foebane +5 (with the unofficial hotfix for the bug) and Crom Faeyr. There's other weapons I could use but I usually end up spreading them around my party and I like them.
    I hope anyone who tries to jump down my throat for that cheat being OP has never played a vanilla sorcerer or F/M... lol. If that bothers anyone you'd really hate my DD/Cleric multi!! Or my DM Monk with the haste immunity removed and Monk Overhaul installed :D

    (again, still not as powerful as my vanilla sorc)

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