Make up your mind bro. You DO care if you VOTE. Else you would have simply avoid voting and move to the next thread, weren't you interested.
I beg to differ, as you yourself stated: you have no experience of BG pvp. How can say so?
Really? We are talking about a game that has been so since 12, almost 13 years and you think someone would agree to change something for a pvp-purpose? None wants that. They can put simple rules as: no Time Stop or Transformation: Mindflayer allowed. Easy. Enjoy it or leave it, I say.
I have my suspicions about your motivations at this point "bro", but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and make a final attempt.
Yes I don't have any experience at BG "PvP". I do have lots of experience with BG's mechanics though. Mechanics you didn't outline how you would want changed, if at all, in your first post. So I assumed you didn't want them changed. Casting Sleep is enough to take out a level 1 party after which you could simply have a barbarian or something chomp them out as they lay there. That works just fine in single-player and would work just fine in multi-player as well unless things were massively changed.
There's plenty of other spells that would also be massively powerful, pick basically any crowd-control spell and quite a few offensive spells; Death, Horrid Wilting, Flesh to Stone, Hold Person, Dominate... there's a loooong list that would have people screaming for nerfs. It's not limited to magic either, an assassin backstabbing and one-shotting arcane casters, barbarians and berserkers turning immune to various spells with their rage...
Are there ways around all these things? Yes. Does that usually seem to matter when people feel something is "overpowered" because they lost to it? No. They then ask for and inevitably recieve nerfs. Which affects the abilities for people who weren't using them against other players and had no intention of doing so.
You're saying noone would want changes, but you also said earlier that you have PvP experience from MMORPGs:
As regards the pvp system, I played daoc, guild wars, lineage2, and many others just for the pvp.
And with that being the case you know damn well that no matter which aspect of the game you prefer, PvE or PvP, people -will- want changes for their preferred aspect. I refuse to believe you've played all those games without picking up on that fact. And of course it makes perfect sense that people want the game to be fun and thus ask for changes in order for it to be just that. It would be cruel of the developers to not listen to it and selfish of non-pvpers to deny it.
I would not care if The Black Pits could be used for PvP; I maintain that. I would care if PvP influenced the PvE and it seems very likely it would. The poll's question and answers aren't phrased very well nor is the initial post very detailed. I thought my vote could mean "No thanks, but wouldn't oppose it" when I backed it up with posting. Evidently it couldn't so I would remove my vote were it possible. I apologize for not being clear on what I (don't) care about and for voting with that in mind.
It's been said already, the developers took a look at what it would take to introduce PvP in the game. I'll admit Black Pits would make a great place to implement it and I don't deny the value of having PvP in BG. But truth the matter is AD&D rules are not well designed for PvP. The developers themselves said the amount of things they would need to change in the code would be enormous. Also because of balancing issues, not just spells but between classes too.
While this pool may serve as a possible gauge of the interest in PvP, it will clearly go nowhere else. It's also a bit unusual to witness such a bad understanding of the AD&D rules and their implications on PvP. Anyone (anyone!) who has ever played Pen & Paper AD&D knows very well how bad PvP can go.
Does that usually seem to matter when people feel something is "overpowered" because they lost to it? No.
Here I do not. This game has already his rules, no one ever thought of nerfing spells or abilities that were NOT customs coming from mods. If, let's suppose, a player lose a match because he was charmed/whatever, the next time he will learn how to use the appropriate potions/scrolls/item to avoid it. Even changing class/race if needed. Also, I would like you to reflect upon the fact that, unlike almost every MMORPG, here a wrong choice of actions during your turn can really matter. Another cool aspect is that this kind of pvps would be based only on personal skill to elaborate tactics and builds. Not on xp/item/enchantments farming. This game is entirely ruled by Maths, after all.
Anyone (anyone!) who has ever played Pen & Paper AD&D knows very well how bad PvP can go.
That's your own opinion. Mine is that fantasy PvP was born even thanks to D&D. And anyone (anyone!) who has ever played Pen & Paper AD&D knows very well what it means to wish to fight the character used by another player, for a reason or for another. Since the DM itself is a PERSON.
Comments
Yes I don't have any experience at BG "PvP". I do have lots of experience with BG's mechanics though. Mechanics you didn't outline how you would want changed, if at all, in your first post. So I assumed you didn't want them changed. Casting Sleep is enough to take out a level 1 party after which you could simply have a barbarian or something chomp them out as they lay there. That works just fine in single-player and would work just fine in multi-player as well unless things were massively changed.
There's plenty of other spells that would also be massively powerful, pick basically any crowd-control spell and quite a few offensive spells; Death, Horrid Wilting, Flesh to Stone, Hold Person, Dominate... there's a loooong list that would have people screaming for nerfs. It's not limited to magic either, an assassin backstabbing and one-shotting arcane casters, barbarians and berserkers turning immune to various spells with their rage...
Are there ways around all these things? Yes. Does that usually seem to matter when people feel something is "overpowered" because they lost to it? No. They then ask for and inevitably recieve nerfs. Which affects the abilities for people who weren't using them against other players and had no intention of doing so.
You're saying noone would want changes, but you also said earlier that you have PvP experience from MMORPGs: And with that being the case you know damn well that no matter which aspect of the game you prefer, PvE or PvP, people -will- want changes for their preferred aspect. I refuse to believe you've played all those games without picking up on that fact. And of course it makes perfect sense that people want the game to be fun and thus ask for changes in order for it to be just that. It would be cruel of the developers to not listen to it and selfish of non-pvpers to deny it.
I would not care if The Black Pits could be used for PvP; I maintain that. I would care if PvP influenced the PvE and it seems very likely it would. The poll's question and answers aren't phrased very well nor is the initial post very detailed. I thought my vote could mean "No thanks, but wouldn't oppose it" when I backed it up with posting. Evidently it couldn't so I would remove my vote were it possible. I apologize for not being clear on what I (don't) care about and for voting with that in mind.
It's been said already, the developers took a look at what it would take to introduce PvP in the game. I'll admit Black Pits would make a great place to implement it and I don't deny the value of having PvP in BG. But truth the matter is AD&D rules are not well designed for PvP. The developers themselves said the amount of things they would need to change in the code would be enormous. Also because of balancing issues, not just spells but between classes too.
While this pool may serve as a possible gauge of the interest in PvP, it will clearly go nowhere else. It's also a bit unusual to witness such a bad understanding of the AD&D rules and their implications on PvP. Anyone (anyone!) who has ever played Pen & Paper AD&D knows very well how bad PvP can go.
This game has already his rules, no one ever thought of nerfing spells or abilities that were NOT customs coming from mods.
If, let's suppose, a player lose a match because he was charmed/whatever, the next time he will learn how to use the appropriate potions/scrolls/item to avoid it. Even changing class/race if needed.
Also, I would like you to reflect upon the fact that, unlike almost every MMORPG, here a wrong choice of actions during your turn can really matter.
Another cool aspect is that this kind of pvps would be based only on personal skill to elaborate tactics and builds.
Not on xp/item/enchantments farming.
This game is entirely ruled by Maths, after all.
Mine is that fantasy PvP was born even thanks to D&D.
And anyone (anyone!) who has ever played Pen & Paper AD&D knows very well what it means to wish to fight the character used by another player, for a reason or for another. Since the DM itself is a PERSON.