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Use Any NPC Item - Add-on for Use Any Item HLA.

Troodon80Troodon80 Member, Developer Posts: 4,110
edited November 2013 in BGII:EE Mods
Attached is a zip file containing the following modified items:

Flasher Launcher
Jansen AdventureWear
Bow of Arvoreen +2
Corthala Family Armor
Cloak of the High Forest +1
Jansen Spectroscopes
Jansen Techno-Gloves
Firecam Full-Plate Armor
de'Arnise Signet Ring (also allowed item to be moved/dropped)
Delryn Family Shield
Staff of the High Forest +2
Sword of Arvoreen +2
Yoshimo's Katana +1
Hallowed Redeemer +2
Corthala Family Blade
Entropy +2
Chaos Blade
Moonlight Walkers
Glimmering Bands
Neera's Staff +1

I think that's all of them. If I have missed anything, do let me know.


Use Any NPC Item - Primary component.

I did not bother to make a WeiDU install script, but can do so if people would prefer. Just copy the files to the override folder. As standard, I have not removed the "Usable by [NPC Name]", but an optional blank item_use.2da is also attached if seeing the alignment and class restrictions is preferable.

Blank item_use.2da - optional, displays Usable/Unusable list instead of just the character name the item is intended for.

Please note that other restrictions such as class and alignment still apply to characters without the Use Any Item ability, but can still be used if they meet the requirements. I have left some items, such as Boo, as they currently are.


Likewise for Hexxat's amulet. Hexxat, from a lore point of view, should not be able to use certain items (for what should be an obvious reason). I will, however, make an optional component if it is desirable.

Post edited by Troodon80 on
Kurumisunset00elminsterAbelbob_vengCrevsDaakGloomfrost
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Comments

  • RyofuRyofu Member Posts: 268
    what is the difference between the 2 zip files? do i need to add both to the override folder?
  • Troodon80Troodon80 Member, Developer Posts: 4,110
    edited November 2013
    @Ryofu, the blank item_use.2da (item_use.zip) file is only to show the actual Usable/Unusable list in-game. The main part of the mod is Use Any NPC Item.zip, but it still shows the character name that the item is intended for (even though it allows any character meeting the requirements to use it).

    If you want to have the item display the real Usable/Unusable list, then copy the optional component (item_use.2da) to the override folder. Otherwise, just use the primary component. :)
  • KurumiKurumi Member Posts: 520
    Great work - many thanks @Troodon80 !!!
  • KilmantorKilmantor Member Posts: 34
    edited November 2013
    What is with Edwin's amulett? Probably the most powerfull mage-item in the game.
    Post edited by Kilmantor on
  • KurumiKurumi Member Posts: 520
    edited November 2013
    Kilmantor said:

    What is with Edwin's amulett? Propably the most powerfull mage-item in the game.

    Nah.. like Hexxats Amulet you can't remove it - and you shouldn't be able to, because in this two cases it's just there to emulate a certain class (Red Wiz) or race (V).
    Troodon80Eudaemonium
  • Troodon80Troodon80 Member, Developer Posts: 4,110
    Agreed with Kurumi, however if anyone wants items that cannot be dropped/moved then I can do that as well.
  • SharnSharn Member Posts: 188
    Kurumi said:

    Kilmantor said:

    What is with Edwin's amulett? Propably the most powerfull mage-item in the game.

    Nah.. like Hexxats Amulet you can't remove it - and you shouldn't be able to, because in this two cases it's just there to emulate a certain class (Red Wiz) or race (V).
    I am not going to argue that players should be able to get locked items that do not drop and cant be removed, mostly because I do not support it myself, but I would like to point out the misconception a lot of people on this forum have made about Edwins amulet applying what red wizards are suppose to have.

    Red Wizards have never gotten additional spell slots based on their red wizard status, they get bonus's with their preferred school of magic, but they do not gain additional spell slots.

  • Troodon80Troodon80 Member, Developer Posts: 4,110
    edited December 2013
    @Sharn, it is less to do with Edwin being a Red Wizard and more meant to accentuate Edwin's 'superior' intelligence and spell-casting abilities. It is a misconception that it is him being a Red Wizard, but it has roughly the same meaning. i.e. an item that confers a personal trait rather than having this trait applied directly to the character (engine limitation (affects can be applied per race, per class, etc., but not currently by NPC)).

    :)
  • Troodon80Troodon80 Member, Developer Posts: 4,110
    Huh... I always figured it was more of a personality trait, Edwin being of superior intellect. But, then again, that probably comes from him being a Red Wizard?
  • EudaemoniumEudaemonium Member Posts: 3,199
    Pretty much, I think. Though Edwin lacks the requisite 14 CHA requirement of Red Wizards, so while he may have the intellect of a Thayan overlord he lacks the social graces to actually navigate the politics.

    Incidentally, I believe it's meant to be two additional spells on top of the basic wizard number (so the 3 of BG1 rather than the 4 of BG2), but the wording is a bit ambiguous.
  • CrevsDaakCrevsDaak Member Posts: 7,155
    Lots of the NPC items could be used in the original game with UAI, and not to mention that F/T half-orcs could use Yoshimo's Katana :P and most of the stuff requires a minium, so you cannot wear it. Nice mod through!
  • SharnSharn Member Posts: 188
    edited December 2013
    @Eudaemonium I am still correct, this is not something Red Wizards get for free and isn't something that all Red wizards have, Edwin doesn't give up two additional spell schools, isn't limited in what those extra spell slots can be filled with, and still gains an additional spell slot that isn't allowed in those rules you posted.

    There is a big difference between having 2 extra spell slots that must be filled with very specific spells, and gaining 3 extra spell slots that can be filled with anything in your spell book. So I stand by my statement, having the option to be unable to cast 4 schools of magic, for Edwin it would be Greater Divination, Evocation/Invocation, and two other schools in opposition to his second choice to cast 2 extra spells a day per level from a very specific list is a big deal, something he doesn't give up in the game, and still comes out an extra spell slot per level ahead then he would if he made such a huge sacrafice.

    Anyone who has played a PNP mage to any extent can tell you that giving up any spell school at high levels is a huge disadvantage, the divination spell school alone at high levels make a number of BG2 prologues impossible to actually happen. The only school that a wizard would ever actually be willing to give up in pnp at high levels is illusion magic, and its such a useful school that even though its not necessary its still better to have it.
  • EudaemoniumEudaemonium Member Posts: 3,199
    The whole 'can only use extra slot for their school' is a rule of all PnP specialist mages, and isn't obeyed in BG at all presumably due to the way the engine works or the fact they simply didn't want to implement. So to be honest that point is completely meaningless. Also the banned schools are likely also a facet of the engine. They could not actually give Edwin a dual specialisation, because the game only permits a coding of one kit per character and even if it wasn't I doubt you could effectively multiclass as mage/mage , which is effectively what he should be.

    Edwin's amulet is clearly supposed to emulate aspects of him being a Red Wizard. They simply didn't give him the downsides of it, but this is likely purely due to the game's coding.
    Kurumi
  • SharnSharn Member Posts: 188
    edited December 2013
    I understand its a limitation in the game engine, specialist wizards in BG have almost no downside because they only give up one school instead of two and the very limited spell selection and lack of versatility of spells in addition to the lost requirement in what those spells can be makes the choice trivial. The only thing they don't gain from pnp is a+1 to saves vs spells of their own school and a -1 to opponents saves when they cast their school.

    The point is people keep saying it emulates what he "should have" in pnp and it clearly does not, he gets a greater bonus then what he would get in pnp with none of the sacrifices to get those bonus's. You could say it was a poor attempt to emulate red wizards that fails in almost every way, but that's not the same thing as claiming its what he "should have" which many people do.

    If the amulet gave 1 spell per spell levels I would consider it an acceptable emulation of pnp, its a lost magic item slot to give the advantages without the disadvantages, albeit it's the weakest magic item slot in the game, there is still a very good choice available for it none the less.
    Post edited by Sharn on
  • EudaemoniumEudaemonium Member Posts: 3,199
    My point was that the extra spells conferred by his amulet are to emulate aspects of his Red Wizard-ness, which they clearly are, because Red Wizards are given an extra spell slot on top of specialisation. You stated above, that:

    "Red Wizards have never gotten additional spell slots based on their red wizard status, they get bonus's with their preferred school of magic, but they do not gain additional spell slots."

    And I was proving this statement incorrect. Just that. Because they have received that bonus at least since Wizards and Rogues was published (c.1995). Edwin is a Red Wizard, and his extra spell in BG1 is a feature of his Red Wizard-ness. Honestly, you just seem to be arguing in circles, because I have proven the above statement empirically false and you seem to simply not want to admit you were wrong.

    He should, however, not get the 4 spells per spell level he gets in BG2, but the 3 he gets in BG1. The third bonus spell is a feature of the zulkirs of Thay, and Edwin is about as far from a zulkir as one can be at the time of BG2. (You could probably make some spurious argument involving Edwin's single specialisation as opposed to double specialisation and how this relates to the single specialisation of zulkirs and Edwin's epic levels, but I suspect Bioware just did it to make him more powerful.)
    CrevsDaakKurumiSpaceInvader
  • CrevsDaakCrevsDaak Member Posts: 7,155

    I have proven the above statement empirically false and you seem to simply not want to admit you were wrong.

    Still laughing. You really talk like Edwin(a) (wo)man!
    Gloomfrost
  • SharnSharn Member Posts: 188
    edited December 2013
    Red Wizards do not gain additional spell slots based on their status as red wizards, its as true now as it was when I originally posted it.

    Gaining a single additional spell slot is not a free perk of being a red wizard, they have to give up two additional schools of magic to gain access to that extra spell slot.
  • RyofuRyofu Member Posts: 268
    "munch munch munch" anyone want some popcorn while watching the fight? :p
  • SpaceInvaderSpaceInvader Member Posts: 2,125
    Which fight? @Eudaemonium already won.
  • RyofuRyofu Member Posts: 268
    but but Sharn got the last word in!! lol :p
  • SharnSharn Member Posts: 188
    Red Wizards in pnp have the option to dual specialize if they meet the prerequisites for two different specializations and those specializations do not share opposing schools. They do not get an extra spell slot because they are red wizards, how is this so difficult to understand?
  • Troodon80Troodon80 Member, Developer Posts: 4,110
    If one of the books states that a Red Wizard can get an extra spell slot or two, then that's what I'll go with. I'll chalk the lack of disadvantages up to being engine limitations. So far as the engine limitations go, a specialist mage must give up their opposing school, so that is about as close to emulating it as it is going to get. I should note, however, that the book referenced above is 1e, not 2e, and should also note that 2e itself was modified about ten years after it was released into the wild.

    If we follow the rules from that 1e book, one can safely assume the bonuses should be halved; one extra spell slot instead of two, given that he can only have one mage speciality. Edwins' amulet only gave him one extra spell slot in BG, but I can only assume that the plan was to show Edwin advancing in power in BG2.

    Having said that, it's widely known that Baldur's Gate follows only the basic core rules.
  • SharnSharn Member Posts: 188
    edited December 2013
    @ Troodon80
    I wasn't trying to get a change and apologize if that's the way it was interpreted.

    I was merely stating that getting extra spell slots is not a free bonus that Red Wizards get in pnp because I have seen it brought up so often on the forums.
  • sirwhsirwh Member Posts: 20
    @Troodon80 Thank you for you mod. It's useful. But I'm not sure if you missed the item ''Harper Pin". Now my CHARNAME with UAI can wear it, but cannot get any buff from it (Jaheira can get buff from it without problem). Could you check?
  • sirwhsirwh Member Posts: 20
    BTW, my UAI character still need to meet the attribute requirements to wear the modified items (e.g. he cannot wear Cernd's cloak due to low WIS). I am not sure if it is by intention or not.
  • Troodon80Troodon80 Member, Developer Posts: 4,110
    @sirwh, I didn't touch the Harper Pin. The requirements are still necessary, yes. This basically brings back the old behaviour of Use Any Item; allowing a thief (or someone else who meets the requirements) the ability to equip items that are intended to be used by only one character.

    Some items have been left as they are.
  • sirwhsirwh Member Posts: 20
    @Troodon80 Could you also modify the Harper Pin? It is strange that my character can equip it but does not get any bonus from it. Because it has non-detection, I do think it is more suitable for a thief than for Jaheira.
  • Troodon80Troodon80 Member, Developer Posts: 4,110
    @sirwh, I'll take a look. :)
  • GloomfrostGloomfrost Member Posts: 261
    edited January 2014
    Troodon80 said:

    This basically brings back the old behaviour of Use Any Item; allowing a thief (or someone else who meets the requirements) the ability to equip items that are intended to be used by only one character.

    I appreciate you restoring this High Level Ability to it's original designed state.

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