Assassin/mage vrs Swashbuckler/mage
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This is my first time playing Baldur's gate and I can't decide on which build I'm going to use, either Assassin/mage or Swashbuckler/mage, and was hoping I could get some feed back on the pros and cons of both. I was also curious about being an Archer/mage, but apparently that isn't possible.
I was planning on using bows for the most part and casting mostly debuff/disabling spells and summons.
This character is going to be played through both BGI and II.
I was planning on using bows for the most part and casting mostly debuff/disabling spells and summons.
This character is going to be played through both BGI and II.
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If you really want to be an Assassin->Mage or Swashbuckler->Mage though, read on. Bear in mind that you need a minimum of 15 Dex and 17 Int to dual from a thief kit to mage, and must be human.
Swashbuckler->Mage is a pretty strong combination. The ideal points to dual-class are either level 5 or 10, as the Swashbuckler gets THAC0 and AC bonuses at these levels. If you dual at level 5 you'll be a fairly weak thief but can get your thief skills back quickly. Dualling at 10 means you play all the way through BG1 as a Swashbuckler and dual at the beginning of BG2. If you dual at 5 you'll just about be able to get maxed find traps and open locks if you get the additional dexterity Tome, while dualling at 10 should let you get a decent pickpocket, detect illusions or set traps score as well.
The playstyle of Swash->Mage is pretty much a mage with a little more combat utility and thieving skills. Putting points into shortbows and daggers might be a good combination if you plan on going ranged as you say. There are many decent daggers in BG1, and throwing daggers in BG2 can be quite good. I wouldn't try dual-wielding as you don't get enough proficiency points and THAC0 to really make it shine as a dual class.
Assassin->Mage is hamstrung a bit by lack of thieving points. While poison weapon is a pretty good ability you can only really dual at the end of BG1 if you want to reliably pick locks and find traps. It's doable, but you get a lot less thieving utility than the Swashbuckler, and your combat skills are not much better. Your backstab multiplier as an Assassin will only be the same as an unkitted thief at level 10 or below, which also means this kit advantage doesn't show through.
*Edit* You can play as a Swashbuckler/Mage or Assassin/Mage multiclass, but this requires use of a Savegame editor and can screw things up a bit. Some people consider it a bit cheat-y as well.
I may have screwed up my prof. Points though. I put one into single handed instead of daggers as I planned on sticking with bows till I switch and then put a point into daggers when I become a mage. Is that dumb?
Swash/mage sounds much better on paper but poison weapon sounded fun and the assassin appealed more to me for role playing reasons... I'm only a couple hours in though and may reroll. I'm gonna give it some more thought.
I agree with your choice; I think the A/M is far better than the S/M. Assassin brings new things to the table (mislead backstabs, poisoned meteors, that sort of thing) while the swashbucker's AC is mostly useless for a mage.
Edit: A note or two on thief skills:
Might be worth ignoring Hide in Shadows & Move Silently, as Invisibility is only a level 2 spell, and is generally more reliable anyway... Plus you'll get a wealth of even better ways to disappear as you level up in Mage.
I might say the same thing about Detect Illusions as there are spells with similar utility (including the incomparable True Sight at level 6).
Set Snare really only gets good at higher levels (which you won't reach as a dual-class).
Open locks *can* be covered by Knock spell (level 1), but it conflicts with some other useful stuff, so I'd generally look to max it.
Find/Remove Traps is probably the most important to max... Especially as you can do this whilst under an invisibility spell.
Dual classing can be a pain but if you do it early it's not bad. You do need your party to pick up the slack for a while. I dual classed my assassin at level 5 (100 detect illusions) and a significant chunk of BG1 was spent as a single-classed mage. He was still pretty useful because of his spells though weaker than the others. Alternatively you could just play through BG1 as an assassin and dual class ASAP in BG2, which I think might be easier.
I agree with @abacus that Find Traps is your first priority, but since you're taking another thief for traps I I'd go with Detect Illusions as planned. It's not a spell so it gets past some things that foils spells and saves you a couple spell slots.
On the plus side, you'll be a better thief with more skill points to spread around, and thieves get some cool tricks at epic levels.
Balanced against that is the fact it will take you longer to get high level spells as your XP gets divided between two classes.
If I did wait 'till level 8 to duel class, how late into BG1 would I be?
http://playithardcore.com/pihwiki/index.php?title=Baldur's_Gate:_Progression_Charts
Even if you dual at 8 (second poison weapon usage) you won't make it. I'd recommend finishing BG1 as an assassin (level 10) and switch to mage in BG2 beginning. Level 11 is not that hard to reach (one major quest line plus some side quests plus scroll XP should do it). Max your find traps skill! All the rest can be compensated with spells.
If you go assassin be sure to pick Melfs Minute Meteors as a third level mage spell, that combo absolutely rocks.
I've only read the read me I think or a guy said so in these forums.
Rogue Rebalancing is incredible in my opinion, and makes rogues and bards much more playable. I highly recommend it, though many say that the Swashbuckler kit was actually made worse.