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best group format

alestusalestus Member Posts: 13
in Archive (General Discussion)
wanna know how people form their group

I myself have it like this at the moment:

my char - assassin
Ajantis
Khalid
Jaheira
Viconia
Neera

considering replacing Khalid with Baeloth but not so sure if that's a good idea
«1

Comments

  • YouYou Member Posts: 6
    Ajantis is paladin, Viconia and Baeloth are drows, will they fight each other to death?
  • LemernisLemernis Member, Moderator Posts: 4,318
    Looks good. That's a solid party. You got melee, healing, thieving, and spellcasting pretty well covered.

    You can use Viconia on the front line along with Ajantis and Jaheira. That's plenty of peeps. So you can certainly afford to swap Khalid for Baeloth if you want to try him out and get some more spellcasting firepower. Khalid is force-paired with Jaheira, but there are ways around that.

    I like playing mixed alignment parties myself. I never play the same party twice.
  • KidCarnivalKidCarnival Member Posts: 3,747
    There are several groups I like, it depends on my charname.

    Neutral evil assassin usually goes with Xzar (dualed to cleric), Edwin, Kagain, Dorn - 6th slot is Branwen or Viconia on lower levels until Xzar gets useful as cleric; then I often switch the pure cleric out for Eldoth as support caster (for the spells Edwin can't learn).

    Neutral evil jester is similar; dual Xzar to cleric (and cover divination with his mage levels), keep Monty as thief/frontline support, Kagain, Edwin, and either a second thief (dualed Shar-Teel; Monty handles traps/locks, Shar-Teel backstabs) or recently Baeloth if I feel like depending more on magic.


    I see no reason why you shouldn't replace Khalid with Baeloth, except I'm not sure if Ajantis will recognize him as evil now. The patch notes say that Baeloth now gets the rep drop like Viconia and Dorn, could be he always fell or now falls in the category of potential targets for Ajantis. As far as I remember, Viconia for some reason didn't, but she was the exception. If you're ok with a small risk that Ajantis might attack Baeloth, go for it. (If anyone has tested or looked that up, I'd be interested in knowing - does Ajantis attack Dorn or Baeloth?)
    Also keep in mind you need to make sure you remove Khalid safely (let him die, petrify him, lock him in a house) to not also have Jaheira leave.
  • Oxford_GuyOxford_Guy Member Posts: 3,729
    My current mixed-alignment party is:

    CHARNAME (CN Blade)
    Dorn
    Viconia
    Imoen
    Kivan (will replace with Coran)
    Neera
  • KidCarnivalKidCarnival Member Posts: 3,747
    I ran my blackguard mixed, with a party of more or less 5.

    LE Blackguard - tank/dd
    Xzar - dualed as usual, with Viconia on lower levels
    Edwin
    Kivan as second frontliner with halberd
    Coran as thief/archer (he's so freaking useless in melee... I had Safana for a while and they shared thief duties, but when I decided to settle for Coran due to bow prof being more useful than darts, I shadowkeepered the skills to traps/locks, where he had locks/pickpocket before)

    As 6th members, I had:
    Viconia
    Safana
    Tiax
    Quayle (who ended up as the 6th in endgame, and it's not the worst thing to have an illusionist)

    With my current assassin, I also run mixed, with the main reason of using NPCs I usually don't take along and seeing if they may be options for my usual parties.

    Neutral evil assassin
    Edwin & Kivan (melee oriented) as "permanent" party members.
    Had Neera before recruiting Edwin; completed Adoy's map, then made the mage switch
    Had Ajantis, traded him in for Dorn after mage switch to reduce risk of him killing Edwin
    Have Rasaad to complete his quest; semi-permanent since the quest triggers late.
    Have Viconia, will replace her with Yeslick soon (unless Kivan kills her first, then I take Branwen until I get Yeslick)
    Have Dorn, will replace him with Eldoth after completing questline to get Elven Chain
    After Rasaad's quest, I'll trade him for Faldorn for level 5 druid spells

    So the final party will be: charname, Kivan, Edwin, Yeslick, Eldoth, Faldorn.
  • LemernisLemernis Member, Moderator Posts: 4,318
    edited February 2013
    Yep, to echo what @KidCarnival said, not all NPCs get along. But that's all part of the fun, at least for me. Mix them up at your own risk in that respect.

    The other thing to bear in mind is that if your reputation reaches 18 evil NPCs will leave. So you can do things like get caught stealing to lower rep. Killing anyone that doesn't have a red circle under them (aka innocent) will usually (always?) result in an 8 point rep loss. (Edit: Okay, it's variable, see @KidCarnival's post on this below.)

    You may already know this, but to remove a paired NPC have the main character take the NPC alone into a building (or building floor) that you don't need to revisit (i.e., don't use an inn or a store), and remove the party member there. The removed NPC will stay put there. Actually, you can also have other party members with you when you do this--just not the other member of the pair that you wish to keep (that character should remain outside). Whenever those two members of the NPC pair see each other they will seek to rejoin.
    Post edited by Lemernis on
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  • WowoWowo Member Posts: 2,064
    1 main tank (Khalid, Ajantis, Kagain)
    2 damage dealers (Minsc, Shar-Teel, Kivan, Montaron, Dorn, Coran)
    2 healers (Jaheira, Branwen, Viconia, Faldorn, Yeslick, Quayle, Tiax)
    2 arcanes (bard, sorcerer or Mage)

    I guess that adds up to 7 but there's always overlap and charname fits in wherever.
  • KidCarnivalKidCarnival Member Posts: 3,747
    Killing commoners/guards and rep loss depends on your rep at the time. The lower you already are, the less rep you lose. And the higher your rep is, the more you lose. There's a chart somewhere on the forum. I think if your rep is 20, you drop to 10 (-10). I often kill commoners around 15 or 16 and bounce back to 9.
  • Oxford_GuyOxford_Guy Member Posts: 3,729
    Lemernis said:

    Yep, to echo what @KidCarnival said, not all NPCs get along. But that's all part of the fun, at least for me. Mix them up at your own risk in that respect.

    The other thing to bear in mind is that if your reputation reaches 18 evil NPCs will leave. So you can do things like get caught stealing to lower rep. Killing anyone that doesn't have a red circle under them (aka innocent) will usually (always?) result in an 8 point rep loss. (Edit: Okay, it's variable, see @KidCarnival's post on this below.)

    You may already know this, but to remove a paired NPC have the main character take the NPC alone into a building (or building floor) that you don't need to revisit (i.e., don't use an inn or a store), and remove the party member there. The removed NPC will stay put there. Actually, you can also have other party members with you when you do this--just not the other member of the pair that you wish to keep (that character should remain outside). Whenever those two members of the NPC pair see each other they will seek to rejoin.

    Or you can make one of the pair do the "basilisk walk" in Mutamin's garden...
  • mjsmjs Member Posts: 742
    i like my teams to follow this format

    tank
    healer
    rogue
    mage
    damage dealer
    damage dealer

    where the healer doubles as a tank (ala jahiera or branwen) the rogue doubles as something else (ala bg2 imoen, coran, tiax etc) and the damage dealers are either an extra mage or something like a haer'dalis or a monk (for later bg2) or just a superfluous banter character. it gives very flexible and capable parties
  • KidCarnivalKidCarnival Member Posts: 3,747
    Made some progress with my mixed party (around the assassin charname). I switched out Viconia for Yeslick, and don't understand what's going anymore. Viconia with Stupifier and her 19 dex hit as much as you'd expect... but Yeslick with Ashideena and not-19 dex is a killer. I had planned him as a self buffing tank, but he actually keeps up with Kivan in the damage department. Why?! That should be fun once he gets the ogre gloves for 18/00. :D
  • apeterssonapetersson Member Posts: 33
    dex is only used for ranged THAC0. for the melee weapons the modifier from str is used to determine the chance of hit.
  • SwordsNotWordsSwordsNotWords Member Posts: 147
    Warrior
    Warrior
    Healer
    Thief
    Mage
    Mage
  • KidCarnivalKidCarnival Member Posts: 3,747
    That certainly explains it. I never noticed what a huge difference it can make... I never had Yeslick in the party until now, and my go to cleric, dualed Xzar, sticks to ranged weapons.
  • RedWizardRedWizard Member Posts: 242
    Fighter/Mage dual with longbow
    Dorn
    Kagain
    Montaron
    Xzar
    Viconia

    I'll probably kill Xzar for Baeloth in a game to see how he is.
  • FiachFiach Member Posts: 231
    I have a few parties on the go, my favourite would be :

    PC Cleric
    Viconia
    Shar-Teel
    Dorn
    Edwin
    Neera.

    So, you can get stuck into the action or buff as required.


  • FiachFiach Member Posts: 231
    Lemernis said:



    You may already know this, but to remove a paired NPC have the main character take the NPC alone into a building (or building floor) that you don't need to revisit (i.e., don't use an inn or a store), and remove the party member there. The removed NPC will stay put there. Actually, you can also have other party members with you when you do this--just not the other member of the pair that you wish to keep (that character should remain outside). Whenever those two members of the NPC pair see each other they will seek to rejoin.

    I would like to clarify this if possible please.

    I tried this with Khalid, I sent him into Kaigans shop (after recruiting Kagain), disbanded him and a few seconds later, he came out of the shop to remonstrate with me, then buggered off with jahira, now I just send him for a walk towards enemies on his own, witn no gear.

  • KidCarnivalKidCarnival Member Posts: 3,747
    That is strange, usually NPCs should not be able to leave houses on their own. But neither should monsters, and I once had some gnolls follow me into High Hedge... Best pick a house on one side of a map (for example, the farm in Nashkel where you find the ankheg armor). Send Khalid inside. Move the rest of your party to the main street, then remove him. Even if he, for some reason, can now leave the house, he has no way to get to the rest of the party to initiate the dialogue.
  • FiachFiach Member Posts: 231
    KidCarnival said:

    That is strange, usually NPCs should not be able to leave houses on their own. But neither should monsters, and I once had some gnolls follow me into High Hedge... Best pick a house on one side of a map (for example, the farm in Nashkel where you find the ankheg armor). Send Khalid inside. Move the rest of your party to the main street, then remove him. Even if he, for some reason, can now leave the house, he has no way to get to the rest of the party to initiate the dialogue.

    I've had numerous occasions where monsters follow me into a house, yes, High Hedge was one such instance. But I have had plenty of other such experiences. :)

  • LemernisLemernis Member, Moderator Posts: 4,318
    KidCarnival said:

    Made some progress with my mixed party (around the assassin charname). I switched out Viconia for Yeslick, and don't understand what's going anymore. Viconia with Stupifier and her 19 dex hit as much as you'd expect... but Yeslick with Ashideena and not-19 dex is a killer. I had planned him as a self buffing tank, but he actually keeps up with Kivan in the damage department. Why?! That should be fun once he gets the ogre gloves for 18/00. :D

    Yeslick is a Fighter (in addition to Cleric) so he's got much better THAC0 than a pure class Cleric. He's successfully hitting more often. I can't check it right now but a multi F/C and Ranger are probably about on par THAC0 progression-wise.
  • OzzyBotkinsOzzyBotkins Member Posts: 396
    1 Tank
    1 Damage dealer
    1/2 Thief
    1.5 Healer
    1 mage
    6th slot open
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,725
    In my current game I have a party of:

    PC Shadowdancer - he can't be classified neither as a thief nor as a tank nor as a damage dealer; he can be called a backstabber + ranged (+4 THACO helps a lot)

    Jaheira - with DEX from gloves, club (scimitar) + shield I use her as a tank + a healer (with the Ring of Holiness it's enough to have her as a healer for a whole party)

    Dorn - a damage dealer

    Imoen - a thief (lockpickting, disarm traps, set traps) + ranged

    Neera - a mage

    Garrick - a bard (pickpocketing, additional arcane magic and lore) + ranged

    I find this party balanced enough and rathe entertaining!

    Jaheira with very low AC can restrain monsters so long as I need to kill them with Dorn's two-handed weapons or PC's backstab. She can heal anyone who needs it.

    Dorn's strength, damage and THACO are all exceptional.

    PC - a backstabber - implements my favourite tactics - cutthroat stealthy assasin

    Imoen as a thief is essential to any party and no need for improving her HIS, MS and PP helps to fully upgrade other thieving skills including deadly traps.

    A mage is also essential to any party and I simply like Neera as an NPC + she has + 1 spell per level without restricts in any magic school.

    And a bard is very helpful for a party, even an unkitted one. Although his song is ridiculous his other abilities more than make up for this. And you know, Garrick is not a popular choice but I find him interesting, I like his voice and he brings a good diversity to our party if compared with the standard variants.

    So, summarizing it all, I'd recommend the following group format for BG1:EE: a backstabber + a damage dealer + a thief + a mage + a bard + a tank + a healer - some of them can combine in one person.
  • LemernisLemernis Member, Moderator Posts: 4,318
    @bengoshi Looks like a really fun group! A Bard can be a major asset to the team, properly used.
  • GallowglassGallowglass Member Posts: 3,356
    @alestus: you have more than enough physical combat power in that party, so yes, I'd swap in more arcane spellcasting. I've completed one run with Baeloth, and he's an interesting character to use, so I recommend him as a one-off experience. However, I'm not likely to use him often in future, because he's so powerful that he makes the game too easy to be a lasting challenge.

    That's a good question, about whether Ajantis will fight Baeloth. I don't know, I didn't take both together, that'd be worth knowing. Can anyone report on this?

    @Lemernis, @Fiach, @KidCarnival: yes, NPCs and enemies will sometimes follow you through doorways, although it seems rather unpredictable whether they will do so in any particular case. The solution is to close the door behind you (if you have time when an enemy is chasing you, sometimes you do and sometimes you don't), because they never open doors by themselves. For dismissing a paired NPC like Khalid, closing the door always works ... but of course this doesn't apply in the location mentioned, because Kagain's shop doesn't have a door in its doorway, so the answer is to dismiss him somewhere else which has an actual door.
  • JullosJullos Member Posts: 24
    edited February 2013
    Would it be crazy to get Xan and Neera on the same team?

    I would go as:
    PC multi F/T
    Imoen
    Khalid/ Maybe Ajantis
    Jahira
    Xan
    Neera

    Does that make sense?
  • Oxford_GuyOxford_Guy Member Posts: 3,729
    Jullos said:

    Would it be crazy to get Xan and Neera on the same team?

    I would go as:
    PC multi F/T
    Imoen
    Khalid/ Maybe Ajantis
    Jahira
    Xan
    Neera

    Does that make sense?

    If no one else needs the Dex gloves, I would pick Ajantis over Khalid, though I don't really like having Lawful Good NPCs in my party

    Are there two robes of neutral archmagi available? Xan and Neera are both neutral, so if you want both of them wearing these, you may have a problem...

  • agradineagradine Member Posts: 13
    My plans for my evil party are:

    PC F/T (probably focus on bows for BG1)
    Dorn (tank)
    Kagain (axes!)
    Viconia (healbot)
    Edwin (spells)
    Xan (hilarity)

    Obviously the new secret NPC would be a better fit for the Evil Mage #2 slot, but I can't stop giggling over the prospect of the chronically pessimistic Xan being surrounded by evil characters. I plan to use him in melee quite a bit with his moonblade. I expect he'll die more often but that just makes it funnier.
  • KidCarnivalKidCarnival Member Posts: 3,747
    Oxford_Guy said:

    Are there two robes of neutral archmagi available? Xan and Neera are both neutral, so if you want both of them wearing these, you may have a problem...

    Nope, High Hedge has one good and one neutral robe. There are 2 evil ones since Baeloth was added, but that's it.

  • alestusalestus Member Posts: 13
    think i'll try to put Khalid (dont wanna have him killed) in a house somewhere and get Baeloth to join my group. Could be interesting with 2 Drows in my group :)
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