Cleric build
Jordi
Member Posts: 16
Im planning a new run and try something new so decided to go cleric, a full support cleric at the backline. Which do you think is the best race, the best kit, best weapon style, weapons to choose, stats, and maybe the most important spells?
Thanks.
Edit: my party:
Nalia
Haer Dalis
Keldorn
Minsc
MrTOB
Thanks.
Edit: my party:
Nalia
Haer Dalis
Keldorn
Minsc
MrTOB
Post edited by Jordi on
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Comments
That said, get sling proficiency early. Every other option you have is melee. If you're starting at level 1 in BG1, slings should be one of your two level 1 proficiencies, along with a melee weapon.
A sling can be used with a shield, but not another weapon. While you won't benefit from any of the weapon styles while wielding the sling, you'll definitely want a shield for that reason. And since you're probably going to have a one-handed weapon as your melee backup, switching to that will leave you in position to gain the benefits of shield style. Go ahead and pick up a point in that.
For your melee option, hammers are probably the best choice in BG1. Ashideena. That is all. By the time BG2 rolls around, you should have a second melee proficiency - and hey, here's the Flail of Ages. That'll carry you until endgame weapons become available, at which point you'll be proficient with everything and free to take whatever's left over after the party warriors make their choices.
Stats?
Strength is always nice, because it's damage on every attack including your sling. But at only one attack per round, it's not a big deal if you don't have that much. And you've got spells to boost your strength in battle if you need that. The biggest drawback of a low-strength cleric is the reduced armor selection - heavy armor weighs a lot and has high strength requirements (15 for full plate). Until you can afford to give them a strength-boosting item, you'll be restricted to lighter, and generally less protective, armor options.
Dexterity is valuable, as it is for every class. Better AC, better ranged THAC0. And there's only one set of 18 DEX gauntlets in each game.
Constitution is valuable, as it is for every class. No point in going past 16 unless you're a short race, though - clerics don't get any extra HP for more than that, but the last point of shorty save bonuses comes at 18 CON.
Intelligence has some value. But once you've got 9 so you can use scrolls and wands, any more is basically useless. All you get for it is lore, and the party rogues and mages will outperform you in that anyway.
Wisdom is your primary stat. Get as much as you can.
Charisma ... are you the party's "face", who stands up front and initiates conversation first? No? Then you don't need charisma. (Aside from some dialogues in Siege of Dragonspear which specifically rely on the protagonist's charisma score)
Race?
In my opinion, the cleric's biggest weakness is their poor spell save. So many threats will force your characters to save versus spells, or have bad things happen to them. Sure, clerics have buffs to grant immunity to those bad things, but will you always have those active? Probably not. And if you want to boost your passive defenses, you can't go wrong with a shorty. Dwarves are kind of the obvious choice here, as the other two short races have wisdom penalties.
Though really, you'll be fine with any race, especially as a back-line character.
Kit?
All of the cleric kits follow the same formula - pick a god, get a couple of special abilities, restrict your alignment to within one step of the god's alignment. No reason not to choose one, unless you have a concept that doesn't match any of the available gods.
Of the available kits, the priest of Lathander is generally considered the most powerful, on the strength of their "Boon of Lathander" ability. Though that's a self-only combat buff; it doesn't really mesh with the back-line support character you want to build. Just take a look for yourself, and go for whatever looks good if it fits your character concept.
Spells?
As a cleric, you know all the spells you can possibly cast automatically. And if you memorize a spell one day and decide you don't like it, you can just memorize a different spell the next day. Feel free to experiment.
If you're in the back, you'll probably focus less on the personal combat buffs like Draw Upon Holy Might and more on the direct combat spells like Hold Person. The tricky part is how to balance between healing, party buffs, and those combat spells. And I don't have an easy answer for that. Adjust to taste.
As mentioned by jmerry, Boon of Lathander is great, but I like the Tyr Priest's Exaltation ability which reflects my style of gameplay (and at the moment I like to play LN characters).
The boon of Lathander makes a Cleric even stronger if used with the proper buffs active, he should do more than 100 dmg ranged or more then 150 mlee each round if also improved hasted.
lvl 2 fighter is enough to get a noteworthy boost, but 7 is of course better.
You'll still be limited to cleric weapons, but you can pip up in your chosen weapon and get more attacks and damage each round.
Still a support character but you can actually do decent work with a sling through the entire saga if you get 7 fighter lvls.. or turn into a ridiculously hulking melee monster..
The xp lost for having 2 lvls of fighter, or 7 even, is negligible even in BG1 as it barely affects your max lvl due to xp cap and how the xp requirements start ramping up past lvl 7 (You'd get your fighter lvls back pretty much immediately upon starting Dragonspear or BG2 if you drop SoD.. the way the xp cap works, lvl 8 cleric is max in BG1 for single class cleric (lvl 7 is 55K xp, lvl 8 is 110K xp and lvl 9 is 225K xp.. games hard cap is 161k, so with Fighter 7 dualed to Cleric, you'd max at lvl 7 in BG1.. lvl 8 if you go single class)
The XP cap in TOB is 8 million, though you'll likely peak out at 6m or so with a full party, so those 67K spent on fighter means nothing in any of the games really.
You'd play half of BG1 as a fighter though, and I guess that's not what you're truly after.. but it's worth keeping in mind, even just 2 lvls of fighter will turn things on it's head and as imo better than even Boon of Lathander. You could also roll 18/00 in Strength which is significant compared to just 18, if you donate the Strength tome to someone else (But why would you?)
Longwinded post for something you kinda didn't ask for, but I thought i'd just throw it out here in case it'd catch your interest.
But this has worked out quite well. Actual grand mastery in Warhammer by the end of BG1! (That’s 3 pips as a 3rd level fighter, one each at 4th and 8th cleric).
The character has 40% of party kills at the mid-point of ToB, in a party that includes Keldorn and Minsc. And I’m getting scolded over on the Reddit Forums for not knowing how to do a power build… Morons.
3.5 APR, 7 improved hasted, with 25 STR while sparing the STR enhancing items for the rest of the party make him really strong even in late ToB.
But also the single class, better with the Lathander kit, is quite strong when using buffs and the Boon as he reaches 6 APR buffed and lets you play as cleric for the whole saga, so is a perfectly viable choice giving all the utility of his divine spells to the party and being a good damage dealer when is needed.
A fighter -> thief or fighter -> druid dual can pull off grand mastery within the BG1 campaign. No other dual-class combination can.
Not really on topic for this thread, of course - the OP was asking about how to build a pure cleric, and a backline one at that. And on that note, what advantages does a pure cleric have over an early fighter -> cleric dual?
- You can take a cleric kit. They're all pure upside, unlike kits for other classes.
- You can be something other than human. All of the nonhuman races have mechanical advantages, while humans don't get anything special.
Edit: apologies for my poor english
It worked fine for me! I EEKeepered the initial scores but didn't touch it during later game play. Although if I'm reading your comment right it might be because I had SoD installed? Interesting anyway. It was the lowest level I'd ever dualled and was quite pleased with results.
If it worked for you, it's because you've changed the rules. Is there a copy of PROFSMAX.2DA in your override folder?
I’m currently at the end of an SCS/Ascension Insane trilogy solo no reload with a single class cleric. She has by now reached the final hurdle, the confrontation with Melissan and The Five. Her fate will be determined in the next couple days. Her run is documented at TavernRPG, in the Candlekeep Annex thread, for those who are interested.
To my surprise, my cleric has crushed it up to this point. I’ve soloed SCS/Ascension with a variety of classes in the no reload context- from sorcerers, to F/Ms, to M/Ts, to bards, to paladins, to barbarians, to thieves, to rangers. Few, if any, have made it to this point in the adventure with greater ease. It may surprise you to hear that. It surprises me to say it, but the evidence is clear. A cleric can, in fact, rock the party from the Keep to The Throne. Don’t underestimate them. I once did. I won’t any longer.
My cleric is a chaotic neutral halfling priest of Talos, named Astrid. I prefer to avoid discussions of which build is the “best” or most “powerful” because I feel they are misguided, but the chaotic neutral priest of Talos has a lot of strengths- particularly in an SCS setup with alignment appropriate fiends installed.
Neutral priests have an almost unfair advantage, since they can cast Holy Smite and Unholy Blight while enjoying immunity to both- likewise for the Holy Word and Unholy Word pairing. With SCS's alignment appropriate fiends component installed, the chaotic orientation has an advantage, too: their Gate spell summons balors, rather than pit fiends. Setting aside kit considerations, chaotic neutral is a strong choice from a power gaming perspective.
Moving on to kit attributes, the priest of Talos is under appreciated. The Lightning Bolt + Storm Shield combination is immensely useful and fun to play with. At low levels it’s better suited to a soloist, but a single arcane L7 can protect an entire party from Lightning Bolts, via Limited Wish. There are other avenues for protecting a party, too, of course, if you’re willing to invest more spell slots. For a soloist, Lightning Bolt + Storm Shield is game changing in BG1 and early BG2. It continues to be useable up into ToB. The Storm Shield, in isolation, remains an outstanding defensive tool up through the very end of the adventure. There are others ways of acquiring elemental resistance, true, but the ability to apply 100% resistance to fire, cold and electricity with a single spell equivalent action post Remove or Breach never gets old.
On balance, the priest of Talos is a strong kit, enhanced by the avenues opened by the EEs broadening of alignments, and SCS’s alignment appropriate fiends. Astrid has been highly capable, and a blast to play. I’d encourage others to check the build out. Feel free to ask if you have any questions. I’d be happy to offer tips to my fellow cleric lovers.
Cheers,
A.
She had infinite spells and always had shit up, i couldnt touch her, constantly spamming earthquake and summons.
For vanilla Mel solo cleric tactics, I'll refer you to @Enuhal , if he's available. He runs vanilla often, and he's highly skilled with divine casters.
Cheers,
A.
Would you kindly link your playthrough ?
Sure! The run starts here:
TavernRPG, The Candlekeep Annex: Astrid, Halfling Priest of Talos
I hope you enjoy it! It’s been a fun play through!
Cheers,
A.
And since all the kits have access to the neutral sphere in the EE, there's no incentive, other than role playing, to be either good or evil.
The broadening of alignments has its merits, but it sort of deprecates good and evil, which I don't love.