Nalia vs. Jan
Klorox
Member Posts: 904
I’m looking for someone who can handle the locks and traps in this game and be a backup spellcaster to Edwin.
Looking at things, it basically boils down to Jan being a better thief and Nalia being a better spellcaster.
I’m told that the swapping out the Ring of Lockpicks and Ring of Danger Sense will allow Nalia to handle my thieving needs. Is this correct?
I plan on using Haer’Dalis in this party, so I’ll still have access to HLA traps later on, which I know are really good.
Looking at things, it basically boils down to Jan being a better thief and Nalia being a better spellcaster.
I’m told that the swapping out the Ring of Lockpicks and Ring of Danger Sense will allow Nalia to handle my thieving needs. Is this correct?
I plan on using Haer’Dalis in this party, so I’ll still have access to HLA traps later on, which I know are really good.
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Comments
For a more esoteric skill-booster ... in chapter 6, you can pick up a scroll of Shapechange. Cast that spell and transform into a giant troll to increase dexterity to 20, an effective +10 to OL and FT for Nalia. Nalia without any boosts is at 60 OL. With the ring, she's at 85 - not quite enough for the toughest locks. With the ring and the troll transformation, she's at 95 and can unlock anything that can be unlocked (except one optional door in ToB with a ludicrous 150 difficulty).
Having a different main mage, Edwin, charname or Neera, I prefer to take Jan, but it all depends on the play style, I love to use thieves, stabbing or preparing carpets of traps and luring the enemies into them and I would never spam fireballs into the fog of war using metagame knowledge, but if I have a thief that can actually spot the enemy while being unspotted I am only using my reconnaissance superiority, not cheating and this is only an example.
For some other players less interested in rogue tactics Nalia can be a better choice as she gets earlier higher level spells.
Nalia is way too much work to be effective as a thief, and she doesn't get thief HLA.. i.e Timestop traps and Spike Traps - which are so OP they turn the game on it's head when used actively.. hell just ordinary traps are awesome, and Jan gets plenty of them and high skill.. not to mention his Bruiser Mates which are great.
I hate Jan's character with a passion, and I am no fan of Nalia.. but if i had to choose, i'd take that filthy gnome.
It really depends on the play style, also I prefer Jan as a secondary mage, but I see why for other players Nalia can be the right choice.
Oh, wait. That's not Jan either.
Which one is better depends on the party's needs. Both of them have quite a lot going for them - a multiclass with the eventual full high-level potential of both thieves and mages, versus a full mage that can wield a bow and deal with traps and locks.
P.S.: In the category of undroppable jewelry on NPC mages, Nalia's ring is better than Edwin's amulet. At least, that's true for the way I play. Running out of spell slots is rarely a concern, while the +2 protection and 50% fire resistance are always excellent. Plus the ring doesn't lock her completely out of an item category.
Triple class mage does level slow and loses 9th slots.. but double class mage isn't far behind.
Skull trap is fine, but why use slots for that if you can have regular traps instead.. HW and IC I rarely use. Persistent area damage spells aren't too useful imo.. sure they're good, but mostly for killing mobs outside of view when cheesing.
In regular combat I find them too annoying.
Multi class mage and lev.9 spells, it it true that he will get them, but a single class reaches level 18 at 3M xp, so the end of SoA or in the worst case at the beginning of ToB (I am talking of 5-6 people completionist parties maybe with a couple of quest mods), while the double class will need 6M xp so will get his first lev. 9 spell late in ToB. Also the number of lev. 9 spells is relevant, the single class will top at 5 memorizations, the double at 2. Being specialized, and this is not the case of Nalia, somehow mitigates the problem of less memorizations of very high level spells, Jan starts with 2 lev. 9 ones at lev 18, with the same xp a single class has 3 and tops at 3 memorizations that are not 5, but are quite enough, i.e. he can choose CC, improved alacrity and planetar or switch the CC for spell strike or something else, but the specialized double can not mitigate at all the fact that he gets his first lev.9 spell much later, for most of ToB the single class can cast IA, or have a PI doing it, and unleash half spell book with the aid of RoV and AoP that make most of the spells casting instantaneous or very fast, while the best that the double class can do is to use some sequencer or trigger to cast something more then a spell/round.
Obviously the multi has the second class to balance it and can be a pretty decent Thief, Fighter or Cleric while also being a good mage, but as Mage IMHO is way behind the power of a single class, I am not talking of the global value he adds to the party here, just focus on his power as mage, I already told that in a party with Edvin or an other main mage I would go for Jan.
About the Skull Trap is a double use spell, can be used while in combat being capped at 20 and doing magic damage that is resisted by few while the fireball is capped at 10 and deals fire damage that is more often resisted.
Or it can be used as a trap and also here the play style is really relevant, I cast from FoW only at the start of the battle and only if I have detected unspotted the enemy before, then I make my party visible and attack, this is tactical dominance while for me abusing of metagame knowledge and the fact that the IA enemy don't react if they don't see you is cheap cheese, and I like the tasty one.
I use also the spell as trap in many situations, but also here never abusing of metagame, I would never set traps near a still blue enemy or in a known spawn point before triggering the spawn, but i.e. laying carpets of traps is one of my preferred ways to deal with the Beholders in the Temple Sewers or in the Underdark dungeon, then I make the Beholders follow one of my party members, hasted, along the trap carpet while my also hasted casters put some more ST or Delayed Fireballs right between the toon the beholders are following and them. Perfect timing is needed and also some planning, but many Beholders die while trying to follow and the survivors come to the party already at low health, so taking them down with ranged weapons is a quick work, they have no time to do real damage. This is only one example of how the traps, regular ones, HLA ones and spells that work as traps, can be used in a different way then killing mobs outside of view when cheesing.
Again this is completely dependant on the play style, you can play the game without setting a single trap or using a single ST spell and be really effective, I just have a lot of fun using them. And the fact that I mostly play with Tactics Mod where most of the cheese with traps is prevented, a split second before the real enemies spawn few low level enemies spawn, so they trigger the traps and take their damage, has helped me a lot in learning how to use effectively the traps avoiding easy tactics based on metagame, using those easy tricks and with enough spike traps you can even kill the Demon Prince in no time without any risk, but then what is the point to fight Demogorgon?