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Many as One and Silent King

IllustairIllustair Member Posts: 877
in Planescape: Torment: Enhanced Edition
Am I missing something as it feels like the whole quest feels incomplete. I completed first the Silent King part by exposing Soego. Did a little research later on and found out that I the only non-violent way to access the throne room is to talk to Stale Mary with high charisma AND before being released from confinement which I failed to do. Now, I have already met Many as One and he asks me to find out Silent King's weakness (which is the fact that SK is already dead, yes?).
1. There's no option to side with the SK/Hargrimm here? I prefer them over the rats as they have a more noble cause of protecting the dead as opposed to the rats that I guess it goes without saying are not worth siding with.
2. Even if I go against the rats and eliminated them all, there's no recognition whatsoever by the SK group of such fact. Really? Seems very odd.
3. Even if I take the rats' side, I can no longer do it in a non-violent way only because I got released before knowing the secret? It doesn't make sense at all. Why should that even be a condition? So, now my only option is if I ever side with the rats now is to force my way to the throne or maybe kill all the undead? That's not so PST to me.

Am I missing something? Is this intended?

Comments

  • DJKajuruDJKajuru Member Posts: 3,300
    You couldn't expose Soego AFAIK.
  • IllustairIllustair Member Posts: 877
    edited December 2018
    Sorry, I wasn't clear. I already exposed Soego and was allowed to leave, that's why I was barred from unfolding the truth regarding SK in a non-violent way (since such conversation option with Stale Mary is removed from the choices). Anyway, I chose to proceed and left it as it is. But it feels like I left the quest incomplete. I didn't even have the opportunity to kill Mantuok after he imprisoned me.
  • DJKajuruDJKajuru Member Posts: 3,300
    Illustair said:

    Sorry, I wasn't clear. I already exposed Soego and was allowed to leave, that's why I was barred from unfolding the truth regarding SK in a non-violent way (since such conversation option with Stale Mary is removed from the choices). Anyway, I chose to proceed and left it as it is. But it feels like I left the quest incomplete. I didn't even have the opportunity to kill Mantuok after he imprisoned me.

    Oh,about Mantuok ... keep playing and he'll come by again.
  • IllustairIllustair Member Posts: 877
    edited December 2018
    He did. I didn't like both Lothar and Mantuok, so it was satisfying that I could offer his skull and at the same time, I got to kill Lothar's servants as a payback of sorts for taking Morte. I tried killing Lothar too, but I'm sure you know what happened..;p
  • Markus_RamikinMarkus_Ramikin Member Posts: 25
    edited December 2018
    Illustair said:

    1. There's no option to side with the SK/Hargrimm here? I prefer them over the rats as they have a more noble cause of protecting the dead as opposed to the rats that I guess it goes without saying are not worth siding with.

    There should be an option to bluff the rats that the SK is really powerful and the rats shouldn't mess with the undead. However, I don't know if this is available if you didn't visit SK's throneroom.
    Illustair said:

    2. Even if I go against the rats and eliminated them all, there's no recognition whatsoever by the SK group of such fact. Really? Seems very odd.

    You didn't eliminate them all, just the ones that came out to you. Many as One does a blink-and-you-miss-it message about it. But yeah, the Dead Nations side of the story is basically over as soon as you've won your freedom and/or promised to Hagrimm to keep the secret.
    Illustair said:

    3. Even if I take the rats' side, I can no longer do it in a non-violent way only because I got released before knowing the secret? It doesn't make sense at all. Why should that even be a condition? So, now my only option is if I ever side with the rats now is to force my way to the throne or maybe kill all the undead? That's not so PST to me.

    Nah, it makes sense. PS:T does not handhold players like modern games do: opportunities may be permanently lost if you make certain choices. You could only visit the SK peacefully by appealing to Mary regarding your imprisonment; obviously once you're no longer imprisoned, it would no longer make sense, since Hagrimm really doesn't want you to make that visit and find out the secret.
  • IllustairIllustair Member Posts: 877
    Thanks. What stat does bluffing use? I can't remember having such option. My int and wis were fairly high at that point IIRC. Yeah, I thought I killed him, but I didn't and I realized later on that Many-as-One is not really just one overlord, but more like a collective...how should I put it, consciousness? I didn't realize it then but I think that's it - I only killed those who came at me, but there are a lot more of them.
  • Markus_RamikinMarkus_Ramikin Member Posts: 25
    Usually Charisma, but in this case, you don't need a stat check. I just checked the dialog file, and yeah, visiting the SK is the necessary condition.
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