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Full custom party for trilogy enhanced edition run

Hi,

I want to make a full run with a custom party starting with BG1.

I want to go with :
Sorcerer
Kensai 13 dual Mage Invoker (with the full play throught you get enough xp)
Blade
Swashbuckler
Berserker
Cavalier

Will the cavalier will be enought to get all the cleric spell or do I need a real cleric or druid ?
better cleric or druid ? Witch on will be the strongest in TOB ?
I am not found of the multi class because I want a full kits party for more fun, and I already played BG1 and 2 with classic classes.

Comments

  • YigorYigor Member Posts: 223
    Very strong group, appropriate for Insane or LoB difficulty. ?
  • DinoDinDinoDin Member Posts: 1,458
    You don't need a cleric or druid the way you definitely need arcane casters, but the paladin is never going to have much spellcasting prowess. It tops out at just level four spells.

    You can certainly run the saga that way, but swapping the cavalier or the berserker for a cleric is likely to be a stronger build. You're already pretty heavy on physical damage prowess with the Kensai, Blade and Swashbuckler. And tankiness too. Wouldn't be a bad idea to throw in somebody who is a little more utility into that group.

    If you're going for a theme, that party is certainly strong enough to take everything on, no doubt. So the cleric swap is just a suggestion based on your questions. Clerics are stronger than druids.
  • jmerryjmerry Member Posts: 2,439
    Vagnar wrote: »
    Kensai 13 dual Mage Invoker (with the full play throught you get enough xp)
    Not a legal build. There is no way in the engine to have two kits on one character, and the standard rules don't allow you to have a kit on the second half of a dual class.

    Honestly, I see this party struggling early on. You have two good tanks at low levels, but are any of your group planning on using bows? You're over-focused on melee here, and long-term power at the expense of the short term. Then, to compound that, there's barely any healing - only the one instance of Lay on Hands. A strong party in BG1 should be using more ranged attacks than melee, because of the low hit point pools.

    So, recommendations:
    - Swap one of the warriors for a priest. Cleric kits are pretty small deviations from the base class with no downsides, but they still have some interesting abilities. Or you could go with a druid; those kits have more substantial advantages and drawbacks.
    - Turn one or two of your melee characters into archers. Not necessarily the kit, just a build that can use a bow well starting at level 1. They can develop melee abilities later on.
  • VagnarVagnar Member Posts: 2
    Hi,

    With modification after your advice I got this party :
    Sorcerer
    Kensei 13 dual Mage
    Blade
    Swashbuckler
    Archer
    Berserker 9 dual Cleric

    My Swashbuckler wil start with a crosbow in BG1 then go for melee specialisation.

    If I dual Berserker 9 Cleric, looking at the experience table it will be during Baldur's Gate: Siege of Dragonspear.
    So will it be an issue to do all BG1 and durlag tower with no cleric ?
  • GraionDilachGraionDilach Member Posts: 202
    jmerry wrote: »
    Vagnar wrote: »
    Kensai 13 dual Mage Invoker (with the full play throught you get enough xp)
    Not a legal build. There is no way in the engine to have two kits on one character, and the standard rules don't allow you to have a kit on the second half of a dual class.

    Well, there is an option involving black magic.

    https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/66521/enable-dual-classing-into-kits-now-with-proficiency-fix/p1
  • DinoDinDinoDin Member Posts: 1,458
    Just a final tip, but Swashbuckler may do better with dagger as a focus as opposed to crossbow. You'll get two attacks with throwing daggers automatically, and can add your strength bonus. This allows you specialize in a melee and ranged weapon right at the start, as opposed to waiting until level four. Daggers as a class do pretty well throughout the series, from the dagger of venom, to poison daggers in BG2, to the boomerang dagger.

    Albeit you'll just have to settle for non-enchanted throwing daggers at range, but that can work extremely well for the first half of BG1. But given your current party composition, the Swashbuckler may actually be your second best frontliner for the first half of BG1.

    Also to answer your above question, the real advantages to having a cleric, imo, are more in having key disabling spells. Command is extraordinarily strong in BG1 imo. Hold person is great. These are great for disabling some of the more dangerous enemies like the bounty hunter encounters. Some later spells too like remove paralysis can be life-savers.

    The weakness you're going to have, especially pre dual, is the over-reliance on weapon damage dealers and few disablers or dispellers. It's looking you're going to only have 1.5 (cuz of Bard) spellcasters for almost all of BG. Spellcasters can really neutralize alot of encounters in the game with sleep, blindness, web or the cleric spells I listed. Again, your group is definitely enough to take anything on, it's just a few encounters are going to be harder because you'll have few options to disable some of the high-damage or spellcasting enemies.
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 5,875
    i've ran a game where i had 6 swashbucklers on a team, so you can definitely beat the game without a cleric

    just buy up all the potions of healing from all the temples and you should be fine, plus there is so much gold in BG 1 that you can even afford to pay for healing services at temples ( i did this and still ended up with over 200 000+ )

    for weird and whacky builds like this that require some downtime to get going, its not uncommon to have 1 guy in melee and the rest in the back, firing away missile weapons

    for your berserker into cleric, i would suggest going berserker 13 then cleric, even at that high of a fighter level you can still hit level 38 in your cleric level, plus that will make it so you can have your berserker in melee for all of BG 1/ SoD while everyone else stays in the back until they are ready to go into melee in SoA which will be the same time you will be dualing over to cleric, so it will work out kind of perfect

    plus, believe it or not, i found that blades make really good archers with longbows, their offensive spin works with longbow so you can start at level 1 with 3 APR, with some great to hit and damage

    also as for SoD, pick pocket EVERYONE, everyone has potions of healing, even potions of extra healing, this will make it so you can even get by without a cleric in SoD, and if you need some summoned help, ( since you will be missing out on skelly warriors ) there are always wands of monster summoning, or scrolls of lesser elemental summoning ( their main advantage is that enemies require +2 weapons or better to hit them )
    DinoDinAerakar
  • jmerryjmerry Member Posts: 2,439
    sarevok57 wrote: »
    also as for SoD, pick pocket EVERYONE...

    Be warned, though. Picking pockets is subject to critical failure, so you will have to reload sometimes if you do this.

    Going without a healer is hardest in the early game - the first few chapters of BG1. Potions of healing are a pretty limited resource at that stage, unless you go out of your way to buy from the temple shops. And gold is a limited resource too, so that has its costs.
    For my no-spellcasting run, I had Ajantis with his Lay on Hands, a good protagonist with two instances of Bhaalspawn Cure Light Wounds, and Kagain with his regeneration. Plus that protagonist, who was my other tank, started with 18 Con and could reach 20 with the tome and Buckley's Buckler. That plus the potions I found kept up with the party's needs ... barely.

    By BG2 ... well, you find a lot of healing potions then. And you can pick up regeneration items. Even the more esoteric healing needs like restoration and resurrection can be covered with items, or celestial summons later on. Divine magic, at that point, is more for offense and buffing.
    Aerakar
  • DinoDinDinoDin Member Posts: 1,458
    Personally, I've done fine in no reload runs on BG1 without stocking up on cure wounds spells with priests. I'd suggest it for a druid, since their level one spells are either quite bad or situational. But command tends to get my parties more mileage than cure light wounds. BG1 gives you a fair amount of healing potions to start off, even without temple purchases. And even then, buying extra is a pretty good investment in the early segment as there's very little affordable gear that does much to improve the party. So long as you're stacking AC on your frontline tank and maintaining good position as you explore, you can do fine without needing much healing spells.
    Aerakar
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