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Was the thing with briefly recruiting companions before SoD fixed?

When Siege of Dragonspear launched, if you recruited Neera briefly to take her gem bag in the main BG1 campaign, then tried to recruit her again in SoD, she would still be level 1, like when you'd recruited her in BG1, with a mostly empty spellbook.

I seem to recall that they did something about that but I just wanna make sure before I proceed.

Comments

  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 21,492
    edited September 2020
    Hmm, why do you think that is a wrong behaviour? Companions you meet in SoD, if you had them, even temporary, in BG:EE, will be of the level they had when you dismissed them.

  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 1,330
    I didn't intend to make any value statement about the behavior. Just want to know if it's been changed. Thought I'd heard that it had been, but it sounds like it hasn't.

  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 21,492
    Well, you used the term "fixed" in the title, which made me think you consider this a bug. That said, I believe the behaviour hasn't been changed.

  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 1,330
    I wasn't sure what term to use there. If it had been changed, obviously that would mean you'd decided it was something that needed "fixing", but if it has not been changed, then the reverse holds true. Couldn't think of anything appropriately neutral to use until I knew where we'd landed on that ruling.

  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,009
    Hmm, why do you think that is a wrong behaviour? Companions you meet in SoD, if you had them, even temporary, in BG:EE, will be of the level they had when you dismissed them.

    To be fair, an npc recruiting at level 1 in a campaign levels 6-11 is kinda ridiculous. There should be a baseline level that all npcs in SoD start at, and IF they were recruited in BG1 AND the levels reached go above the default start, it should carry over. But level 1 in SoD is nonsense.

  • MaurvirMaurvir Member Posts: 922
    So is recruiting Neera, IMO... :wink:

  • megamike15megamike15 Member Posts: 2,598
    well if you recruited her for the gem bag and kicked her only to recruit her in sod you have only yourself to blame /s.

    but this is the main reason i use the tob level thing in the tweak pack.

  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 1,330
    ThacoBell wrote: »
    Hmm, why do you think that is a wrong behaviour? Companions you meet in SoD, if you had them, even temporary, in BG:EE, will be of the level they had when you dismissed them.

    To be fair, an npc recruiting at level 1 in a campaign levels 6-11 is kinda ridiculous. There should be a baseline level that all npcs in SoD start at, and IF they were recruited in BG1 AND the levels reached go above the default start, it should carry over. But level 1 in SoD is nonsense.

    I don't have too much experience with the latter half of the series, but is that how things work in Throne of Bhaal?

    If you recruit Viconia briefly at level 7, then re-recruit when you get into Throne of Bhaal, will she still be level 7 in a level 25+ campaign?

    Throne of Bhaal didn't have the same problem with reduced companion options meaning you're likely to take along somebody you didn't keep with you through the main campaign, but I could see how the system might get grandfathered in that way.

  • megamike15megamike15 Member Posts: 2,598
    Chronicler wrote: »
    ThacoBell wrote: »
    Hmm, why do you think that is a wrong behaviour? Companions you meet in SoD, if you had them, even temporary, in BG:EE, will be of the level they had when you dismissed them.

    To be fair, an npc recruiting at level 1 in a campaign levels 6-11 is kinda ridiculous. There should be a baseline level that all npcs in SoD start at, and IF they were recruited in BG1 AND the levels reached go above the default start, it should carry over. But level 1 in SoD is nonsense.

    I don't have too much experience with the latter half of the series, but is that how things work in Throne of Bhaal?

    If you recruit Viconia briefly at level 7, then re-recruit when you get into Throne of Bhaal, will she still be level 7 in a level 25+ campaign?

    Throne of Bhaal didn't have the same problem with reduced companion options meaning you're likely to take along somebody you didn't keep with you through the main campaign, but I could see how the system might get grandfathered in that way.

    tob added this thing where the npc will adjust to your level when recruited. the tweak pack adds this to bg1, sod and soa.

    ThacoBell
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,009
    Heck, even BG1 has that function now, at least to within a certain threshold. SoD is the odd one out that doesn't do this.

    megamike15
  • ArviaArvia Member, Moderator Posts: 1,546
    edited September 2020

    I don't have too much experience with the latter half of the series, but is that how things work in Throne of Bhaal?

    If you recruit Viconia briefly at level 7, then re-recruit when you get into Throne of Bhaal, will she still be level 7 in a level 25+ campaign?

    Yes, that's exactly how it is. I wanted to recruit Valygar in ToB once, because two of my companions got chunked in hell, but I had recruited him in BG2:EE for the sphere, so yep, he had the level that I left him with, way behind my other companions. Or at least that's how it is with companions you picked up in BG2, and ToB is just an extension. It doesn't work that way with former BG1 companions.

    So, the only conclusion is to never recruit someone and then drop them if you plan to pick them up again.

    It doesn't make too much sense in my opinion, because if you traveled with someone for a couple of days and then meet him again after 3 years, we would have gained some experience along the way, wouldn't he? Unless, of course, you tell him to wait for you at the Copper Coronet and he loyally sits there drinking ale until the Pocket Plane summons him ...

    Edit: overlooked what @megamike15 wrote... are you sure? If so, it must have happened a few months ago.

    Chronicler
  • jmerryjmerry Member Posts: 1,543
    The ToB summons are always the same versions of the character - 2.5 million XP, completely new gear ignoring what they had in SoA.

    This isn't new, either - I'm looking at an old copy of the game I happen to have, which I think is version 2.3.

    BGEE recruits get a catch-up trigger when they first join - XP of 2K, 4K, 8K, 16K, or 32K. SoA recruits get a similar catch-up trigger - XP of 125K, 250K, 500K, 750K, 1000K, or 1250K.

    It would be appropriate to give SoD re-recruits a catch-up trigger as well. What do the new NPCs start with?

    ArviaChroniclerThacoBell
  • ArviaArvia Member, Moderator Posts: 1,546
    jmerry wrote: »
    The ToB summons are always the same versions of the character - 2.5 million XP, completely new gear ignoring what they had in SoA.

    This isn't new, either - I'm looking at an old copy of the game I happen to have, which I think is version 2.3.

    BGEE recruits get a catch-up trigger when they first join - XP of 2K, 4K, 8K, 16K, or 32K. SoA recruits get a similar catch-up trigger - XP of 125K, 250K, 500K, 750K, 1000K, or 1250K.

    It would be appropriate to give SoD re-recruits a catch-up trigger as well. What do the new NPCs start with?

    You are right. My mistake. I just checked the save file that I was referring to. Valygar has 2.5 million XP.
    I just assumed it was where I had kicked him out of my BG2:EE party because he was level 12 at the beginning of ToB, while even my paladins with their slow progress were at level 18.

    Chronicler
  • ChroniclerChronicler Member Posts: 1,330
    jmerry wrote: »
    The ToB summons are always the same versions of the character - 2.5 million XP, completely new gear ignoring what they had in SoA.

    This isn't new, either - I'm looking at an old copy of the game I happen to have, which I think is version 2.3.

    BGEE recruits get a catch-up trigger when they first join - XP of 2K, 4K, 8K, 16K, or 32K. SoA recruits get a similar catch-up trigger - XP of 125K, 250K, 500K, 750K, 1000K, or 1250K.

    It would be appropriate to give SoD re-recruits a catch-up trigger as well. What do the new NPCs start with?

    There's definitely a catch up trigger if you're recruiting them for the first time. If you played through the entire main BG1 campaign, you're probably a bit higher leveled than the characters you recruit, so they'll start out at level 7ish, give or take depending on the class, and then gain a level or two of experience when you recruit them.

    It's just that if you were perhaps a little cavalier with these characters in the campaign where you had companions falling out your armpits, when you come back and find that they're now one of one or two characters on your end of the alignment spectrum of a given class then you've completely screwed yourself over, because they only scale up to the first time you recruit them in either campaign.

    ThacoBell
  • MaurvirMaurvir Member Posts: 922
    I know it probably avoids abuse of some sort, but I've always felt that NPCs should adjust every time you recruit them if there is a significant enough delta.

    However, knowing that isn't how it works should encourage people to be more cautious in loving and leaving NPC companions.

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