Skip to content

Dorn a Bhaalspawn?? *Spoilers*

DaelricDaelric Member Posts: 266
in Archive (General Discussion)
In Throne of Bhaal, there is a Bhaalspawn in Saradush named Gromnir Il-Khan. Obviously I'd imagine him being related to Dorn Il-Khan, most likely brother or son. So do you guys think that we'll find out eventually that Dorn is a Bhaalspawn as well? I'd imagine he'd want the power for himself once he finds out, and a showdown would be inevitable. Also that would explain some of the mysterious power Dorn has.
«1

Comments

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited December 2012
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • DaelricDaelric Member Posts: 266
    Why would that matter? Wouldn't that make it even more interesting?
  • AndrasteAndraste Member Posts: 78
    I don't really think of hot Bhaalspawn-on-Bhaalspawn action as incest, but a lot of people do. I somehow doubt it's going to be in the game for that reason.
  • NukeninNukenin Member Posts: 327
    "My powers are none of your concern, unless you are looking for a strong arm to join you."


    Sounds like he's a B-something. -lackguard, -haalspawn, same number of letters, same number of syllables. I'm calling it.*

    *Don't know what I'm calling it, but I'm calling it!
  • DaelricDaelric Member Posts: 266
    Well... to be honest, incest hadn't really crossed my mind... but if Dorn is related to Gromnir, who is your brother I guess, isn't there incest already?

    I don't think of it as incest though, I doubt they share Bhaal's DNA... I'd imagine they just share his divine power. That's how I think of it anyway.
  • DaelricDaelric Member Posts: 266
    @Nukenin I agree, I think he's definately Bhaalspawn.

    And when you find out he is, and if you romanced him... lol... It's gunna be like in Tolkien's book The Children of Hurin, if anyone has read it.
  • NukeninNukenin Member Posts: 327
    Maybe Dorn is Gromnir's bitter ex. One or the other kept the surname (of course we're assuming it's a surname and implies some sort of familial connection).
  • DaelricDaelric Member Posts: 266
    I can't imagine getting mixed up between two gay half-orc ex-lovers... NOW THAT'S some Springer shit lol
  • NukeninNukenin Member Posts: 327
    Don't forget the likelihood that one or more Girdles of Feminity/Masculinity may have been involved.
  • MadhaxMadhax Member Posts: 1,416
    I haven't found anything through Google and I don't have a D&D rule book to consult, but I assumed that Dorn and Gromnir are simply in the same clan. I doubt they're any closer related than cousins, and are more likely distant cousins. I'm sure that Dorn will have some sort of unique interaction with Gromnir in ToB, but I seriously doubt that Dorn is a Bhaalspawn or that there are any incestuous implications of a PC romancing him.
  • DarkcloudDarkcloud Member Posts: 302
    Nukenin said:

    "My powers are none of your concern, unless you are looking for a strong arm to join you."


    Sounds like he's a B-something. -lackguard, -haalspawn, same number of letters, same number of syllables. I'm calling it.*

    *Don't know what I'm calling it, but I'm calling it!
    The source of his power is revealed at the end of his quest and is pretty obvious if you read the 3ed description of the Blackguard or even the in game description. I guess its more like that it will be revealed that he is his brother and was always jealous of his brother because he was stronger than him for some reason he never knew until now.
  • doomdoomdoomdoomdoomdoom Member Posts: 89
    He could be, if they decide to go that way. Make it so that him and Gromnir are twins.
    Or they could make his mysterious patron involved in that whole Bhaal thing somehow, because after the PC's heritage is revealed he admits that his patron led him to PC.

    As for romance getting in the way of him being bhaalspawn because of incest implications... Who said anything about there ever being any hot action? So far it seems more like bromance than anything else. It is available to both PC genders so far, and I really can't imagine him going bi in BG2. He seems to be into chicks. So unless they design two different romance paths for both genders, which I don't think is very likely, he could be a close friend type of guy.
  • MadhaxMadhax Member Posts: 1,416
    doomdoomdoom said:


    As for romance getting in the way of him being bhaalspawn because of incest implications... Who said anything about there ever being any hot action? So far it seems more like bromance than anything else. It is available to both PC genders so far, and I really can't imagine him going bi in BG2. He seems to be into chicks. So unless they design two different romance paths for both genders, which I don't think is very likely, he could be a close friend type of guy.

    I didn't personally check, but I heard it confirmed that Dorn is bisexual and a potential romance option for male PCs.
  • MERLANCEMERLANCE Member Posts: 421
    He is a half orc with a human mother. Therefore, his father would have to be an orc. It makes more sense to me that if Bhaal was his father, then he would just be a human instead.

    He and Gromnir are probably just both from the Il Khan clan of orcs.

    The incest thing is really kind of a grey area. I mean, yeah it is, and its weird, but still it doesnt go to the extremely gross area (no more so than Bhaal mating with a fire giant or a dragon)
  • RiolathelRiolathel Member Posts: 330
    edited December 2012
    It is incest when they share one of the same parent and all bhaalspawns do.. but i seriously doubt Dorn is a bhaalspawn.
  • NukeninNukenin Member Posts: 327
    Does Dorn know his mother, or does he just believe the lies they told him?

    I know (half-orc) CHARNAME's mother was allegedly a half-orc. But we know what a
    liar
    Gorion was. What if she was Dorn's mother too? Dorn's bad news all around for CHARNAME!
  • MERLANCEMERLANCE Member Posts: 421
    Dorn says he fled his tribe when ogres attacked to Luskan with his human mother.
  • NukeninNukenin Member Posts: 327
    I suspect shenanigans.

    I always do.
  • GoodSteveGoodSteve Member Posts: 607
    Well, I actually have an ear in all the talks over at Overhaul and they've got this thing all planned out already.

    I'd love to let you all know what I heard but, you know... contract limitations.
  • PugPugPugPug Member Posts: 560
    It doesn't do much good to put the spoiler warning after the spoiler in the subject line.
  • NukeninNukenin Member Posts: 327
    You will never look at the Flail of Ages the same way again.
    Especially the poison head.


    I just exceeded my contract limitations.
  • Arsene_LupinArsene_Lupin Member Posts: 181
    My understanding is NOT that Bhaal went around raping any female of any species he could find. Remember, he was put in a human body. It would have been difficult--on a practical level--to go around mating with a bunch of humans, elves, orcs, dragons and whatnot in the time he had, with the, er, anatomy he was dealt.

    As I understand it, Bhaal simply implanted his "divine essence" into unborn and newborn children. (This is backed up possibly, I think, by an image from one of the BG2 movies showing a clawed--Bhaal's--hand grasping an infant).

    And even if Bhaal did go around raping anything and everything he could fertilize, that doesn't mean that both Gromnir and Dorn are his children--I know this is very hard for some people to comprehend, but it's entirely possible for a women to bear children of DIFFERENT men--crazy, right? The reason Imoen was a Bhaalspawn was because she was CHARNAME's twin. If they weren't twins, they could easily have been half-siblings.

    And, of course, it's very possible that "Il-Khan" is either A) a common orcish surname, like Smith or Miller, or B) Il-Khan isn't a name at all, but an honorific.

    ...

    So, basically, what I'm saying is that there are more possible ways to explain Dorn NOT being a Bhaalspawn that to explain him AS a Bhaalspawn. So, basically, his lineage can be twisted to one thing or another, whatever is necessary in service to the narrative.
  • NukeninNukenin Member Posts: 327
    "il-Khan" historically could mean "subordinate Khan", but that's from our realms, not those Forgotten ones. :D
  • MERLANCEMERLANCE Member Posts: 421
    Bhaal wasn't going around planting his seed during the time of troubles, he was going around doing it BEFORE. CHARNAME was 20 at the start of the game which was what, 1368 DR? Time of Troubles was 1358. And he wasn't raping everyone, some were willing knowing what he was doing. I certainly down he was going around as The Slayer doing that, he was an evil god, he had other godly powers. With Deity level charisma, he could probably charm the pants off any half orc, fire giant, human, elf, or... other.
  • EnterHaerDalisEnterHaerDalis Member Posts: 813
    edited December 2012
    Don't think so.


    but I love Gromnir :)

    http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/comment/201145/
  • DarkDoggDarkDogg Member Posts: 598
    Can't wait introducing this "guy" to Dorn in BG2EE:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBM-UNjEP-Q
    They could be the best friends :-)
  • doomdoomdoomdoomdoomdoom Member Posts: 89
    I only give Lilarcor to Minsc. Seems a great fit, two crazy clowns.

    I heard Dorn can't wait to get that vorpal blade.
  • ZanathKariashiZanathKariashi Member Posts: 2,869
    He's probably a half-brother or cousin.

    When it comes to immaculate conception, the blood-line is the same as the mortal parent, and merely has divine power of some magnitude from the divine parent. So while bhaalspawn on bhaalspawn would technically be incest, it wouldn't physically be incest, unless both were from the same mortal parent.

    Or if you want to get down to brass tacks, it's just a form of divine masturbation since Bhaal is just screwing around with himself.
  • DrugarDrugar Member Posts: 1,566
    If sharing a last name with a Bhaalspawn means Dorn is a Bhaalspawn, then either Bhaal's last name was Il-Khan or the entire Il-Khan family are all Bhaalspawn.

    They're possibly related but him being a Bhaalspawn because they share a name makes no sense at all.
  • lDanielHolmlDanielHolm Member Posts: 225
    Arsene_Lupin said:

    My understanding is NOT that Bhaal went around raping any female of any species he could find. Remember, he was put in a human body. It would have been difficult--on a practical level--to go around mating with a bunch of humans, elves, orcs, dragons and whatnot in the time he had, with the, er, anatomy he was dealt.

    You misunderstand the timeline involved. Bhaal had been spreading his essence for decades, perhaps even centuries, before the Time of Troubles. (Abazigal is a dragon, with a son. Dragons mature in around five decades, becoming young adults.)
    Arsene_Lupin said:

    As I understand it, Bhaal simply implanted his "divine essence" into unborn and newborn children. (This is backed up possibly, I think, by an image from one of the BG2 movies showing a clawed--Bhaal's--hand grasping an infant).

    While this idea is not strictly speaking impossible, it would contradict literally every instance of Bhaal specifically being called "your father" that exists in both games. I rather think it unlikely.
    Arsene_Lupin said:

    And even if Bhaal did go around raping anything and everything he could fertilize, that doesn't mean that both Gromnir and Dorn are his children--I know this is very hard for some people to comprehend, but it's entirely possible for a women to bear children of DIFFERENT men--crazy, right? The reason Imoen was a Bhaalspawn was because she was CHARNAME's twin. If they weren't twins, they could easily have been half-siblings.

    Imoen is CHARNAME's half-sister, not their twin. She is younger than CHARNAME.
    Arsene_Lupin said:

    And, of course, it's very possible that "Il-Khan" is either A) a common orcish surname, like Smith or Miller, or B) Il-Khan isn't a name at all, but an honorific.

    Close, but not quite.

    It's actually rather simple: Il-Khan is a clan, not strictly speaking a family. Dorn and Gromnir are not (necessarily) siblings, they just belonged to the same clan.
    Arsene_Lupin said:

    ...

    So, basically, what I'm saying is that there are more possible ways to explain Dorn NOT being a Bhaalspawn that to explain him AS a Bhaalspawn. So, basically, his lineage can be twisted to one thing or another, whatever is necessary in service to the narrative.

    There is no more reason to suppose that Dorn is a Bhaalspawn than there is to assume that, say, Neera is a Bhaalspawn.
Sign In or Register to comment.

2025 Overhaul Games, a division of Beamdog. © 2025 Hasbro, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Baldur's Gate, Dungeons & Dragons, D&D, Forgotten Realms, Baldur's Gate, Wizards of the Coast and their logos are trademarks of Wizards of the Coast LLC in the U.S.A. and other countries, and are used with permission. Hasbro and its logo are trademarks of Hasbro, Inc. and are used with permission. © 1998 BioWare Corp. All Rights Reserved. BioWare, the BioWare Infinity Engine and the BioWare logo are trademarks of Bioware Corp. Black Isle Studios and the Black Isle Studios logo are trademarks of Interplay Entertainment Corp. Atari and the Atari logo are trademarks owned by Atari Interactive, Inc. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners.