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Would people rather have Baldur's Gate 3, or a Planescape: Torment sequel?

jbrownosjbrownos Member Posts: 7
in Archive (General Discussion)
@TrentOster mentioned an eventual goal of Baldur's Gate 3, and I can't help but think about Planescape: Torment. I'm sure there are more than a few people who would love to see some kind of sequel to it, myself included. As great as the Baldur's Gate series is, PS:T truly demonstrated that gaming could be an artform. It also has the advantage of breaking out of the cliches of traditional fantasy settings, and Planescape has a really unique and exotic feel to it.

I know PS:T was developed in-house at Black Isle, rather than at Bioware. Considering the state of Interplay these days, I'm willing to bet that they would jump at the chance to sell or license any needed assets from it. Also, the Nameless One always ended up in the same position after the end of the game. The Baldur's Gate series could have fundamentally different endings. That means it would probably be far easier to link the original plot PS:T into a sequel.

If the developers are set on eventually doing Baldur's Gate 3, it could help facilitate a Planescape sequel. It'll be necessary to find, update, or develop a new engine. No matter which sequel were to come first, a lot of the assets would then be available to make the other one. And even if Beamdog lacks the resources to consider doing both, they could always outsource it. I suspect that a group like Obsidian or other former members of Troika or Black Isle would love to work on it.

So what do people think? Would your first preference be another Baldur's Gate, or would you be even more excited about something else in the Planescape setting?



P.S. Would Baldur's Gate 3 likely be based on material from The Black Hound? Or would it just start from scratch?
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Comments

  • JorkanJorkan Member Posts: 74
    What about an all new IP or a Ravenloft game?
  • ChillyJennyChillyJenny Member Posts: 4
    PST or BG3? Cant we just have both? :)
  • TJ_HookerTJ_Hooker Member Posts: 2,438
    edited December 2012
    Not sure if you've seen this so:
    http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/10002/planescape-torment-sequel-on-the-way

    So it looks like we could get BG3 from beamdog, Torment sequel (or successor, whatever) from this Colin McComb guy.
  • AllbrotherAllbrother Member Posts: 262
    I'd say Torment
    But I wouldn't trust anyone other than Obsidian with it
    However, I believe Interplay holds the license and with them bringing the Black Isle name back...
  • MitchellMitchell Member Posts: 28
    Silchas said:

    I'd say Torment
    But I wouldn't trust anyone other than Obsidian with it

    This is exactly what I was thinking. As much as I admire Beamdog for their work bringing Baldur's Gate back, and I'd be supportive of them should they get the opportunity to make BG3, Planescape Torment is on a whole other level. They'd really have to prove themselves with their writing capabilities before I would trust them with a sequel to PST. Obsidian have already proven themselves in that capacity, and they already have Chris Avellone, who was the lead designer on the original game.
  • ShadowdemonShadowdemon Member Posts: 80
    It sound like InXile is doing the Torment sequel (probably won't be D&D though). It was recently announced that they have the rights. I would love to see BG3 or even a Dark Sun game.
  • AllbrotherAllbrother Member Posts: 262
    Shadowdemon said:

    It sound like InXile is doing the Torment sequel (probably won't be D&D though). It was recently announced that they have the rights.

    link?

    I thought they're busy with Wasteland 2
  • RenulanRenulan Member Posts: 109
    BG3
  • reedmilfamreedmilfam Member Posts: 2,808
    There already is a PlaneScape Torment sequel, so it looks like we can have cake and eat it too!
  • AnduineAnduine Member Posts: 416
    Planescape: Torment by default, because there is no way to add a true sequel to the Baldur's Gate series without interfering with the story, which ended in Baldur's Gate 2.

    Take Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance, for instance. It might share the name, but that's it. That game has nothing to do with the the Baldur's Gate series or the tale of the Bhaalspawn.
  • SilverstarSilverstar Member Posts: 2,207
    I'd prefer Baldur's Gate III. New protagonist, new story (though it could by all means borrow from the predecessors) and new party members.

    A new Planescape game would be cool too of course, but I'd rather have my BG first.
  • jbrownosjbrownos Member Posts: 7
    edited December 2012
    reedmilfam said:

    There already is a PlaneScape Torment sequel, so it looks like we can have cake and eat it too!

    If you're talking about what Brian Fargo's apparently doing, it's not actually Planescape. Apparently WotC/Hasbro wasn't especially willing to work out an agreement for them to use the setting. (Which is probably to be expected with now that DnD is really just another corporate holding.) If Beamdog is considering making BG3, they apparently managed to overcome that hurdle already.

    I'm excited about the game Fargo is working towards, and apparently they're even using the name "Torment" (minus the Planescape). It sounds like he's trying to replicate the depth and style that made the original so great. Still, I'd really like to see somebody use the Planescape setting again. The Baldur's Gate series has a good storyline, but the general feel of it is somewhat limited by the unimaginative setting. The same elves, halflings, orcs, and a world that's heavily based on medieval Earth is really a huge limitation towards being creative.
    Anduine said:

    there is no way to add a true sequel to the Baldur's Gate series without interfering with the story, which ended in Baldur's Gate 2.

    This is another major problem with the Forgotten Realms. It's so bogged down with existing lore that has to be worked around. Even more problematic, any link to the original BG storyline will be difficult. The choices the player makes can vary tremendous, which means there isn't really even a definite story to reference. That's likely to make the Baldur's Gate name mainly symbolic. The game may have a lot of similarities, but it will likely have to be a completely new game that's just in the same setting.
  • TJ_HookerTJ_Hooker Member Posts: 2,438
    jbrownos said:

    reedmilfam said:

    There already is a PlaneScape Torment sequel, so it looks like we can have cake and eat it too!

    If you're talking about what Brian Fargo's apparently doing, it's not actually Planescape. Apparently WotC/Hasbro wasn't especially willing to work out an agreement for them to use the setting. (Which is probably to be expected with now that DnD is really just another corporate holding.) If Beamdog is considering making BG3, they apparently managed to overcome that hurdle already.

    I'm excited about the game Fargo is working towards, and apparently they're even using the name "Torment" (minus the Planescape). It sounds like he's trying to replicate the depth and style that made the original so great. Still, I'd really like to see somebody use the Planescape setting again. The Baldur's Gate series has a good storyline, but the general feel of it is somewhat limited by the unimaginative setting. The same elves, halflings, orcs, and a world that's heavily based on medieval Earth is really a huge limitation towards being creative.
    Where did you hear that Brian Fargo is involved? All I've heard is that Colin McComb, a writer from PS:T, made some comments on his blog musing about a sequel, and that he'd received Chris Avellone's "blessing" to do so.
  • phoenixclphoenixcl Member Posts: 31
    I'd much prefer Baldur's Gate 3 since it likely will continue in the tradition of being able to create your own character. I never played Planescape: Torment, but from what I read you really don't create your character and much of him is already predetermined, which kind of turns me off (I also don't like his ugly zombie appearance).

    And Baldur's Gate 3 should start from scratch. Anyone who wants to continue off a series with well known sequels know they're getting themselves into potentially deep water when it comes to the rabid fanboys/girls of the first two games (one needs only to look at the Mass Effect and Dragon Age series). Starting off on a clean plate with no established canon from the previous games is the wisest course of action. It gives the players a chance for a new protagonist, a brand new story and cast, and it doesn't muck up their personal canons (prevents backlash).
  • jbrownosjbrownos Member Posts: 7
    edited December 2012
    TJ_Hooker said:


    Where did you hear that Brian Fargo is involved? All I've heard is that Colin McComb, a writer from PS:T, made some comments on his blog musing about a sequel, and that he'd received Chris Avellone's "blessing" to do so.

    Arc Technica published an article about it a few days ago:

    http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2012/12/planescape-torment-sequel-finally-in-the-works/

    It mentioned the part about Colin McComb and Chris Avellone, but they also had some comments from Fargo about it. Apparently he's even filed for a trademark of the name "Torment" (once again, minus the Planescape). Fargo didn't directly state that he was involved in what McComb is planning, but it seems very likely that what he's doing is related to it.
    phoenixcl said:

    I'd much prefer Baldur's Gate 3 since it likely will continue in the tradition of being able to create your own character. I never played Planescape: Torment, but from what I read you really don't create your character and much of him is already predetermined, which kind of turns me off (I also don't like his ugly zombie appearance).

    You don't get to create the main character's backstory, gender, or appearance. But once you start playing the game, you greatly influence who the character is. The level of actual roleplaying is immense, and you get to choose how to define yourself in the world around you.

    You really should try to play PS:T at some point, as should anyone else who hasn't. When it came out, I was about 15, and it had a lasting impact on parts of my philosophical outlook. I think you can download it from Good Old Games for about $10, and it should work on pretty much any version of Windows. I'm hoping there will also be an Enhanced Edition of it in the foreseeable future.
    Post edited by jbrownos on
  • lestatlestat Member Posts: 299
    def bg3
  • AnduineAnduine Member Posts: 416
    edited December 2012
    jbrownos said:

    This is another major problem with the Forgotten Realms. It's so bogged down with existing lore that has to be worked around. Even more problematic, any link to the original BG storyline will be difficult. The choices the player makes can vary tremendous, which means there isn't really even a definite story to reference. That's likely to make the Baldur's Gate name mainly symbolic. The game may have a lot of similarities, but it will likely have to be a completely new game that's just in the same setting.


    It should be noted that I am perfectly OK with and fully supportive of making new Infinity Engine games set in the Forgotten Realms that utilize AD&D 2.0, just not trying to remake a completed story. What is the game going to be about? Irenicus, Sarevok, and Bhaal didn't stay dead? The 7 dragonballs were collected to summon Shenron, and you need to defeat the previous 3 and find the person who resurrected them? No thanks.
  • TJ_HookerTJ_Hooker Member Posts: 2,438
    jbrownos said:

    TJ_Hooker said:


    Where did you hear that Brian Fargo is involved? All I've heard is that Colin McComb, a writer from PS:T, made some comments on his blog musing about a sequel, and that he'd received Chris Avellone's "blessing" to do so.

    Arc Technica published an article about it a few days ago:

    http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2012/12/planescape-torment-sequel-finally-in-the-works/

    It mentioned the part about Colin McComb and Chris Avellone, but they also had some comments from Fargo about it. Apparently he's even filed for a trademark of the name "Torment" (once again, minus the Planescape). Fargo didn't directly state that he was involved in what McComb is planning, but it seems very likely that what he's doing is related to it.
    Well Brian Fargo being involved would certainly be good news. Up until this point all I'd heard about was Colin's involvement, which worried me because a single writer doesn't get you very far in making a video game. But If Brian is involved, and therefore inXile, that would go a long way in boosting my confidence that a sequel wll actually happen.
  • davemodavemo Member Posts: 147
    PS:T is my all time fav. I actually prefer set main characters, especially one so odd. But, to be fair, this is my first time playing BG and I never finished BG2, so I can't compare.

    In general, I prefer sci fi to strict fantasy.
  • lDanielHolmlDanielHolm Member Posts: 225
    I could see a Torment sequel, but it would have to be very, very, very well done.
  • GuboGubo Member Posts: 77
    davemo said:

    PS:T is my all time fav. I actually prefer set main characters, especially one so odd. But, to be fair, this is my first time playing BG and I never finished BG2, so I can't compare.

    In general, I prefer sci fi to strict fantasy.

    I completely agree. The setting of PS:T is really unique and even though you play as a "predetermined char," thats an aspect that made it so great. Plus a lot more races and all the planes that you "could" go to, lets say, a sequel, gives a lot of room to mess around with. PS:T is definitely in my top five games, love it!
  • ElendarElendar Member Posts: 831
    I never really got into PS:T..... granted, I haven't tried it since I was a teenager...
  • AllbrotherAllbrother Member Posts: 262
    Anduine said:

    jbrownos said:

    This is another major problem with the Forgotten Realms. It's so bogged down with existing lore that has to be worked around. Even more problematic, any link to the original BG storyline will be difficult. The choices the player makes can vary tremendous, which means there isn't really even a definite story to reference. That's likely to make the Baldur's Gate name mainly symbolic. The game may have a lot of similarities, but it will likely have to be a completely new game that's just in the same setting.


    It should be noted that I am perfectly OK with and fully supportive of making new Infinity Engine games set in the Forgotten Realms that utilize AD&D 2.0, just not trying to remake a completed story. What is the game going to be about? Irenicus, Sarevok, and Bhaal didn't stay dead? The 7 dragonballs were collected to summon Shenron, and you need to defeat the previous 3 and find the person who resurrected them? No thanks.
    It has to be connected to the bhaalspawn story in some way
    Otherwise why slap the name on it?

    Now I agree that the bhaalspawn's time as a protagonist is over. Doesn't mean a new character can't pick up where the old one left of.

    Here's an example for a premise:

    After the final showdown in ToB, nobody knows exactly what happened but whatever it was had huge impact. Where once was the power of the Lord of Murder, now there's a big-ass void. As a result Cyric is crippled and his buddies in the pantheon retaliated against his enemies, starting conflict between the gods which just might escalate into an all out war and possibly bring about Time of Troubles 2.0.
    Some entity who doesn't want all that to happen tasks Average Joe the adventurer to go find out what the **** happened in that pocket plane and set things right
    And here we go

    Now I'm no writer, not very knowledgeable of FR lore and kinda sleep deprived and all this is probably very bad but it serves the purpose of showing that ToB's ending isn't all that final and anything can be tied to it
  • AnduineAnduine Member Posts: 416
    edited December 2012
    @Silchas: "Otherwise why slap the name on it?" EXACTLY! Why should the name be slapped on it? Why does the game's name HAVE to be Baldur's Gate 3? Icewind Dale was an Infinity Engine game set in the Forgotten Realms utilizing AD&D 2.0 and succeeded despite having no relation to the Bhaalspawn story.

    Baldur's Gate ended in Throne of Bhaal. That does not mean games very similar to Baldur's Gate or IceWind Dale have to end too.
    Post edited by Anduine on
  • ZanathKariashiZanathKariashi Member Posts: 2,869
    IF they were able I wouldn't mind seeing the Throne of bhaal fleshed out a little bit more. The overall story wouldn't change, but adding some new areas and side quests to make it less linear would be nice.


    Both Baldur's gate and Planescape concluded their stories...so a sequel would be more of an in-name only type deal.

    Though I wouldn't mind seeing a game that combined all the best elements of Baldur's Gate and Torment. Baldur's Gate at it's core is a dungeon crawler with a bit more of a story. Planescape on the other hand was almost devoid of combat...well...you had the option to do it, but the game was postively boring if you took that route. Talking and developing memories and insights was a large part of what made Torment so awesome. It was heavy story and interaction driven. Which is pretty rare for a game to go to that degree. (I also like Fallout 1/2 and Arcanum for much the same reasons..they actually gave you several different ways of doing most things, where as in BG, it's almost always going to come down to combat (well..baring a Naked Algernon's cloak run...but..how often does that happen?), though the story itself is redeeming enough to look past that minor flaw)
  • KurumiKurumi Member Posts: 520
    I'd rather have IWD3.
  • TomeTome Member Posts: 466
    edited December 2012
    I would like a new BG trilogy, if I'm honest. Similar style and scope, but with a new character. It would be cool if the game talked about the Bhaalspawn becoming a god if you chose it, but it shouldn't be a major thing.

    I'd absolutely love it if Throne of Bhaal was redone or has loads of stuff added to it as well.
  • HowieHowie Member Posts: 136
    We had a "spiritual successor" of BG called DA:O. Sorry, I guess making an IWD 3 is probably easier for modern developers.
  • TomeTome Member Posts: 466
    Much I loved the first Dragon Age, it was pretty much only a 'successor' in name. It was fantastic, but very different.
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