On Core or Higher Difficulty do you cheat when leveling up or writing magic?

franco

There are many ways available for players to circumvent the basic rules in BG. An option for cheating on the rules always comes up when we are in Core difficulty or higher and the PC or an NPC levels up or writes magic from a scroll. As a player, how do you usually handle it. Please vote and tell us about it. Also, please let me know whether you like the idea or find it interesting to know statistically the way various players approach this option.

Lindeblom

I usually roll until I get above 50%. 6 and up for warrior, 3-4 for wizard and so on.

franco

Moderators @Dee , @Jalily or other. This thread showed up in New Members Welcome area. That wasn't my intention. Sorry. Can it be moved to General Discussion (Spoiler Warning) ? Please let me know if I can do this on my own also.

Dee

You certainly can!

Just edit the original post; you'll be able to change the thread's location on the edit screen.

franco

@Lindeblom. I did that exact same thing for years and I was happy with it. In recent months I just got into accepting the roll in order to help randomize the game.



I think it would be interesting to find out what statistical tendencies many of the players on this forum have when facing this option of leveling up or writing magic.

franco

Thanks @Dee.

Qbert

I started out saving before i did either but on my second run through i played it legit and ended up enjoying it a lot more. I drink a potion of genius before i write and am saving the red potion for the high level spells all at one time.

JLee

I accept the results unless I fail to write a spell a disproportionate number of times. I get irritated with an int of 19 and fail three times in a row.

The other time I will save/reload is if it's a spell I really need and will find difficult to find again.

I generally do not lower the difficulty because I seem to be physically unable to remember to raise it again once I am done.

Pecca

I mod 2da tables.

franco

@Pecca. I admit I'm not familiar with the terminology. Would you explain it for us?

Pecca

Ah. I see I wrote it wrong anyway. There are game files with the extension .2da. These files are tables (pnp like) and are easily modified with programs like NearInfinity or DLTCEP. Several of these tables are for hit point rolls and one for scroll scribing success. I usually mod many more tables to adjust the game to my desires. In this case I mod hitpoint tables to roll higher numbers (like 5-10, instead 1-10) and scroll scribing for automatic success.

FinneousPJ

Playing on Core/Insane without random rolls isn't really playing on Core/Insane.

SionIV

I use BG2 tweaks and click the option for 100% write. I only play No-reload nowadays and i can't afford to lose out on scrolls that are hard to get.

Bercon

For those who don't feel like "cheating" but don't want to get really crappy hit points either, you could try these tables, just copy to your override folder. They give you average hit points on level up which I don't think is really cheating. Fighter gets 5.5 hit points per level up, mage 2.5 etc. http://ylilammi.com/mods/AverageHitpointsOnLevelUp.7z

More details on the math here: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/13927/average-hitpoints-on-level-up

triclops41

I don't worry about the hit points, but I save and reload for the spells. There are a number of spells I just like too much.

[Deleted User]

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ZanathKariashi

And this is why I say higher then 13 int is a waste.

I just roll with it. Makes the game more interesting that way. And forces you to come up with new strategies if you don't get access to spells you're normally using every run.

bbear

While I do lower the difficulty to write spells, I dont consider it "cheating". It's a poor game design because I could have bypass it by drinking 2 potions of genius, which I'm too lazy to do it.

Schneidend

I lower the difficulty for the first few levels, like 1-3, to get max HP and give my characters a buffer. Completely random HP is one of the most annoying things in all of D&D. That's part of why I like 4E and the Neverwinter Nights games.

Thunder

I'd gladly get rid of the spell writing failure chance, the limit on spells written based on int is enough of a limitation for me.

franco

Lindeblom said:

I usually roll until I get above 50%. 6 and up for warrior, 3-4 for wizard and so on.

That's exactly the method I used for years. These are adventurers developing like athletes. As they reach a level, their HP's should be increasing by at least half as much as the max attributed to their class.

Very recently, however, I developed a rule whereby if the game had to be Reloaded due to a PC's death since the last level up, then he is in a weakened condition. In that case, keep the game on the original Core/Higher difficulty setting when he levels up, and there is a random probability he will end up getting fewer HP's. If there was no reload for the PC since the last level up, then save the game and make sure he gets at least half the max HP's.

I like this rule, because it feels right and seems realistic. As a penalty, it can also be applied when NPCs have been resurrected since their last level, so they face the possibility of fewer random HP's on the next level up.

Mortianna

I only lower it only when I have a rare spell that I likely won't be able to find again and if I'm out of INT boosting potions. I once failed a spell six times in a row with a 19 INT (95 percent chance). Given, it wasn't in my specialty school, but that's only a 15 percent penalty. Failing six times in a row with a 80 percent chance to learn is a .0064 percent probability. ~.~

The only time I reroll HP is when Kagain gets a 2 (I don't think he can roll a 1 due to his 20 CON). It just doesn't feel right for Kagain to have less HP than other fighters of the same level in the party.

*Edit: I just leveled Kagain in my current game and he just got a 1 (6 with CON bonus), so I guess it doesn't follow the PnP rule of no 1s rolled with 19 and 20 CON.

Awong124

I play on Core, but I think the spell writing failure thing is stupid, so I will reload until I successfully write it. As for leveling up, I always want the average roll, no more no less. So I will reload even if I get a higher than average roll.

Freche

I always play with mods and most of the time install max HP and 100% write magic.

Mathmick

I would use the save-scumming method, but lowering difficulty produces the same results in what will likely be a lower time.

O_Bruce

Cheating is either for boring or unskilled gamers. That's my opinion on the matter.

DreadKhan

Schneidend said:

I lower the difficulty for the first few levels, like 1-3, to get max HP and give my characters a buffer. Completely random HP is one of the most annoying things in all of D&D. That's part of why I like 4E and the Neverwinter Nights games.

I agree... While an average roll is fine, a pair of atrocious rolls for a fighter can be disastrously unplayable. Great rolls aren't required, but roll a 1 and 2 for your fighter an things will be ugly. Especially for an NPc that has no cons bonus!

Flashheart

I tried to play it as it came...but found it to be really annoying failing to write spells with high INT, and failing to get good HP with high CON.

Because of that (and as part of my ongoing battle to bring more power to the stats) I altered two tables:

INTMOD.2da
I changed this so that a low intelligence (9) only has a 15% chance to write a spell...whereas 18 INT is guaranteed to succeed.

9 = 15%
10 = 25%
11 = 35%
12 = 45%
13 = 55% (same as default)
14 = 65%
15 = 75%
16 = 85%
17 = 95%
18 = 105%

HPCONBON.2da
I changed this to help characters with high CON gain more HP when levelling up. Anything up to CON 12 has a minimum roll of 1. A 13 CON gets a minimum roll of 2.

12 or under = 1 minimum
13 = 2 minimum
14 = 2 minimum
15 = 3 minimum
16 = 3 minimum
17 or above = 4 minimum

This means a mage with 17 CON will always get a roll of 4 (plus the CON bonus of 2). A Fighter gets between 4-10 (with a CON bonus of 3).

I find this helps prevent *frustration*. If I have a fighter with 13 CON, then I can't really complain about him being a bit soft. Likewise a Mage with 13 INT, I can't complain about his spell writing failures. The option is there for me to guarantee success; it's my choice if I choose to make it more awkward for myself.

I've attached them both in the zip file. If anyone would like to use them, simply copy them into your override directory.

Mortianna

Awong124 said:

I play on Core, but I think the spell writing failure thing is stupid, so I will reload until I successfully write it. [...]

1e AD&D is/was especially draconian about learning spells. If you failed to learn a spell, that was it. You could never use that spell, unless your INT score changed (which would allow for another attempt) or if you fell below the minimum number of spells learnable for that spell level.

I can't imagine the nerd rage some players must have had when failing their roll with Fireball. We have it easy with BG. ^_^

mylegbig

Yea, I cheat, but I also modded my game so that all the monsters/enemies have their maximum possible hit points.

I thought dragons were tough before, but fighting them with SCS AI, triple life, and maximum hp rolls was something else. When I fought the Shadow Dragon damn thing just wouldn't die.

Schneidend

Spell failure chance. Siiiiigh.

Let's see, player-character mage, capable of feats and progression far beyond the typical mage in the world, a master of the arcane arts in the making, a hero or villain of extraordinary potential. Yeah, that totally sounds like you should have a chance to fail to learn how to do the thing at which you excel. Maybe Fighters should have a random chance to not gain extra proficiency pips or their extra attacks.

ZelgadisGW said:

Cheating is either for boring or unskilled gamers. That's my opinion on the matter.

Implying that lowering the difficulty in-game is cheating.