Mod/Feature Request - Dexterity to hit and damage
kamuizin
Member Posts: 3,704
It's pretty much simple the request, but i don't know if the mod/feature itself will be.
Can Dexterity ingame be changes so Hit and Damage would be increased based on dexterity instead of strengh? Can this be limited to some classes? Can at least the to hit chance be defined by dexterity when this stats is greater than strengh?
Can Dexterity ingame be changes so Hit and Damage would be increased based on dexterity instead of strengh? Can this be limited to some classes? Can at least the to hit chance be defined by dexterity when this stats is greater than strengh?
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str is already the most valuable stat in the game, even though it is easily replaced by spells/items, due to adding a ridiculous amount of damage to hits and adding to carry wieght, and giving anyone the ability to bash some locks (in addition to adding hit). All of which apply to everyone, warriors can just get a little extra at creation, but once you can boost to 19+, it's equally effective to all.
Most classes, only get a minor AC bonus from putting points in dex (thieves get the most benefit, while bards/rangers/monks get a minor benefit extra benefit). And the stat itself is also missing both it's bonus to saves (same spells that would have a reflex save in 3rd edition) and reduction of dual-wielding penalty. (an 18 dex character with * two-weapon style should have a 0/-2 penalty.)
16 +0 hit / +1 Missile hit
17 +1 hit / +2 Missile hit
18 +2 hit / +3 Missile hit
19 +3 hit / +4 Missile hit
21 +4 hit / +5 Missile hit
23 +5 hit / +6 Missile hit
24 +6 hit / +7 Missile hit
25 +7 hit / +8 Missile hit
(Just so no one misunderstands the chart...Missile gets a +1 bonus over melee hit at every stage, and gets it's first bonus 1 stat sooner).
Being Dexterous would allow you to hit more often, but you're not going to do more damage. A high str/low dex fighter is generally characterized as someone who swings wildly and inaccurately, but if that hit manages to land, you're F'd. While a high dex/low str fighter bleeds you to death with precise, but average strikes.
While I am usually a stickler for staying as close to PnP rules possible, this is one change even I would get behind, because it makes good sense and would help give dex a little more value to non-thieves, due to the 2 powerful benefits it's currently missing that it should have. (I personally find spending points on just small AC a waste unless I've got points to burn due to all my other important stats being covered).
Why not govern damage bonuses with Str and THAC0 with Dex? That would seem sensible and balanced for all classes except perhaps casters, for whom Dex probably just reflects their ability to dodge incoming attacks.
I typically only care about high STR for my front-liners, while I like having high DEX on everyone in my party. The front-liners benefit from the extra AC, and it lets the people in the back have a better chance of actually hitting something (and the extra AC doesn't hurt for them either, seeing as how they'll usually have low HP). At least in BG1 anyways. I always hear people talking about how AC doesn't matter anymore once you get to late game BG2 (I don't remember whether or not I found this to be the case for myself), so I guess DEX might be less useful then.
By the way, for a late game SoA and ToB, a dexterity based to hit, and to some classes to hit and damage, would make a nice overpower control in the game, as strengh is too much easy raised in the game (belts of giant, gloves, various potions, many priest spells... and there goes on).
This became quite clear to me after I stopped caring what my stat rolls were and just hit accept after rolling once. The experience doesn't change, except you REALLY start missing those high str values when you're constantly running out of weight with only 3 characters in BG1 have enough to be pack mules.
Just because you find something less useful doesn't change the fact that str gives more benefits that affect every class, then any other stat in the game. And all of them being immediately tangible and useful. And don't lie...unless you're doing the same thing as me, your character is ALWAYS going to have the highest str in the game...why? Because it's the best stat (adds a huge amount of damage to thrown weapons that can benefit, allows you to carry tons of weight that allows you to sell everything you come across and buy stuff sooner, allows you to use heavier armor/weapons, and allows you to get into doors/chests when you lack a thief or they're not good enough to pick the lock yet).
Dex just gives AC...which is only useful prior to getting armor/items that can raise it higher. The moment you hit 0, dex becomes worth less and less for each point beyond, and simply stopping damage or having enough hp to soak it up becomes much more important, very few enemies in the game have significant amounts of thac0, and you're much more likely to be hit by crits then normal attacks barring enemies who will hit you most of the time anyway.
Keep in mind, that even among career soldiers and mercenaries it's EXTREMELY rare to encounter troops above 5th level. Adventuring is dangerous work, and non-adventuring professions have very limited options for advancement, with only bards (practicing their thief skills/researching new spells), mages (researching new spells), or thieves (practicing their theif skills in daily life) able to advance while in a non-adventuring profession. Warriors need frequent new martial challenges and clerics/druids need progressively more important duties for their god, that simply aren't found tending a chapel or practicing in a training yard.
mage/clerics/druids can earn some xp by crafting items, but they're expensive and take a long time to craft relative to the xp value they gain from it, making it less efficient then a mage just researching new spells, and unless you have a ready market for and can afford your wares, you'll eventually have to leave to earn more money).
That is actually up held in BG...very few enemies break level 10. Hell the vast majority of monsters are 8 or less with 4 or less being extremely common.
Now, I'll admit that Gygax really gave fighters a big bonus with "percentile strength" - the damage bonuses get insanely stupid (+6?) and require every fighter to have 18/XX strength to be worth his/her blade. But what does high strength give a non-fighter? Not much. Carrying capacity doesn't go bonkers before percentile strength, and the combat bonuses don't begin until 16 and are only +1/+2 at 18 strength (i.e., compared to a +3 to hit bonus for ranged attacks/-4 AC from an 18 dexterity). So, I wouldn't put too much emphasis on strength for non-fighters (not that I'd use it as a dump stat, but a mage can get by fine with 9-10).
As far as items go, there's plenty of girdles of XYZ giant strength to raise STR into the stratosphere, and those work for non-fighters who can't get 18/XX strength.
And if you need some carrying capacity, try the pack mule mod. Every adventurer needs a beast of burden!
You entire post did nothing but illustrated exactly why all to-hit bonuses should be moved to dex.
In short, I agree with this for some weapons, but not all.
The minimum strengh of each weapon define if the character has the capacity to use that weapon and thus fill the control weapon weight that you mentioned at first.
For small and medium weapons, the 3.5Ed made the weapon finesse feat that does exactly this, use dexterity to define the hit chance, i would be satisfied if all medium sized weapons and lower got the weapon finesse, at least for some classes and with special exceptions for kensais and katanas for example.