Priest of Helm a terrible kit?
mforww
Member Posts: 78
There are a few kits that stand out as pretty obviously bad: Wizard Slayer and Beastmaster to name a couple. But I haven't heard anybody talk about the Priest of Helm kit. Is this simply because it's not worse than going kit-less? Because as it stands, it's pretty awful in comparison to the Talos and Lathander kits.
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EDIT: Yes, I said "baller".
3 mainhand attacks/round with a +4 AB magic bastard sword for 1 minute at level 1? (Compared to 6 seconds/level for Boon of Lathander) yes please.
In my ultimate party to try to beat SCS no-reloads I've featured a cleric of helm to be dualed to thief at 5-7.
On the other hand, I didn't realize you got 3 mainhand attacks out of seeking sword. That's not bad. However, doesn't seeking sword count as a sword when a cleric is using it? (in other words, he wouldn't be proficient in it, so he gets a penalty that offsets the bonus). If that's the case, then seeking sword is still kinda weak since the bonus is only applied to hit, and not the damage.
When this spell is cast, an area roughly 70 feet in radius around the caster will be effected. Instantly and once each round for 1 turn after this spell is cast, all hostile illusion/phantasm spells in the area of effect will be dispelled. The spells that are affected by this are: Reflected Image, Invisibility, Mirror Image, Non-Detection, Improved Invisibility, Shadow Door, Mislead, Project Image, and Simulacrum. The area of effect is roughly a 70' radius around the caster. The target's magic resistance, if any, does not come into effect with this spell. This spell only affects enemies, thus it is unable to dispel the invisibility from a party member.
(from PlanetBaldursGate)
There are certainly enemies in BGEE that are using mirror image starting with Tarnesh at FAI.
And how can a kit be weak when it only has pros and no cons? There's not really anything to argue about here.
P.S. It's 'couldn't' care less.
The only downside is of course that you cannot cast spells while the sword is active, nor unequip it before it expires. Then again, when your cleric starts swinging a sword, chances are you've given up on spells for now anyway.
True Sight is one of the best spells in the game, being useful from lvl 1 all the way to lvl 40. Not having to spend spell slots on it is VERY valuable as both versions (divine and arcane) are in a slot filled with other useful spells.
Not saying Priest of Helm is the BEST cleric kit, but it's far from "terrible".
A much better spell.
/End thread
EDIT: I just figured breach is probably more important and ruby ray of reversal is also up there.
EDIT 2: there are plenty of wands to cast breach though
1) I'm dumb
2) I've actually beaten BG1, BG2, and TOB apparently not knowing exactly what True Sight did. I thought it was just for invisibility.
A part of me feels dumb for starting this thread now, but the other part of me feels awesome for beating everything the old-fashioned way haha.
Mirror Image? Pshh magic missile that. Simalcrum? Kill em both.
Anyway, sorry I started this thread being totally misinformed. At least while we're on the topic of things I'm just gonna put out there without knowing what I'm talking about:
Bounty Hunter kit. Again, my memory is really dicey here, but when you maze somebody you don't get XP for them because you're not actually killing them right? Wouldn't that make the bounty hunter kit kind of lame as it leeches XP, unless you're willing to be really gamey about it and wait for things you maze to escape so you can kill them? (essentially use the maze traps as CC for larger fights so you can take on guys one at a time)
I'm not sure when exactly the idea became that they should all add awesome powers to any character. But I think the bottom line is, the game is completely playable, and winnable with any vanilla character class, any class combination, or any kit. That never means all are created equal, each brings a different set of challenges and different feel. But that's the fun of re-plays!
And I'm not sure what you mean by "being gamey about it". You cast Maze in the full knowledge that it is a temporary solution. It's not a game engine flaw that they pop back out, it's by design and fully intended. Otherwise it'd be, you know, Imprisonment.
Anyway, yeah, people like being powerful. Too much of it ruins the game, but in the short-term it feels good to win, and that sells books.
Also, and again correct me if I'm wrong since I haven't played a thief character since I beat BG2 about a decade ago, can't traps only be set when enemies aren't present? That in and of itself seems like you would have to be gamey about KNOWING when enemies will be present in order to use them (not unlike pre-buffing before a boss fight, which I find kind of cheap).
No need to, the particular advantage of this cleric kit had actually never come to my mind and I might use it in the future for this reason.
well a thief is designed to scout. i guess the idea is that you scout ahead invisibly, see the enemies, come back to the party set your traps then lure them back. or if NPCs are blue, non-hostiles and you know you're going to purposely piss them off, you set your traps around them and piss them off!
And it's say it's sort of the opposite of buffing or laying traps in advance, it's great for when you're not completely prepared, you can put the biggest threat on hold for a minute or so. And do it in a way only powerful mages can even think of.
wizard slayer turns EVERY fight against powerfull spellcasters into click to win,he even disables special abilities like beholder's gaze and breath weapons all in a single round with whirlwind attack and from range with trowing axes the drawback is that he cannot use magic items(only gauntlets are of real importance),so he's slightly weaker than the plain fighter in mellee but liches,Mellisan,Irenicus,Kangaxx etc are all trivial with 1 WZ in party and the items he cannot use can be given too others(it's too tempting to give to the PC all the good stuff)
beastmaster has some summons which are not really good BUT he has not much of a drawback either, there are AWSOME wooden weapons in the game both BG1 and SoA and ToB and you will find great non-metal armor too,bows you can use anyway,so what's the problem?
likewise priest of helm has pretty medicore benefits but no drawback,so what;s the problem?
if the kit is equal with the vanilla class it's fine and vanilla cleric is solid(yes i know priest of Talos is better, lategame less so though)
honestly any class/kit does the job,some are a bit better than other ofc but the game is not hard in any way(unmodded)