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Cat's Grace and Strength stacking with Druid forms or anything that gives a fixed set value

Opus131Opus131 Member Posts: 17
Is this normal?

I was playing around with attempting to make Druid forms viable in combat. Casting either of those spells after changing form, i only get a max bonus of 2 points. Small improvement, but i thought it was something. Then i noticed that if i cast those spells BEFORE changing form, i get whatever bonus i had when i used them on my Druid in his human form. So if my Druid has a strength of 10, and the strength spell raises it to 16, those 6 points are going to be added to whatever form i change to. So if it's a sword spider, i end up with a strength score of 22!

This has to be a bug, all the more because if my Druid has a base strength of say 16, so the strength spell can only raise it by 2 points, only 2 points get added when i change form. So to get those powerful stats as a Druid, i have to have low stats to start with, in order to allow the full bonus from the spell.

BTW, this works with stuff like the Gauntlets of Ogre Power as well, but again only if you allow the bonus from a low strength score. So if you have a warrior with low strength, you can actually get to 25 from wearing those gloves by rolling anything above 7 with the spell.

This all seems very broken. I also noticed some other odd stuff. Like, you can get the bonus from single weapon style as a form, which i guess makes some sense, but if you put a weapon in the second hand slot, you can get that weapon's damage added as an extra attack for the animal's damage, which again i assume it's a bug.

So what gives? I was playing around with EEKeeper, merely to raise levels and experiment with builds, i don't know if it broke something. It's gonna be hard playing a Druid who changes forms often while this exploit is staring you in the face.


  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,606
    edited June 2018
    I don't see why it would be a problem. A spell enhances your natural characteristics. If your natural characteristics are better, the spell will improve something that is already better.

    It is like giving a ladder to a short and to a tall person. Or, in this case, to a short person that becomes taller.

  • Opus131Opus131 Member Posts: 17
    Well, several things.

    First, those spells have a limit to how high they can go, and that's for a reason. Strength can only get you to 18 if you are not a warrior, and 18/00 if you are, and those bonuses are not supposed to stack with other stat enhancing items, except in this case they do. With this trick, you can basically give your warrior a permanent strength of 25, considering those spells last for hours at high level. How is this not completely broken?

    Second, this is obviously not working as intended, because if you get no bonus from the spell, nothing is added. If your warrior has a strength of 18/00, the strength spell adds nothing so you get no bonus with the Gauntlets of Ogre Power. Same with the animal forms. If your druid has a strength of 18, you get nothing when you cast the strength spell after you shifted.

    And BTW, while experimenting with this, it happened a couple of times that the bonus i got from shifting stayed after i shifted back. So the 22 i had on my sword spider stayed when i reverted back to my human form, but this only happened a few times, so something is obviously broken here.

  • Opus131Opus131 Member Posts: 17
    edited June 2018
    Well, i figured out how to play around this in a way that doesn't feel cheesy.

    I made an Avenger with a strength of 12 and dexterity of 16 to take full advantage of the strength spell and cat's grace, but i also used EEKeeper to give him the cursed belt (the on that drops strength to 6) at level 1, which he'll wear permanently. That ought to be enough of a trade of for running around as a sword spider with a strength of 22, or a water elemental with a strength of 25 etc.

    See, it's not a bug if you can find a role playing justification, haha.

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