ToB and Throwing Daggers ?

DevardKrown · February 2016

So after Picking both games up some time ago as EE i finally said to myself lets do a Full run again !

Being a Planer and Looking ahead i came to the Class Swashbuckler/Mage(6/x) or Kensai/Mage(9/x)

the only thing i cant decide are weapons.

first i thought Throwing daggers, you can swap them from range to melee in a Click , they have 2d4(the magic ones) which makes them almost better than most weapons ! and they get a free attack(even in melee !), even Singe Handed Combat works on them so whats not to love.....ohh yeah they cap out at +3

so how much +X im gonna need for TOB ? i know about two fights who need a +4 Weapon ( the watchers keep monkey and the end boss of tob)

should i go Short swords right away and just work for the good ole cheesy offhand Kudane and a massive +5 SS for mainhand ? or another weapon all together ? (since i know mustard jelly' and golems ? are immune to piercing)

[Deleted User] · February 2016

If your only concern with throwing daggers is the +3 enhancement cap, then I'd just go with them. There are only three or four enemies that you will actually fight that require a +4 or better to hit, and by the time you're that late in ToB you should have gotten enough proficiencies to have a backup for those situations (or else you can keep the Boneblade +4 dagger handy).

See this thread for discussion of weapon enhancement requirements: https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/comment/699700#Comment_699700

Bubbles · February 2016

If I remember right, unless they patched it, throwing daggers benefit from str damage too ^^.
I haven't use 1 in the latest patch so far but I remembered previously str adds to them.

In SoA mainly that "skull" and monkey needed the +4
ToB I am not sure if that "sunny" thing also need +4 or not.

Generally, I have a preference for "blunt" weapons (they tend to keep doing damage without stirring a frantic search through your bags for solutions) and mind you, puffy stuffs move VERY fast towards you ^^.

Aerakar · February 2016

Throwing daggers are awesome, as both strength and dexterity bonuses are used for THACO, much like slings. Strength damage also applies, just like with slings, but at 2 APR.

Plus they look cool.

JuliusBorisov · February 2016

@Aerakar
For slings and throwing daggers and axes (and a hammer) STR should determine damage bonuses only, while DEX should determine THAC0 bonuses.

In BGEE throwing daggers currently get bonuses to THAC0 from both STR and DEX, which is a bug. But in BG2EE they work without this bug - throwing daggers get bonuses to THAC0 from DEx only. In the same time, there's a problem with throwing axes in BG2EE. Both bugs should be cleared with the next patches for BG1&2.

Bubbles · February 2016

@bengoshi
Aww such "friendly" bugs must be reproduced in greater abundance ^^.
Squash the pest but keep the "friendly" bugs ^^.

P.S. Throwing daggers/axes/hammer are not considered as missile weapons ^^ (so you can figure out what you can gain with this).

Oh 1 more thing, Str+Dex bonuses should apply to throwing and slings.
Reason: Dex for aiming accuracy+ Str for penetration of armor (thus falls under THAC0) and Str added to damage for concussion/penetration gained via extra momentum.
I don't understand why Str damage wasn't added to throwing axes and hammers X_X

Aerakar · February 2016

Thanks @bengoshi for the thorough explanation. Yes, would be more consistent if sling/dagger/axe THACO only used dexterity, and unbalancing to have both strength AND dexterity determine THACO.

gorgonzola · February 2016

Imo arguing what it should be based on some logic different from game balance issues can lead to every possible result so don't give any useful result.
I think that only two things have no logic at all when talking about infinite ammunition weapons.
For the originally ranged ones, bows, xbows and slings, I can see no reason why the dmg from the magical infinite ammunition stacks with the one of a regular one as the weapon shot the one or the other, is clearly stated that is not an effect added but a magical infinite ammunition used.
And the originally mlee ones should be allowed to classes and kits that can not use ranged ones only in the mlee version. Even if returning or not returning throwing axes and daggers exist their use (ranged use for the returning ones) should be prevented to those classes and kits. Also in this case is clearly stated that those classes and kits (I try to be less spoiling as possible) are prevented from using any ranged weapon, not some types of them, even if in the game the things are different.

Dualing into mage and using ranged version of weapons that have a mlee equivalent rends the cons irrelevant keeping only the pros. No wander if a certain dual is so popular among players.
But this is a game balance issue, a different thing.

ToB and Throwing Daggers ?

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