Indeed, many of the old modules were as much about knowing what not to do as what to do. The BG games, at times, aren't all that different, with the exception that you can eventually metagame. It's still nice to see a hint of the same design philosophy though.
I have a general rule about resting no more than once for every 24 hours ingame unless there are severe mitigating circumstances. And in places/times where it seems unlikely that the party could manage to stay safe for 8 hours (beholder lairs and illithid cities are good examples) I don't do it at all.
I kinda do that too. I usually try to do one level all in one go, which is obviously not always possible depending on how large/difficult the level is. If I am forced to rest in hostile environments, I usually try to find a room and close all the doors if possible. I don't know if it prevents attacks, but I did avoid getting attacked during rest for a remarkably long time, until recently when I got a bit lazy with the closing doors. So maybe it was just coincidence, maybe my intuitive habit actually works.
I know what u mean. The gamer and roleplayer side of me are often in conflict, and it's a tricky balance to maintain. I mean if you are totally faithful to roleplay, Charname would probably go into hiding in the wilderness after surviving Tarnesh, and beg Jaheira and Khalid to stay with him and protect him. He certainly would not pro-actively do all sorts of crazily dangerous things like venture into Durlag's Tower for some very vague promises of helping out a Dwarf and possibly finding treasure. In order to sensibly justify his decisions, he must almost have a messiah-complex and some sort of blind faith that he will overcome whatever challenges he encounters and save the world, or be extremely greedy for power and wealth that he is willing to face almost certain death in the search for treasure and powerful magical artefacts.
Of course the gamer side of me wants to experience as much of the game as possible, and the way BG and BG 2 is designed (like most RPG games), exploring everywhere and trying everything is usually much more rewarding than rushing on ahead, even though BG 2 in particular does seem to have a much greater sense of urgency.
On this occasion however, Jin (I) was just too curious about what the 'reward' mentioned would be. He wouldn't do something obviously dangerous otherwise. There's been plenty of cases where doing something potentially dangerous has turned out quite rewarding afterall.
I actually wish there were more situations where you are rewarded (or at least not punished) for doing the sensible thing, instead of wondering, 'did I miss out on a nice item there' afterwards.
I've never fought Demogorgon's five demon knights, because the last time I played through there, I thought it was, I dunno, a really bad idea to make a sacrifice to a demon in the Underdark? I went past that area and got the heck out of there. I think a lot of people forget that some encounters are intentionally designed to be avoided. I don't fight the demon in Watcher's Keep, either; I banish him without ever even seeing him. Honestly, why would a sane person fight an immortal demon lord when it can be avoided?
I used to read the old TSR modules to learn how dungeon masters did stuff and to see what life was like on the other side of the cardboard screen. Very frequently, they would say stuff like "If your players are foolish enough to not see all the above hints and to press this red button, then here is what will happen:"....
And it would go on to detail what was clearly written as an unwinnable encounter, such as ..."an ancient red dragon with 20 hit dice will immediately appear and initiate combat with its breath weapon, doing 20d6 fire damage..." And this sort of thing would be in modules written for characters of levels 4-6 or thereabouts.
Anyway, of course, in a computer game, players are going to figure out how to beat the "unbeatable" encounter, usually through cheese and exploit, just because it's there.
I don't mean any of the above to say that the game doesn't throw in a lot of encounters that you can't avoid, and that you really can't win without getting killed a few times and building up some foreknowledge of what is about to happen. Those are in there, and I agree that it's very discouraging to feel like you were cautious and were roleplaying the game well, and then you get punished for it.
The encounter with Sarevok shown in the OP is an example. I think anybody who beats Sarevok the first time they ever try it is very, very lucky.
6level vs dragon?if knowing of dragon it is possible but ambushed would probably be death in first few rounds(in bg) no cheese
from my really limited DnD knowledge demogorgon in PnP is so impossible that party of 20łvl pnp characters are not enough
and why would you push the red button? because you can
I rest whenever I feel like it. If that means I'm resting in an otherwise unlikely situation or place, like the middle of a beholder dungeon/base, I'm ok with that
As for Bards I find them to be good secondary characters. A secondary mage for spells like Greater Malison, Glitterdust, etc. A primary/secondary archer. In some instances a secondary thief (depending on your alignment your familiar can technically disarm traps/open locks in BGEE). My first playthrough of BGEE was with a Jester, and while I didn't get the kill counts of my companions I was able to use a lot of utility spells and items that make it worth it. Also I like not needing to memorize identify.
I rest whenever I feel like it. If that means I'm resting in an otherwise unlikely situation or place, like the middle of a beholder dungeon/base, I'm ok with that
PnP Demogorgon isn't impossible, in some ways he's actually weaker then the WK version. (Less HP (180 less), less AC (4 less), less to-hit requirements (only needs +2), can't summon demons at will (well..he can, but not as fast as the WK version, just 1 per turn), 2 attacks per round from his tentacles (his heads can bite as well for a total of 4 attacks, but lack most of his on-hit effects that the tentacles have)
The biggest differences is that his touch from his tentacles will rot off whatever extremity it touches within 6 rounds, unless Restoration is cast resulting in death if it's a main body or head shot. Drains 4 levels on hit (there is no passive immunity to level drain in PnP, and the spell only blocks a single hit), and everyone within a 60yd cone of his left head must save vs spells at -6 or be permanently (Can be dispelled though) dominated (characters with 18 or less HD don't get a save) per round, and those in the cone of his right head must do the same or be driven permanently insane (again, can be dispelled, if they survive the battle).
Comments
@belgarathmth
I know what u mean. The gamer and roleplayer side of me are often in conflict, and it's a tricky balance to maintain. I mean if you are totally faithful to roleplay, Charname would probably go into hiding in the wilderness after surviving Tarnesh, and beg Jaheira and Khalid to stay with him and protect him. He certainly would not pro-actively do all sorts of crazily dangerous things like venture into Durlag's Tower for some very vague promises of helping out a Dwarf and possibly finding treasure. In order to sensibly justify his decisions, he must almost have a messiah-complex and some sort of blind faith that he will overcome whatever challenges he encounters and save the world, or be extremely greedy for power and wealth that he is willing to face almost certain death in the search for treasure and powerful magical artefacts.
Of course the gamer side of me wants to experience as much of the game as possible, and the way BG and BG 2 is designed (like most RPG games), exploring everywhere and trying everything is usually much more rewarding than rushing on ahead, even though BG 2 in particular does seem to have a much greater sense of urgency.
On this occasion however, Jin (I) was just too curious about what the 'reward' mentioned would be. He wouldn't do something obviously dangerous otherwise. There's been plenty of cases where doing something potentially dangerous has turned out quite rewarding afterall.
I actually wish there were more situations where you are rewarded (or at least not punished) for doing the sensible thing, instead of wondering, 'did I miss out on a nice item there' afterwards.
from my really limited DnD knowledge demogorgon in PnP is so impossible that party of 20łvl pnp characters are not enough
and why would you push the red button? because you can
As for Bards I find them to be good secondary characters. A secondary mage for spells like Greater Malison, Glitterdust, etc. A primary/secondary archer. In some instances a secondary thief (depending on your alignment your familiar can technically disarm traps/open locks in BGEE). My first playthrough of BGEE was with a Jester, and while I didn't get the kill counts of my companions I was able to use a lot of utility spells and items that make it worth it. Also I like not needing to memorize identify.
The biggest differences is that his touch from his tentacles will rot off whatever extremity it touches within 6 rounds, unless Restoration is cast resulting in death if it's a main body or head shot. Drains 4 levels on hit (there is no passive immunity to level drain in PnP, and the spell only blocks a single hit), and everyone within a 60yd cone of his left head must save vs spells at -6 or be permanently (Can be dispelled though) dominated (characters with 18 or less HD don't get a save) per round, and those in the cone of his right head must do the same or be driven permanently insane (again, can be dispelled, if they survive the battle).