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[ SPOILER (ToB) ] End-Game Villain

ShareazuShareazu Member Posts: 51
SPOILER! some information about the end game and the villain lies ahead!



Melissan as the final villain in the game was sort of a disappointment to me. Don't get me wrong, i do like the character, her scheme and all, but i think MAYBE it would be more appropriate to have BHAAL as the main villain off the last game (ToB), considering the game is all about you ('CHARNAME') facing him, the fate of being a spawn of bhaal, his essence in your blood, or even to take his place, his power, and etc... it'd be more epic, IMO.

before someone say "but he's dead! he can't face CHARNAME!", remember that (if i remember well), it was his plan to take control of the last child of bhaal once he/she killed all the others...

i'm not saying the game is better off without Melissan... no, i think it'd be good to keep her, but AFTER you defeated her, bhaal (or his spirit) would appear, and you'd have to fight him... or maybe you should be teleported to some place, be informed of bhaal's attempt to return, and then you'd have the opportunity to rest (if you wanted), before facing him.


ADDITIONAL IDEAS:

maybe there could also be some betrayal involved: if you didn't convince sarevok to change alignment, OR if your dialogue choices made him dislike you, bhaal would take his body.


the battle could be divided in two parts, just like the one agains kangaxx or irenicus; you would first face his ghost (if he took sarevok's body, you'd face a minor avatar of bhaal), after that, you'd face him as the 'true slayer', a bigger, unique version of the slayer. there could be, of course, minions to help him and all, just like in melissan's battle.


aaanyway, it's just a thought. those are just addiional ideas.

please, discuss, say your own opinions, and please, pardon for any gramatical errors. english is not my main language.... also, sorry if i made any mistakes regarding the game story/plot, it's been a while since i last played it.
Post edited by Shareazu on

Comments

  • lansounetlansounet Member Posts: 1,182
    I remember reading somewhere that ToB was initially planned as a full game instead of an add-on and many ideas were cut. Maybe this was in the plan :x I don't think they'll be allowed such changes of storyline sadly
  • CorianderCoriander Member Posts: 1,667
    Yeah, we can't change the story. I think that would also be taking Cyric too lightly.
  • ShareazuShareazu Member Posts: 51
    I remember reading somewhere that ToB was initially planned as a full game instead of an add-on and many ideas were cut. Maybe this was in the plan :x I don't think they'll be allowed such changes of storyline sadly
    yes, i guess not... it's just something me and my siblings have been thinking/discussing over the years...

    i guess that's kind of a big change, maybe too big... but i think it'd be nice to have the opportunity to face bhaal himself, instead of melissan who was merely his cleric... again, not saying that she's a bad character, just that the role of 'final villain' might be too much for her.

  • ShareazuShareazu Member Posts: 51
    edited June 2012
    yes of course, i understand @Coriander... but still, maybe this isn't too much of a change! i mean, the only difference would be an extra battle.. the ending itself would still be pretty much the same.
  • JackalenJackalen Member Posts: 8
    edited June 2012
    Yeah, we can't change the story. I think that would also be taking Cyric too lightly.
    I apologize for my ignorance, but i am very courious about what Cyric's connection to the final confilict/Bhaal is.

    It has been some time since i completed ToB, but still i wonder; why would Cyric be taken too lightly if the suggested changed was to be made?
  • ShareazuShareazu Member Posts: 51
    Yeah, we can't change the story. I think that would also be taking Cyric too lightly.
    I apologize for my ignorance, but i am very courious about what Cyric's connection to the final confilict/Bhaal is.

    It has been some time since i completed ToB, but still i wonder; why would Cyric be taken too lightly if the suggested changed was to be made?
    well, cyric took bhaal's place as the new lord of murder... I guess what @Coriander is saying is that he wouldn't just sit while bhaal did all that.

    but maybe he (cyric) couldn't be aware of bhaal's plan to return... after all, deities in forgotten realms aren't really omniscient.
  • JackalenJackalen Member Posts: 8
    edited June 2012
    Yeah, we can't change the story. I think that would also be taking Cyric too lightly.
    I apologize for my ignorance, but i am very courious about what Cyric's connection to the final confilict/Bhaal is.

    It has been some time since i completed ToB, but still i wonder; why would Cyric be taken too lightly if the suggested changed was to be made?
    well, cyric took bhaal's place as the new lord of murder... I guess what @Coriander is saying is that he wouldn't just sit while bhaal did all that.

    but maybe he (cyric) couldn't be aware of bhaal's plan to return... after all, deities in forgotten realms aren't really omniscient.

    Oh yeah of course, im acually rereading some lore right now and there is potential to expand on your suggestions, Shareazu.

    What if when the spirit of bhaal would possess either the body Melissan of Sarevok and Cyric himself would present himself and kill Bhaal again, lols? Then thanking CHARNAME for "helping" him. Of course, this would compromize the choice to ascend into godhood for the player, just a thought though.

    Bhaal: "Muhahaha, im back!"
    Cyric: "What u doin' maenn?!?" *stab*

  • ShareazuShareazu Member Posts: 51
    well, to prevent that, maybe cyric isn't able to see what goes on pocket planes, so he couldn't know about bhaal's schemes...
  • WardWard Member Posts: 1,305
    @Sharezu

    I'd like to face Bhaal. The only time you fight him is in the dream sequence from SoA at Candlekeep.
  • ShareazuShareazu Member Posts: 51
    yeah, and you can't even face him properly, since he can't be killed...
  • ShareazuShareazu Member Posts: 51
    people, let's discuss about this! dont just agree/disagree, say your opinions!
  • StradlinStradlin Member Posts: 142
    Ehh, I much prefer having fights against Bhaal happening within PCs head and soul or such.
    It just wouldn't feel right to start bashing him with a sword.

    Having said that, ending of ToB was clearly rather..hastily done. Rather amazing mod Ascension fixes much of that. Here's hoping EE-compatible versions of mods such as it will spawn soon after release.

  • AzL0nAzL0n Member Posts: 126
    @Ward

    Speaking of which, I hate how he just looks exactly like Sarevok. Couldn't they have made him a bit different? Or is there a reason within the story which explains why they wear the same gear / look the same?
  • WardWard Member Posts: 1,305
    @AzL0n

    Maybe Bhaal doesn't look like Sarevok.. maybe Sarevok looks like Bhaal. Since, you know, he does want to be the NEW LAWD OF MERDOR.
  • AzL0nAzL0n Member Posts: 126
    @Ward

    Yeah that's what I figured. I just said Bhaal looks like Sarevok since you only see Bhaal in Bg2 after having seen much of Sarevok. I guess that must be the reason. But if I remember correctly they also have the exact same voice too. Same voice same suit... would have been cool if there had been a slight difference. Also I would imagine Bhaal's avatar to be a bit bigger... dunno.
  • DrugarDrugar Member Posts: 1,566
    I was very annoyed with Mellissan in ToB. The moment she showed up I was like "well, she's clearly set up to betray me". And lo and behold, she betrayed me. Shock and horror.
    Worst thing was, my Wizard with more intelligence than the Mind Flayer's Chess Club combined couldn't call Mellissan on her terribly bluff checks, nor refuse to go along her ridiculous plan at any point.

    I wouldn't mind Throne of Bhaal being completely rewritten to get her out (maybe make her an advisor to the Five) and focus on just the Five or on Bhaal himself, possibly other celestial/fiendish powers trying to stop you. Anything but a random never-heard-of priestess trying to arbritrarily be your best friend before suddenly becoming more powerful than anyone else.

    Not going to happen, as Coriander said; the storyline can't be touched, but a guy can dream...
  • ShareazuShareazu Member Posts: 51
    yeah... maybe this topic would be more appropriate on the 'discussion' section. since it looks like most people is sactisfied with melissan, i guess they could at least improve her dialogs, her plan, story, etc.... make it less obvious, as @Drugar said.
  • kamuizinkamuizin Member Posts: 3,704
    1° - I don't think it's a good idea replace Melissan with Bhaal, the whole point in Melissan existence is the need of Bhaal for a mortal gatekeeper of his spawns essence.

    2° - However i agree that the final battle is a bad joke, if we evaluate the final battle of BG with sarevok, Angelo, Semaj and Tazok and measure with the final battle of BG2 ToB with Melissan, the BG final battle is thousand times harder than BG2 ToB final Battle.

    So an upgrade on the final battle as the ascension mod do, would be a huge benefit to the difficult scales of ToB final battle.

  • carugacaruga Member Posts: 375
    Disagree with the general idea, besides which I don't think they could make it happen even if they wanted to.

    I would like to see a better end-game cinematic though; regardless of which choice you make it's the same generic slideshow cleverly made to fit either narrative.

    I'd also really love it if they got rid of the 'Liza Doolittle' VA for Mellissan, the way she said 'Baaaawlsporn' really made me want to punch her and made me hate that word. And the way she did a 'fake mean voice' after she was unmasked as the villain was really poorly done as well. But this ain't happening, either... :(
  • ShareazuShareazu Member Posts: 51
    eh.. i guess there's no hope in changing the villain... but still, i think caruga and the others made good suggestions... adding a better end-game cinematic would be a nice improvement, at least!
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