BG or BGII

North60 · February 2015

heya,

I feel a bit bashful admitting to never playing BG despite enjoying ADnD in my youth and getting wrapped up in EQ, D2 and WoW among some others over the years.

I'm trying to get a decent offline library together and Bladur's Gate is tops on my list but I'm wondering; Is there any reason to play BGE rather than BGEII?

I love jumping into a new game and leaving BG for this long might be more fun than if I would have rushed through it as a younger me so I'm looking for advice on how to appreciate the game to it's absolute fullest extent.

cheers!

P.S.
Some others on my list are Planescape, Icewind Dale and maybe Neverwinter Nights - night comes early north of 60 so if anyone has any favorites to add I'd appreciate the suggestions.

*P.S.S.
Hopefully it goes without saying I'll be scouring the forums for the faq's and noob stuff.

DreadKhan · February 2015

BG is a bit of a different experience than BG2, and with BG:EE, you actually can replay BG1 many, many times without running out of new things to try. Hard to say which is harder, but BG2 uses more spells and powers for enemies that are really save or suck, or even straight up require immunity or suck, so BG1 is more forgiving for a new player. Try it first, but be aware lvl 1 characters are REALLY fragile, and mages are supersquishy, as in most enemies can one shot you without a critical hit.

North60 · February 2015

Thanks!

I would have gone straight for latest and greatest. Nice to know there is much gameplay to be had in the Baldur's series alone.

DreadKhan · February 2015

Be cautious with guides on your first play through, you really do not want to spoil the game first play through... The easiest first time through BG:EE is probably Archer, followed by a Berserker with great stats. With either of these and a well rounded party, you shouldn't have too much trouble at first. Longbow is great for an archer in BG1, and Berserkers can use pretty much whatever weapon catches your fancy pretty darn well. There are standouts, but other than Katana, I think you will find something good for any proficiency choice you go with.

If you get stuck, you can ask on here for advice, and hopefully you won't get spoiled.

Nimran · February 2015

Hey! Have a

!

SmilingSword · February 2015

Hey, one bit of advice get the BG1 NPC project, its a banter pack. It makes the game so much better. I just finished doing a run with it for the first time and i actually cared about my party members. I didnt even leave Imeon on the side of the road at level one, in fact she became my favorite character.

Kilivitz · February 2015

Although BG2's intro tells you all you need to know about BG1's plot, it's not the same as finding out things for yourself. It'll make certain plot points and characters in BG2 a lot more fun.

There are also ways to boost your stats permanently, making your character more powerful when you bring him/her into BG2.

So I'd say you should absolutely play BG1 if you want to appreciate the saga to its full extent.

If you find yourself bored with the first game for some reason (some people complain the NPCs don't talk as much, or that there's too much wandering around the wilderness), you can power through the main plot in less than 10 hours.

And if I were you, I would avoid mods the first time around. Specially banter packs or romances - you wouldn't introduce people to Star Wars or Harry Potter by showing them fanfiction, no matter how good they're supposed to be.

SionIV · February 2015

Now when we have BGee with the same graphic and gameplay as BG2ee there is absolutely no reason to start with BG2. Back in the days people said start with BG2 because the gameplay was much better and more smooth, and the graphics went from old and dated to amazing for it's time.

Now when both the gameplay and graphics are the same, you should start with BG1.

iam1 · February 2015

I started with BG2, there is a certain joy to playing it backwards that people who've played it forwards just won't get.

SionIV · February 2015

iam1 said:
I started with BG2, there is a certain joy to playing it backwards that people who've played it forwards just won't get.

Just as you won't get many of the returning NPC's that make a cameo in BG2. Some of the most fond memories in BG2 for me was meeting NPC's from BG1 and see where their lives had taken them.

iam1 · February 2015

SionIV said:

iam1 said:
I started with BG2, there is a certain joy to playing it backwards that people who've played it forwards just won't get.
Just as you won't get many of the returning NPC's that make a cameo in BG2. Some of the most fond memories in BG2 for me was meeting NPC's from BG1 and see where their lives had taken them.

Well, I shan't argue.

Deltharis · February 2015

BG1 and BG2 are entirely different experiences when plot is concerned.

BG1 was minimalistic, the most you got from NPCs was a nod in the right directions. Your companions, without mods at least, are mostly silent interchangable statues getting about one quest each and a few lines of related dialogue. Main quests pacing is mostly dependant on you, and story chapters at times seem to be little more than an annoying split in your journal.

BG2 takes a little bit more modern approach, with smaller cast of more flashed out companions, each getting tons of recorded dialogues, possible romances and multiple party banters. At every point you know what your next main objective is and have a good idea at how to accomplish it. Quests are more complex, involve more dialogue, are more epic in scale (for rather obvious reasons) and really get your attention.

If you don't enjoy just storming into a dungeon crawl "just because it's there" it might be better to start with the second one. I am BG2 fan pimarily, so my opinion might be somewhat swayed.

North60 · February 2015

Thanks for the suggestions!

I'm enjoying the first bit of BGEE on a second archer. I didn't like the way I distributed the ability points the first time around. The second attempt 'woke up' to an initial roll of 94 so points were definitely less of an issue.

I thought about looking into a couple mods but I enjoy stumbling around with a new map and ui and what not. There will be time for mods later. That NPC project sounds very attractive though. I'm only just settling into a party theme sort-to-speak so I imagine that mod would have changed some things but atm i'm not too fussy about who I hang with.

I'm looking forward to playing the saga from beginning to end but for the next bit my internet access is better so I'm trying not to move too far forward. This might be futile but at least I know II and Y will keep me adventuring for some time to come.

Good Hunting!

North60 · February 2015

Deltharis said:
BG1 and BG2 are entirely different experiences when plot is concerned.

BG1 was minimalistic, the most you got from NPCs was a nod in the right directions. Your companions, without mods at least, are mostly silent interchangable statues getting about one quest each and a few lines of related dialogue. Main quests pacing is mostly dependant on you, and story chapters at times seem to be little more than an annoying split in your journal.

BG2 takes a little bit more modern approach, with smaller cast of more flashed out companions, each getting tons of recorded dialogues, possible romances and multiple party banters. At every point you know what your next main objective is and have a good idea at how to accomplish it. Quests are more complex, involve more dialogue, are more epic in scale (for rather obvious reasons) and really get your attention.

If you don't enjoy just storming into a dungeon crawl "just because it's there" it might be better to start with the second one. I am BG2 fan pimarily, so my opinion might be somewhat swayed.

This sounds encouraging. I won't feel like I'm using up my offline time by playing BGEE while my www access is consistent and broadband.

The more 'involved/epic' BGIIEE will fit nicely next winter and maybe I'll set myself up with a mod or three. For now the minimalistic dungeon crawl is just fine for this BG noob.

SionIV · February 2015

It makes me very sad to see people compare Baldur's Gate to a dungeon crawl. Some of the quests are really immersive, you'll be able to complete quests in different ways, the NPC's might not be as fleshed out as they are in BG2 but they still have their own unique personality and twist. You have a ton of options when and where you want to do what quests, you can return to quests, go for very hard quests early on or simple quests where you talk to people for experience. You get different rewards and dialogues depending on how good your charisma and reputation are and much more.

Baldur's gate is not a dungeon crawl,even when you compare it to Baldur's Gate 2. Icewind Dale is a dungeon crawl, Diablo is a dungeon crawl, Baldur's Gate is not.

Kilivitz · February 2015

BG1 and its NPCs only seem bland when compared to BG2 (or held to today's standards), which is unfair. It's like judging an older movie's visual effects based on modern CGI technology.

I'll grant, however, that the way the main objectives are handed to the player is far from optimal. Knowing what your next move should be depends on keeping an eye on your journal, and that feature is one of the game's very few flaws.

Unlike BG2 (and most modern cRPGs), the way the game keeps track of your quests is sometimes wonky. There are quite a few redundant entries, some of which can be outdated (referring to a quest or plot point that's already been resolved).

The EE has made things a bit better (implementing BG2's separation of "done" and "not done" quests and keeping your main objective always as the top entry. It's still worse than the original BG2, though, because of the aforementioned problems, and also the fact that some quests are either not moved to the "done" list or are reopened (because they can be given by different NPCs).

CrevsDaak · February 2015

I would recommend trying out Ps:T if you want something that is pure story with the crappiest combat ever (and more, if you're coming from tabletop you're gonna hate, but I tell you, the story's worth it).

Kilivitz said:
Unlike BG2 (and most modern cRPGs), the way the game keeps track of your quests is sometimes wonky. There are quite a few redundant entries, some of which can be outdated (referring to a quest or plot point that's already been resolved).

BG2:EE's Journal is much better than the original. While it is certainly a bit bugged (many quest never show a closure entry, but that's a leftover from vanilla), it does help you keep the track pretty well.

Deltharis · February 2015

Kilivitz said:
BG1 and its NPCs only seem bland when compared to BG2 (or held to today's standards), which is unfair. It's like judging an older movie's visual effects based on modern CGI technology.

I don't think that's the correct way of seeing things. In this analogy this is a thread made by someone who hasn't seen any movies but is interested in this whole "cinema" thingy. Pointing out the differences between the approaches is entirely fair, expected even. Whether someone finds one superior to the other (or finds direct comparison unfair) is irrelevant.

And @SionIV I'd just like to note, that I didn't call BG1 a dungeon crawl. What I meant was that within the game there really are multiple classic dungeon crawls with minimal plot exposition as to why should anyone go there. And I find that not caring about them (as I did in my last playthrough) does take away some joy of playing.

DreadKhan · February 2015

I don't think we want to spoil this thread too bad people, so no examples needed, but I cannot think of a single dungeon in BG1 that has neither a cause to investigate nor any interesting tidbits of colour storywise. They are indeed sidequests, but they all have cool backstories, even the crummy dungeon of flamming kobold death we all love to hate. It has a really cool backstory too even, and some quest stuff to do inside. And a reason to go there can be found relatively easily.

Side quests are not SUPPOSED to have much bearing on the main plot, that is why they are sidequests. Games that feature no sidequests tend to be weird when you realize the entire game world has been built exclusively around the plot. You can't explore at all in KOTOR for example, the entire universe is based on the plot of the game. Countless planets, you get to visit what, 6? Sheesh.

Kilivitz · February 2015

Deltharis said:

Kilivitz said:
BG1 and its NPCs only seem bland when compared to BG2 (or held to today's standards), which is unfair. It's like judging an older movie's visual effects based on modern CGI technology.
I don't think that's the correct way of seeing things. In this analogy this is a thread made by someone who hasn't seen any movies but is interested in this whole "cinema" thingy. Pointing out the differences between the approaches is entirely fair, expected even. Whether someone finds one superior to the other (or finds direct comparison unfair) is irrelevant.

What I meant to say is that after BG2 came out, with romances and extensive banters and whatnot, BG1 started looking rather bland in retrospect. BG2 changed the lens through which a lot of players see and evaluate BG1 nowadays.

BG or BGII

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