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Advanced AI

Is anyone else playing with Advanced AI?

I have been in my first 2.0 playthrough, just to see what it's like. I thought I'd start a thread to compare notes.

I haven't played with party AI since my very first playthrough back in '98.

Some observations:
  1. I turned off offensive and defensive spells after a while, Jaheira and Dynaheir were wasting them on kobolds and xvarts. It did, however, remind me to use some spells I hadn't been using before. After every rest, Dyna would cast Armor. I hadn't realized that it lasted so long. Of course, casting it in the inn in town was kind of a waste since it would wear off before we got anywhere, but now I cast it when I get to the map I want to explore.
  2. Minsc charmed a wolf! Very cool. Too bad it was the one that everyone else was killing, but it's the thought that counts. Suggestion to developers: Have the script target spells like charm and hold at the enemy farthest from the party. The enemy closest to the party already has a face-full of arrows and bullets.
  3. I've got everybody set to "Prefer ranged weapons". If my front line (Minsc and PC) get close enough the enemy, we switch to melee weapons. However, after the fight, Michael immediately changes back to bow, but Minsc never does. If I don't manually change Minsc back, he will rush into melee at the next encounter.
  4. There’s another weird thing with the switching from ranged to melee. My PC is a fighter with 3 pips in shortbows, one in longswords and one in club. He’s got a bow, Varscona and a club in his quick slots. When the script switches him to melee, it always picks the club. Varscona has 16 THAC0 and 3-10(+1) damage. The ordinary club has 18 and 1-6. I don’t get the decision tree.
  5. Minsc on the other hand seems more random. Sometimes the script picks 2H sword, sometimes his dual maces.
  6. I just love the fact that I no longer have to remember to have Imoen check for traps. That right there more than makes up for the annoying portrait chooser.
So, anybody else? Has anyone found any cool things to do with these scripts? Any good combinations of settings for particular characters or classes?

CaptRoryBelgarathMTHMr2150FinnTheHumanSeraph

Comments

  • macomeaumacomeau Member Posts: 80
    I've been using the BPscripts AI for a long time, but I haven't yet reinstalled them in favour of playing with the new AI.
    1. I have the same "not switching back to ranged weapons" problem on my PC, who is also a Ranger. She's the only one.
    2. I also have a Dwarf Fighter/Cleric who won't automatically turn undead, but my Ranger will hide in shadows, my Bard sings and my Thief will search for traps.
    3. While characters are happy to use potions to recover HP, I haven't noticed anyone using other quick items. Imoen's wand of Magic Missiles still has all its charges, no matter who's been carrying it.
    4. No weapon choice problems, but most of my characters don't have a choice beyond ranged or melee.
    On the whole BP is still better (presuming no new compatibility issues) but the new AI does get massive points for not having to fuss with anything external. For me, it's probably Good Enough™ that I won't switch back. The biggest miss, for me, is that characters only heal themselves. BP has options for healers to take care of anyone low on HP. I also kind of miss BP's 'hack' to have thieves both hide in shadows and search for traps.

    BillyYank
  • BillyYankBillyYank Member Posts: 2,769
    I've seen characters heal each other on my current game. I actually had a problem with spell wasteage when both Jaheira and Charname healed Khalid at the same time. I don't know what the threshold is, but in that case Khalid was probably less than 25%. He still didn't need 2 cure lights.

    macomeau
  • macomeaumacomeau Member Posts: 80
    Yeah, I guess it could be a party construction/timing thing. My two characters most likely to lose HP can (and do) both self-heal (Cavalier and Fighter/Cleric) and everyone else has potions. Healing also seems to be lower priority than it would be under the BP script. I'm used to healers that will drop what they're doing to heal much more readily than they seem to under the new AI, so it may be that the Cleric isn't healing anyone else because they've already drunk a potion by the time he frees himself up.

  • BillyYankBillyYank Member Posts: 2,769
    I think you're right about the priority, I don't recall anyone healing someone during combat, only after the fighting was over.

  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,533
    I don't use the party AI, but I am definitely noticing enemies behaving more intelligently, especially the enemy casters. They have some very surprising behaviors now. For example, if they are about to be surrounded, they try to move away a bit. They also have new spell lists and scripts.

    Melee enemies have personality-specific scripts that make them interesting. Cave bears are faster and no longer insist on chasing the same target until killed (they will switch targets, making them harder to kite.) Gnolls are more likely than before to move around your front line and go for your squishies when attacking in groups.

    All in all, I'd say the AI changes are a step forward. I wasn't too sure about it at first, but I'm starting to really like it now.

    Loldrup
  • BillyYankBillyYank Member Posts: 2,769
    After using advanced AI for another few months, I've noticed another problem with it. It takes far too long for a character to switch to melee weapons when an enemy gets in close. I've seen wolves make two attacks before the character switched from bow to sword. I know that characters take a penalty to THAC0 when attacking with a ranged weapon in close quarters, and I think they also take a penalty to AC. That transition needs to happen much more quickly.

    Mr2150
  • Mr2150Mr2150 Member Posts: 1,170
    I use the Advcanced AI - I really like it.

    I turn off all spells (offensive/defensive), like you, to save them wasting the spells at the wrong time. I tend to give my front row 'Attack Enemies' Off, and 'Prefer Melee' On. My back row have 'Use Ranged' On and 'Attack Enemies' On. That way they will automatically attack as the enemies approach my front row who stay still (maximising the ranged attack). When the enemies reach my front row I manually get them to attack, changing the target of the back row so that they are softening the next lot of enemies.

    If the character has a special ability ('Find Traps', 'Sing', 'Turn Undead', etc) then I tend to leave that on.

    A nice feature would be to have spell casting of a user editable list only - so use offensive/defensive/user defined spells. That way you are choosing what spells are allowed rather than just offensive/defensive. That's how 'Use Items' works essentially (the quick slots are the allowable items to use, I think).

    One really frustrating thing I've found is if the AI option has a line of dialogue attached to it. Corwin, for example, will say "Shhh, I'm hidden'" every time she hides. Leaving it on, while useful, can get awfully repetitive when you've heard that dialogue 20 times in 5 minutes.

    LoldruplunarArdul
  • I tried the AI on my pre-made party, but quickly turned it off. My archers would shoot their bows, kill one enemy, then just stand there like idiots.

  • BillyYankBillyYank Member Posts: 2,769
    Yes, that's another problem with the AI. There's nothing in there about joining the fight if the character can't see any enemies. So in a ranged fight, your front row guys could still be shooting arrows at the bad guys, but your back row can't see them, and there's nothing in the script that says "if the fight is still going on, move forward until you see an enemy, then attack."

  • Yeah, I wasn't impressed when I tried it. Although for some reason, when I play a game, somehow some of my PCs get switched to an AI script, and I have to switch it off.

    Also my PCs like to chase their enemies, if they're fighting something and it runs, they automatically go after it.

    I think this is more like a combat move than an AI thing. Like if you're attacking something, you'll continue to attack it even if it moves.

    I don't mind it too much, but sometimes my party gets too scattered. It's easy to remedy, though, by giving commands to the chasing PCs to stop them from running helter-skelter.

  • DJKajuruDJKajuru Member Posts: 3,254
    I didn't like all of it, but I sure loved the new AI system . For the same reasons you guys mentioned above I avoid automatic spellcasting. I leave "attack" only for fighters and choose whether to use melee or ranged manually and "ranged attack" for Archers everyone else. Rangers get "hide in shadows" and rogues "detect traps".

    I don't use "turn undead" because it's situational and avoid "sing" because to me it sounds silly to have a party member sing forever .

    SirBundlesofJoy_1912
  • cervanntescervanntes Member Posts: 64

    I tried the AI on my pre-made party, but quickly turned it off. My archers would shoot their bows, kill one enemy, then just stand there like idiots.


    I don't know if this is the case in your example, but one thing I noticed with the new AI is that if your weapons won't hurt the enemy, it won't use them. This can result in one or more characters doing exactly what you just described -- standing around looking like idiots. After I while I figured out this was because they had killed all enemies that they could. For example, if I was facing a vampire with three ghouls, my archers using normal arrows might take down the ghouls, and then stand around like idiots because their normal arrows wouldn't harm the vampire. Switch them to arrows that can affect a vampire, and suddenly they are shooting again.

    SirBundlesofJoy_1912
  • Ahhh, good to know! I didn't think of that. I did change some settings last night. For Auto-Pause, I usually don't use it at all, but I ticked the options for when an enemy is sighted and when a weapon is ineffective.
    The pause for sighting enemies is OK, it may take some time getting used to, or I may just switch it off. But I like the pause for unusable weapons, because usually in the heat of battle, I don't read the stuff below in the text window that would indicate that a weapon is ineffective.

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