What alignment do you intend to play? I've gone Neutral Evil, the familiar for this alignment is the Dust Mephit, which can cast Glitterdust once per day and Glass Dust twice a day. For enemies that fail their save vs. Glitterdust, they are blinded and get (amongst other things) -4 to subsequent saves (e.g. Jester song...), so works nicely for a Jester PC :-)
I also want to play evilly, or at least run with evil characters. The Dust Mephit does seem like a natural choice for the Jester. And I think Neutral Evil fits very nicely with what a "classical" Jester would ideally be: jostling for the ear of the "king" (or other powerful person) so as to advance her own position, power, and wealth; but at the same time never believing in any real allegiance and subtly manipulating those in power with her charm.
But I was actually thinking of trying the Chaotic Neutral alignment, if simply to fit the way I plan to do battle (as in my description above). After all I am not in any royal court, I am in the wilderness most days, and I am quite mad, or perilously unstable.
However, the familiar for CN characters is the cat, but I have no particular preference for it. I am not sure how the cat will really be of much benefit to me other than by adding it to my arsenal and having the option to fling it into the eyes of an onrushing orc à la Minsc ["go for the eyes, boo...!"] after all, familiars can be mere inventory items, yes?).
Thanks for the interesting query. I guess my answer in sum: I want to play CN but i'd rather a dust mephit!
The cat could be a useful scout early on, but not really much use for battles. Go evil, you know you want to! :-)
Thanks! Unfortunately still waiting for the game to arrive on Mac because that is my machine at the moment. Haven't played the old BG in ages but I feel like I am playing it already in my head (character creation is just about done, I am lining up NPCs, and I ain't even got the game yet!)
I couldn't wait for the Mac version, I pre-ordered the Windows version and am running it on my MacBook Air via Bootcamp, though I'll probably get the Mac native version when it comes out, to support further development for this platform.
Thanks! Unfortunately still waiting for the game to arrive on Mac because that is my machine at the moment. Haven't played the old BG in ages but I feel like I am playing it already in my head (character creation is just about done, I am lining up NPCs, and I ain't even got the game yet!)
That's the spirit!
Also, don't go Chaotic Neutral. I did, for 4 levels, because I completely forgot bards can use Find Familiar. Then I was stuck with a stupid cat that could do nothing and every time the damn thing died, I found myself insanely jelly of Oxford_Guy's mephit. According to today's update, the cat didn't *have* an attack, so no wonder it sucked. It's fixed now, but whatever, I already shadowkeepered my jester to neutral evil because the mephit-envy was killing me. (And I was running with a mostly evil party out of habit anyway.)
Trying hard not to spoiler with this, but - if you plan ahead for NPCs, there's one gentleman an evil jester can't dismiss due to the insane amounts of Invisibility he can cast. I'd only plan 4 to run with and leave the 5th slot open for when you get the game. There are 4 new folks, 2 of them evil, and both very worth considering.
Also, don't go Chaotic Neutral. I did, for 4 levels, because I completely forgot bards can use Find Familiar. Then I was stuck with a stupid cat that could do nothing and every time the damn thing died,
@KidCarnival Hmmm, you have a really valid argument! And it is true, I want to play evil alignment, & cats do nothing for me. A Dust Mephit would be cool... Yeah, I suppose you have both converted me. I don't know nothing about Shadowkeeper so I better get it right from the start! And yes, I definitely will be considering the latest NPCs.
Thanks! Unfortunately still waiting for the game to arrive on Mac because that is my machine at the moment. Haven't played the old BG in ages but I feel like I am playing it already in my head (character creation is just about done, I am lining up NPCs, and I ain't even got the game yet!)
That's the spirit!
Also, don't go Chaotic Neutral. I did, for 4 levels, because I completely forgot bards can use Find Familiar. Then I was stuck with a stupid cat that could do nothing and every time the damn thing died, I found myself insanely jelly of Oxford_Guy's mephit. According to today's update, the cat didn't *have* an attack, so no wonder it sucked. It's fixed now, but whatever, I already shadowkeepered my jester to neutral evil because the mephit-envy was killing me. (And I was running with a mostly evil party out of habit anyway.)
BTW you don't even have to learn Find Familiar as a spell (unless you plan on letting your Familiar die, which is not a good idea, as you lose both the extra 12 HP *and* 1 Con permanently), as you can just cast it from a scroll that drops relatively early on. I also found another one later (that one from a random drop, I think).
Trying hard not to spoiler with this, but - if you plan ahead for NPCs, there's one gentleman an evil jester can't dismiss due to the insane amounts of Invisibility he can cast. I'd only plan 4 to run with and leave the 5th slot open for when you get the game. There are 4 new folks, 2 of them evil, and both very worth considering.
There's only 3 new folk, 1 of them evil. You're not thinkg of Edwin are you? He's not new and was in the old BG1 game, but is evil and gets an insane amount of spells (and can cast invisibility, unlike Xzar, but not Identify...). Actually, I'm currently planning to play without Edwin (just for a change) and go with Neera instead...
Thanks! Unfortunately still waiting for the game to arrive on Mac because that is my machine at the moment. Haven't played the old BG in ages but I feel like I am playing it already in my head (character creation is just about done, I am lining up NPCs, and I ain't even got the game yet!)
That's the spirit!
Also, don't go Chaotic Neutral. I did, for 4 levels, because I completely forgot bards can use Find Familiar. Then I was stuck with a stupid cat that could do nothing and every time the damn thing died, I found myself insanely jelly of Oxford_Guy's mephit. According to today's update, the cat didn't *have* an attack, so no wonder it sucked. It's fixed now, but whatever, I already shadowkeepered my jester to neutral evil because the mephit-envy was killing me. (And I was running with a mostly evil party out of habit anyway.)
BTW you don't even have to learn Find Familiar as a spell (unless you plan on letting your Familiar die, which is not a good idea, as you lose both the extra 12 HP *and* 1 Con permanently), as you can just cast it from a scroll that drops relatively early on. I also found another one later (that one from a random drop, I think).
Trying hard not to spoiler with this, but - if you plan ahead for NPCs, there's one gentleman an evil jester can't dismiss due to the insane amounts of Invisibility he can cast. I'd only plan 4 to run with and leave the 5th slot open for when you get the game. There are 4 new folks, 2 of them evil, and both very worth considering.
There's only 3 new folk, 1 of them evil. You're not thinkg of Edwin are you? He's not new and was in the old BG1 game, but is evil and gets an insane amount of spells (and can cast invisibility, unlike Xzar, but not Identify...). Actually, I'm currently planning to play without Edwin (just for a change) and go with Neera instead...
Have just read that the elven chain doesn't drop until:
The Priest in the fight with Simmeon.
That means you have to have
Dorn
in your party until then (which means playing evil, or at best neutral, really), and it's along time for a Bard to wait for some decent permanent protection which they can spell cast in, so until then you have to rely in the Shield Amulet or Bracers (and the AC 6 ones you don't get until quite late) if you don't want to waste level 1 slots on Armour or Shield :-(
I'm currently playing with an evil Skald and I'm quite enjoying it, but there's a question I'd like to ask as this is my first time as a bard: Do you guys think that bards are still great characters to play in BG2 and ToB, or do they lose some of their use against high level enemies?
Bards get only better in BG2. They aren't as weak as monks in comparison (barely useful in BG1, badass strong in BG2), but it's a close second in the category "classes that turn out to be way stronger than BG1 suggests".
@Oxford_Guy: Yes, that is who I mean, not Edwin. Even compared to him, Mr. X gets an insane amount of extra spells. Isn't Edwin's necklace good for extra level 1 and 2 only? Mr. X goes up to extra level 4 spells via personal item. Though Edwin will do fine until you get the gentleman I was talking about, after that, you can adjust Edwin's spellbook and replace Invisibility to have some more damage spells or whatyouneed.
Find Familiar is available as scroll in... High Hedge and Feldpost Inn, I think, and it's an early drop as mentioned above. I guess you can get it elsewhere, too. I got mine from the encounter.
@Hesse: It's up for debate if jesters (or bards in general) are great characters in BG1. Many many people say bards with the exception of blades and maybe skalds are utterly useless. Jester is frequently listed as worse than a straight bard. Obviously, the jester club in this topic disagrees, but it's not that bards are universally seen as a strong class.
I just have very bad luck with the confuse song...their 15+ songs though are bad ass. Slow at 15 and incapitate at 21...and they have to save against all 3 effects every round, so you're bound to something.
Pre-15, they're about the same really crappy bard song vs unlikely to work confuse song that requires 2 failures in a row to actually do something...15+, the Jester demolishes the plain bard, the Slow song if the enemies fail the save which lacks a bonus like confuse and incapacitate do making it more likely to succeed, gives a 4 thac0 and AC penalty, doubles cast times, halves movement speed, and sets weapon speed to 10, and can effectively hit the whole screen. It's almost like a reversed 15+ skald song on the enemies. The incapacitate song at 21 is pretty neat, if it works. But the beauty is, they have to save against all possible effects every turn...the jester becomes a walking debuff bot, that can also throw on dual-speed weapons, cast improved haste, and tenser's and rip into the enemies with only slightly less effectiveness then a blade (who is flat out inferior once his daily OS uses are gone)
BTW don't forget that Jester song ignores magic resistance, and spells like Doom, Greater Malaison and Gliiterdust (if the save is failed) all give penalties to subsequent saves, making the song more likely to succeed. Also the Jester can be invisible whilst singing!
BTW when a Jester (or any Bard for that matter) gets the HLA Enhanced Bard Song, it looks like this *replace* your default Bard song. For Jester, in particular, it's a shame you don't get a choice, for different situations, but according to the description, it replaces it :-(
Also which other HLAs can Bards take (I know they can take the awesome Use Any Item and I think Spike Trap, for starts) - are they the same as the Thief ones, or can they take any others?
One post even goes as far to say "You really don't have to replace the Jester's song if you have the latest offical patches installed. One component there makes the Jester's Bard Song better as he gains levels. (more spell effects, no save vs bonus)"
I'm not sure which component that is, though, an HLA? Which one?
BTW when a Jester (or any Bard for that matter) gets the HLA Enhanced Bard Song, it looks like this *replace* your default Bard song. For Jester, in particular, it's a shame you don't get a choice, for different situations, but according to the description, it replaces it :-(
But will the jester song not fail against most enemies? By the time you get the HLAs, I mean.
BTW when a Jester (or any Bard for that matter) gets the HLA Enhanced Bard Song, it looks like this *replace* your default Bard song. For Jester, in particular, it's a shame you don't get a choice, for different situations, but according to the description, it replaces it :-(
But will the jester song not fail against most enemies? By the time you get the HLAs, I mean.
Depends if you've reduced their saves with other spells first, I guess...
As it is, though, arguably even Skald is still better than a Jester with Enhanced Bard Song, as still gets his/her innate +1 to hit/damage (though still poor pickpockets, for what it's worth).
Still 3 million XP is a long way off and in the mean time the Jester Song is fun to use
I like picking either the Jester or Skald, making them invisible, and having them sing all the time. If you want a character who is more similar to a fighter/mage than a bard then pick the blade. If you are going to use spells then make them support/buff spells only.
Except that bards will consistently out level mages for most of the saga (until lvl 20 when 99.9% of non-epic spells stop scaling), meaning bard spells will hit harder (is +1 over a mage during BG1, and +2 through most of BG2, getting a +3 bonus briefly at 19 and 20 before it caps and the mage can catch up). Leave the buffing and debuff to mages where it belongs, for 6th and under spells.
Comments
Also, don't go Chaotic Neutral. I did, for 4 levels, because I completely forgot bards can use Find Familiar. Then I was stuck with a stupid cat that could do nothing and every time the damn thing died, I found myself insanely jelly of Oxford_Guy's mephit. According to today's update, the cat didn't *have* an attack, so no wonder it sucked. It's fixed now, but whatever, I already shadowkeepered my jester to neutral evil because the mephit-envy was killing me. (And I was running with a mostly evil party out of habit anyway.)
Trying hard not to spoiler with this, but - if you plan ahead for NPCs, there's one gentleman an evil jester can't dismiss due to the insane amounts of Invisibility he can cast. I'd only plan 4 to run with and leave the 5th slot open for when you get the game. There are 4 new folks, 2 of them evil, and both very worth considering.
Baeloth?
The Priest in the fight with Simmeon.
That means you have to have
Do you guys think that bards are still great characters to play in BG2 and ToB, or do they lose some of their use against high level enemies?
@Oxford_Guy: Yes, that is who I mean, not Edwin. Even compared to him, Mr. X gets an insane amount of extra spells. Isn't Edwin's necklace good for extra level 1 and 2 only? Mr. X goes up to extra level 4 spells via personal item.
Though Edwin will do fine until you get the gentleman I was talking about, after that, you can adjust Edwin's spellbook and replace Invisibility to have some more damage spells or whatyouneed.
Find Familiar is available as scroll in... High Hedge and Feldpost Inn, I think, and it's an early drop as mentioned above. I guess you can get it elsewhere, too. I got mine from the encounter.
@Hesse: It's up for debate if jesters (or bards in general) are great characters in BG1. Many many people say bards with the exception of blades and maybe skalds are utterly useless. Jester is frequently listed as worse than a straight bard. Obviously, the jester club in this topic disagrees, but it's not that bards are universally seen as a strong class.
Pre-15, they're about the same really crappy bard song vs unlikely to work confuse song that requires 2 failures in a row to actually do something...15+, the Jester demolishes the plain bard, the Slow song if the enemies fail the save which lacks a bonus like confuse and incapacitate do making it more likely to succeed, gives a 4 thac0 and AC penalty, doubles cast times, halves movement speed, and sets weapon speed to 10, and can effectively hit the whole screen. It's almost like a reversed 15+ skald song on the enemies. The incapacitate song at 21 is pretty neat, if it works. But the beauty is, they have to save against all possible effects every turn...the jester becomes a walking debuff bot, that can also throw on dual-speed weapons, cast improved haste, and tenser's and rip into the enemies with only slightly less effectiveness then a blade (who is flat out inferior once his daily OS uses are gone)
See: http://gamebanshee.com/baldursgateii/abilities/enhancedbardsong.php
-10 AC for the Bard
10% Magic Restistance for the Bard
also for allies (and presumably the Bard too if he can "song twist')
+4 To Hit/+4 Damage for Allies -4 to allies AC
Immunity to fear, stun and confusion
+5% Magic Resistance
Immunity to Normal Weapons
You start getting HLAs at 3 million XP (Level 24 for a Bard, I think)
What are the other Bard-unique HLAs? I presume Magic Flute is one?:
http://gamebanshee.com/baldursgateii/abilities/magicflute.php
Also which other HLAs can Bards take (I know they can take the awesome Use Any Item and I think Spike Trap, for starts) - are they the same as the Thief ones, or can they take any others?
BTW this thread regarding Bard HLAs makes interesting reading:
http://www.sorcerers.net/forums/showthread.php?t=21970
One post even goes as far to say "You really don't have to replace the Jester's song if you have the latest offical patches installed. One component there makes the Jester's Bard Song better as he gains levels. (more spell effects, no save vs bonus)"
I'm not sure which component that is, though, an HLA? Which one?
http://www.planetbaldursgate.com/bg2/character/highlevel/pools/#bard
By the time you get the HLAs, I mean.
As it is, though, arguably even Skald is still better than a Jester with Enhanced Bard Song, as still gets his/her innate +1 to hit/damage (though still poor pickpockets, for what it's worth).
Still 3 million XP is a long way off and in the mean time the Jester Song is fun to use