Halfling dart-focused Assassin build advice wanted
Aerakar
Member Posts: 1,024
Greetings,
I am working on building a Halfling assassin focused on darts for a small 4 person party and am thinking about the order of weapon proficiencies for this bloke. Current approach:
1 - darts, daggers (using bucklers)
4 - clubs (to have a blunt)
8 - short sword
12 - scimitar
16 - SWS
20 - TWF
I would like to use darts as my primary ranged weapon and DoV as primary melee weapon in BG, moving on to melee short swords/scimitars and thrown daggers in BG2. Conceptually I am not interested in quarterstaffs for this guy as that weapon does not agree with my role-play of a Halfling thief.
I have Rogue Rebalancing installed and there are some fun bucklers in this mod, so am also thinking to use bucklers from the beginning - something that would not be worth it without this specific mod given the lack of bucklers in both games - ending up with Kiel's buckler in Durlag's Tower and then perhaps the Rogue's Ward in BG2.
Comments welcome on the idea of using bucklers - and the rest of the build - as I have never tried bucklers or darts before and have been a SWS and Shortbow man..errr...Halfling in all previous run-throughs.
Thank you.
I am working on building a Halfling assassin focused on darts for a small 4 person party and am thinking about the order of weapon proficiencies for this bloke. Current approach:
1 - darts, daggers (using bucklers)
4 - clubs (to have a blunt)
8 - short sword
12 - scimitar
16 - SWS
20 - TWF
I would like to use darts as my primary ranged weapon and DoV as primary melee weapon in BG, moving on to melee short swords/scimitars and thrown daggers in BG2. Conceptually I am not interested in quarterstaffs for this guy as that weapon does not agree with my role-play of a Halfling thief.
I have Rogue Rebalancing installed and there are some fun bucklers in this mod, so am also thinking to use bucklers from the beginning - something that would not be worth it without this specific mod given the lack of bucklers in both games - ending up with Kiel's buckler in Durlag's Tower and then perhaps the Rogue's Ward in BG2.
Comments welcome on the idea of using bucklers - and the rest of the build - as I have never tried bucklers or darts before and have been a SWS and Shortbow man..errr...Halfling in all previous run-throughs.
Thank you.
0
Comments
If you are using a buckler, you should take Board and Sword instead of SWS. This will at least compensate for losing the AC from missile weapons.
There was a new buckler added to the merchant in FAI that gives a +1 con allowing you to gimp it to a 14-15. This gives you a magical option early in the game as well.
Besides that, it looks good.
Maybe do:
4-scimitar
8-katana (for celestial fury)
Or maybe get a sling instead for when you run out of good darts, halflings get +1 with slings. Bonus for magic slings and bullets stacks (like bow/arrows) so you get better attack compared to darts.
It's also a waste to take both SWS and TWS.
If you don't plan to backstab much maybe go with another kit than assassin. Swashbuclers can specialize and dual wield completely.
1 dart, dagger
4 dart++
8 dagger++
12-20 TWS
Although you would probably be better off with a fighter/thief for the extra attack and faster specialization points.
Shadowdancers are also very cool. They can hide in plain sight making you a very hard target for enemies.
On clubs, yes good point, and none of them stand out in BG 1 and they are only fair in BG2. It probably would make more sense to take the club in BG 1 if I was going solo to have a blunt option, but I plan to take Minsc and he has maces and Viconia also has hammers or maces.
I do like the scimitar proficiency for the higher damage output, the variety of piercing and slashing, and especially for the variety in BG 2. What about this version:
1 - scimitar, darts (use buckler)
4 - dagger (for DoV, cannot afford earlier anyway, still use buckler)
8 - SWS (prepare for BG2)
12 - katana (for CF)
16+ - open (short or long sword, etc.)
Scimitars are a solid pick as they have the best options to boost APR in melee.
Forget short swords... the options really aren't great. If you have Belm (later Scarlet Ninjato), then Kundane becomes redundant, I know Rogue Rebalancing upgrades the Short Sword of Backstabbing to improve the backstab multiplier, but that's already a strength for Assassins, so you're into overkill territory.
Daggers are a great pick with Rogue Rebalancing, as it adds a bunch of extras with tasty on-hit effects.
The main advantage to SWS is actually the increased critical hit range, which is well worth it... you can always unequip your buckler when needed.
I actually like clubs, as they have a scattering of elemental and similar effects... I once played a Halfling Bard who exclusively used Slings and Clubs (in melee, I RP'd it that the magical club heads were lodged in the end of his sling and used as a sort of flail).
BTW the scarlet ninja-to +3 is not suitable for backstab (unless it's changed in your mod).
For early BG2, blade of roses +3 is convenient, so longsword is also a good choice for later proficiencies.
On clubs I could be persuaded, since blunt damage is good and for those situations where the opponent is resistant to piercing/slashing/missile damage (skeleton warriors backstabs, jellies, etc.). I realize quarterstaffs are great mechanically, but I just do not like a Halfling sneak with them role-play wise, so that leaves clubs.
On short swords, you read my mind on the RR revised short sword of backstabbing.
Revised:
1 - scimitar (go for the early +1 wakizashi), darts (use buckler)
4 - dagger (for DoV, cannot afford earlier anyway, still use buckler)
8 - SWS or clubs
12 - SWS or clubs or long swords
16 - sling (ranged damage for +4 and +5 opponents)
20 - open (perhaps add TWF for tactical options, with RR mod thieves can have 3 pips)
I do not envision this bloke using katanas for Celstial Fury, but long swords could be an option in early SoA for Blade of Roses/Namarra (counter argument: already have slashing with scimitars/ninja-to, so not worth it).
I am thinking SWS will be most useful in SoA and later, but could be persuaded to include it earlier in place of clubs.
1 Darts, Scimitars (there are nice Scimitars in BG1, Belm and Scarlet Ninja-To are great for off-hand in BG2)
4 TWF
8 TWF
12 Clubs/Staves (Staves are probably the best backstabbing weapon)
16 TWF
20 Two-Handed Weapon Style
You could also build toward TWF later on of course, to use it in the endgame when backstabs become a bit less useful. Dualwielding is nice with the Assassination HLA for instance.
I second the recommendation of using Slings, although with high DEX (possibly enhanced by Rogue Rebalancing items), the Assassin bonus, and the Halfling bonus, even without a proficiency pip, an Assassin should be fairly efficient with a Sling.
I don't like quarterstaffs on thieves so will pass on that. Then as you suggest later towards UAI and HLAs around level 24 make the switch to TWF with scimitars with the RR mod TWF component.
Is it smart to not have a blunt option in BG 1? The arch-druid +2 club seems tactically useful for example against skeleton warriors if backstabbing (assuming no QS). Or is quarterstaff required to make it work and clubs are not useful? The one arch druid one seems ok (+2).
Lastly, what about SWS ?
- it has very limited range, which means that a fast opponent may well hit your Assassin before they can retreat;
- the poison damage is nice, but apart from the fact that it's subject to a save vs death (which admittedly most enemies won't consistently make), it'll often be superfluous since a few hits with Assassin poison normally suffices for the kill or at least slows down opponents so much that it's easy to finish them off with ranged weapons;
- daggers deal piercing damage, the weakest of the three melee damage types (Skeletons for example, and Mustard Jellies are highly/fully resistant to piercing damage);
- it's a dagger, a weapon of which there aren't many great ones in BG2.
Darts and Bucklers (I also like the Rogue Rebalancing ones, especially the Safeguard) are very solid in BG1 and most of BG2 though.
There are good throwing daggers in BG2, though I prefer short bows there (Tuigan, Tansheron's, Gesen) and have a wide range of enchanted arrows to choose from. However from your OP I infer you'd like to avoid Bows.
If you don't want to use staves (as a fellow rogue player I also long had reservations, but I've come to like them for the opening backstab, after which I switch to blades), Clubs are nice. I do think that a blunt proficiency is worth it due to piercing and to a lesser extent slashing resistances, but this applies more to BG2 than BG1 imo. There are some nice Rogue Rebalancing and vanilla clubs in the game. If you wanted really competitive Clubs, you could consider installing the Item Upgrades mod.
SWS or THWS (for staves) are usually backbenchers for me since even non-critical backstab damage tends to be very good. This goes especially for an Assassin with poison damage.
I have never used darts before and usually go with short bow with my thieves, having tried crossbows also but finding the Light Crossbow of Speed and assorted bolts damaging and fun yet missing the other effects and the higher short bow THAC0. With short bow and poison weapon the Arrows of Detonation as I understand are menacing, and of course the Arrows of Dispelling are ridiculously useful in BG 1. I only began using the dispelling arrows at the end of my last SCS game and I felt like I had discovered a miracle weapon! Are the dispelling arrows also available in BG 2? As I understand the detonation arrows are very limited in BG2.
On short bows versus darts for an assassin, which is better overall? It seems a trade-off of special effects versus somewhat higher APR, at least until Tuigan (and potentially the RR mod buckler advantages). Would it make sense to do both?
On the quarterstaff, I could be persuaded with some grumbling. After doing some on-line research, I do see now that Halflings often use staffs as a weapon, although it seems some mental gymnastics are required. I am not so interested in the Item Upgrades mod for now, so it seems clubs are less feasible for a full saga run, which is my intention.
Another dart-focused Halfling version:
1 Darts, Scimitars (use bucklers)
4 Daggers
8 Quarterstaff (situational, for blunt damage and later Staff Mace/Staff of Striking backstabs)/Clubs
12 Slings
16 THF
20 SWS
24+ TWF
Short bow-focused Halfling version:
1 Short bow, Scimitars (forget bucklers)
4 SWS
8 Quarterstaff (situational, for blunt damage and later Staff Mace/Staff of Striking backstabs)
12 THF
16+ TWF
A second reason (besides backstabbing advantages) my - often solo - Thieves tend to end up using Staves is the Staff of the Magi, with its dispel on hit property.
Your latest proficiency set-ups, for both the Bowslinger and the Darts-thrower, look very good.
I'd like to see how your character fares. Would you mind sharing your progress on the forums?
I very much enjoyed the last bloke, the bounty hunter with those Halfling savings throws and thief bonuses, and am sure this one will be just as fun. Will keep you posted on progress!
By the way, do I understand correctly that Drizzt's scimitars can no longer be pickpocketed? Do you ever try and get those with scimitar builds like this one?
I found it really underwhelming, and then you have nowhere better to go with the weapon class... Also, it's expensive, and very immersion breaking to rush straight there and pick it up.
It's not the best weapon in the game, but it's the easiest way to get a +4 weapon and it'll help a lot.
My Halfling Assassin is entering Beregost, with pips in darts and scimitars and carrying a buckler. The darts are fun as a change of pace and the number of attacks is noticeable. It is still early of course, but for now I can quite often take down the low level fodder like hobgoblins or xvarts without fail given the 3 attacks. With normal short bows at low level with the thief THACO, Imoen misses enough that she tends to retreat more often if she attracts a melee opponent.
On the short sword debate, I agree the Sword of Mask is a good starter weapon and available early in SoA, and that Crimson Dart is also tempting to snag early. That being said, I may hold off on Watcher's Keep until later and try some of the other weapons first that work with bucklers, e.g. ninja-to, wakizashi, scimitars, throwing daggers. The RR mod which I am using introduces some fun versions of these weapons and more bucklers, all available still in Athkatla. I will still use staves for the occasional backstab.
But for now back to BG 1. The dart throwing animation is outstandingly fun! I bet inventory management is going to bite shortly though...
In TOB it can be upgraded to increase the crit range by +2 by Cespenar. The Cyric assassins encounter also adds a +4 short sword that has some on hit effects like poison.
1 Darts, Dagger
4 SWS
8 Short bow
12 Scimitar
16 Quarterstaff or Club
I want to be able to use both short bows and darts in both games for more ranged tactical options, i.e. darts of wounding/stunning, elemental darts, arrows of dispelling, arrows of detonation with AOE poison (thanks @Gallowglass for this idea after reading a post by you about a Halfling assassin run in another thread). I will add throwing daggers (for added strength damage after snagging the hill giant belt and +2 boomerang dagger in early SoA) into the mix in BG2.
I will use bucklers again also occasionally. He will go for the DoV in BGEE and then switch to scimitars in BG2EE.
Nevertheless, yes, my Assassin having both Sbow and Dart proved very useful for tactical flexibility. I recommend it.
For some reason - and I have no idea why given both Tuigan and Crimson Dart's appeal - I never considered previously training in both of these missile weapons with an assassin. Probably because I was more concerned with developing blades with my assassins, leaving melee to be secondary. This is in fact backwards with a Halfling (or any) assassin it seems, as ranged is his strength, at least in BGEE and SOA.