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Jon Irenicus subrace (SPOILERS)

KagainKagain Member Posts: 12
Hello everyone, let's get straignt to business, since i do not think, that Joneleth Irenicus needs some introductions here.

1. As we all know, Baldur's Gate allows us to play as an "Elf" race, without selecting any subtype of it (Moon Elf by default?). And I question myself: which type of Elf was Jon Irenicus? Obviously, he is non-Drow, but I cant truly guess: Suldanessellar is said to be an "Elven city", nothing more specific, but on my mind, it fits Forest Elves more, yet I doubt, that Jon is Forest one (Sun/Moon Elf, perhaps?)

2.His name. I know, what it means, but I can't find any D&D Elven dictionary with actual statements about word "Irenicus", and I saw only a few matching name suffixes for name Joneleth. From which source it is exactly taken?

Just his concept is very inspiring, i would like to make something similar, but not exactly same for a character, lol.

Post edited by Dee on
JuliusBorisovMoradin

Comments

  • PantalionPantalion Member Posts: 2,137
    Jon Irenicus is from Suldanessellar.

    - The Patron God of Suldanessellar is Rillifane Rallathil, the patron god of the Green, or Wild, Elves, but he's also in charge of protecting Elven settlements, so that's not an automatic tell.

    - Athkatla and its surrounding regions to the west of the forest of Tethyr are situated along a route running south along the Sword Coast called the Trade Way. Though Green Elves do live in the forest, the elves that live just east of this route, like those living in Suldanessellar, are the Elmanesse, which are a tribe formed when elves fled the fall of Myth Drannor and settled in Tethir.

    - Myth Drannor, or Cormanthor is generally occupied by Moon Elves.

    - Jon Irenicus is likely to be a Moon Elf. If the map is wonky, and it's much further east, he may be a Green Elf. It's unlikely that he is a Sun Elf, since Sun Elf architecture is supposed to be super grandiose even compared to regular elves, and the vast majority live in Evermeet.

    SertoriusDJKajuru
  • abacusabacus Member Posts: 1,304
    Doesn't the game say that Irenicus means "the betrayer" or "the outcast" or something?

    I always thought they chose to resemble Icarus... as his demise came through trying to ascend to Godhood (ie too close to power/ too close to the sun).

    The historical source you mention is interesting though @bengoshi

    JuliusBorisovButtercheese
  • SpaceInvaderSpaceInvader Member Posts: 2,115
    @abacus in fact, if you charmed the fat "spider woman" in the Cloakwood forest in vanilla BG1, she said she was transformed by a powerful wizard called Jon Icarus.
    In BG:EE it was corrected into Jon Irenicus.

    abacusSkatan
  • argent77argent77 Member Posts: 2,577
    abacus said:

    Doesn't the game say that Irenicus means "the betrayer" or "the outcast" or something?

    Irenicus means 'Shattered One'. Queen Ellesime mentions it in one of her dialogs at the Tree of Life.

    brusabacusArunsun
  • abacusabacus Member Posts: 1,304
    argent77 said:

    abacus said:

    Doesn't the game say that Irenicus means "the betrayer" or "the outcast" or something?

    Irenicus means 'Shattered One'. Queen Ellesime mentions it in one of her dialogs at the Tree of Life.
    That's what I was after...

  • brusbrus Member Posts: 944
    argent77 said:

    abacus said:

    Doesn't the game say that Irenicus means "the betrayer" or "the outcast" or something?

    Irenicus means 'Shattered One'. Queen Ellesime mentions it in one of her dialogs at the Tree of Life.
    'Shattered One' in what context?

  • argent77argent77 Member Posts: 2,577
    I'd say in the context of having a divine curse placed on him by the gods and being exiled by the elves. He pretty much lost everything that made him special by his elven nature and also lost the favor of his Queen Ellesime.

  • simplessimples Member Posts: 539
    he doesn't have pointy ears though, does he?

  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 4,350
    simples said:

    he doesn't have pointy ears though, does he?

    Bathing Cap no Jitsu.

    Given his hairless and more or less skinless head it's no wonder that he amputated his ears as well. Long ears tend to get in the way of brain surgery and the oul transfering business after all. Even his sister appears to have trimmed ears.

  • SceptenarSceptenar Member Posts: 606
    edited February 2016
    Jon Irenicus came from Suldanesselar which first appeared in "Lands of Intrigue: Book One: Tethyr", the book placed the town in the Forest of Tehir (aka The Wealdath). The same book firmly establishes that the forest is inhabited by wood elves. So Jon Irenicus is almost certainly a wood elf.

    Also illustrations of Ellesime show her having copper skin, which is typical of wood elves. So it is definitely a wood elf city, and so would it's inhabitants be.

    deltagoJuliusBorisovKamigoroshiDJKajuru
  • UnderstandMouseMagicUnderstandMouseMagic Member Posts: 2,051
    Slightly off topic, sorry, but it's too good an opportunity to miss asking this question.

    Why is Irenicus so beat up?

  • PantalionPantalion Member Posts: 2,137
    Sceptenar - From what I've read, both moon elves and green/wood/wild (I'm not even sure if they were different in 2e) elves live in the forest, does LoI go into it at all? I don't think I have access to the book.

    Slightly off topic, sorry, but it's too good an opportunity to miss asking this question.

    Why is Irenicus so beat up?

    Irenicus was de-elf'd.

    Despite their reduced constitution, elves actually have a lot going for them, physically. They regenerate scar tissue, they age very slowly, they're highly resistant to a lot of different diseases, basically a bunch of required secondary superpowers for living to 500+.

    Irenicus lost all those things, and despite being very young for an elf, as a result he is getting old, growing senile, and his body isn't handling injuries very well, including self-inflicted from experimentation.

    Also the man is clearly into S&M.

    AlexisisinneedrorikonButtercheese
  • DJKajuruDJKajuru Member Posts: 2,703
    abacus said:

    Doesn't the game say that Irenicus means "the betrayer" or "the outcast" or something?

    Actually, I remember people from chapter 6 saying that Irenicus stands for "The shattered one".

  • BladeDancerBladeDancer Member Posts: 444
    edited March 2016
    Sceptenar said:

    I did not find any mention of Silvanus being the patron of Suldanesselar, or any mention of the tree of life so those two things were likely plot devices invented for Baldur's Gate 2. Anyway, Silvanus is part of the Seldarine (the elven pantheon) so all elves revere him without particular regard for sub races.

    Neither did I, Silvanus is not the patron deity of Suldanessellar, I have the book "Volo's Guide to Baldur's Gate 2" to prove it. It is Rillifane who is the patron deity of Suldanessellar, and, believe it or not, the book claims that this priest of Rillifane called Treespeaker Rhothomir is considered by few, if not many, to be the true ruler of Suldanessellar. And the tree of life isn't mentioned in the book either, so it is likely a plot device for the game.

    Post edited by BladeDancer on
  • lunarlunar Member Posts: 3,343
    edited March 2016
    DJKajuru said:

    abacus said:

    Doesn't the game say that Irenicus means "the betrayer" or "the outcast" or something?

    Actually, I remember people from chapter 6 saying that Irenicus stands for "The shattered one".
    Queen Ellesime herself, says 'What should I call you instead? Irenicus? The shattered one?' at the confrontation at top of the Tree. As @argent77 mentioned too.

  • recklessheartrecklessheart Member Posts: 688
    Sceptenar said:

    Jon Irenicus came from Suldanesselar which first appeared in "Lands of Intrigue: Book One: Tethyr", the book placed the town in the Forest of Tehir (aka The Wealdath). The same book firmly establishes that the forest is inhabited by wood elves. So Jon Irenicus is almost certainly a wood elf.

    Also illustrations of Ellesime show her having copper skin, which is typical of wood elves. So it is definitely a wood elf city, and so would it's inhabitants be.

    I'm going to say Wood Elf as well. If nothing else, there's no identifiers in his complexion that would identify him as a Moon or Sun Elf, as per the OP's assumption. Even if Elven aesthetic characteristics were diminished when he was stripped of his heritage, I can't imagine a Moon Elf (an Elf with bluish, silvery coloration) would standardise to the same colour tones as Amnians. Wood Elves are the most congruent of the Elves aesthetically with humans.

  • ArunsunArunsun Member Posts: 1,571

    Sceptenar said:

    I did not find any mention of Silvanus being the patron of Suldanesselar, or any mention of the tree of life so those two things were likely plot devices invented for Baldur's Gate 2. Anyway, Silvanus is part of the Seldarine (the elven pantheon) so all elves revere him without particular regard for sub races.

    Neither did I, Silvanus is not the patron deity of Suldanessellar, I have the book "Volo's Guide to Baldur's Gate 2" to prove it. It is Rillifane who is the patron deity of Suldanessellar, and, believe it or not, the book claims that this priest of Rillifane called Treespeaker Rhothomir is considered by few, if not many, to be the true ruler of Suldanessellar. And the tree of life isn't mentioned in the book either, so it is likely a plot device for the game.

    Ellesime is quite close to the Seldarine though. She is said to be of divine heritage (unworldly beauty and especially long life and eternal youth even in Elven standards), and Rillifane himself says that "The Exile keeps she who is of my blood" or something along this line, which hints that she is of divine blood herself, though of course she is not a goddess.

    For the subrace, wikipedia could be wrong but:
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suldanessellar?_ga=1.233356638.1371097605.1454964761

    "Located within the nation of Tethyr, the city is populated entirely by wild elves. "

    I know Tethyr usually hosts Wood Elves but apparently Suldanesselar would be an exception.

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