Kensai Survival BG1

shylaman

I am planning a BGT run through with one of my favorite classes a Kensai Druid. It was the first character I finished BG2 with many years ago and want to try it again. Problem is that I want to do a BGT run through and have no clue how to survive BG1 with a Kensai. No ranged weapons and no armor . . .

Tips? Advice?

element

the shield amulet is pretty handy I think u can pick it up at the carnival

don't skimp on potions

also if u have a long weapon don't forget you can stand him behind the front line fighters and still hit stuff whilst being out of range of you opponents

Blackraven

You could also consider placing one or more pips in daggers. Those weapons have throwing variants so that you'll have ranged attacks, and Druids can use daggers, so you'll be able to continue to use them after you complete your dualling process. (You could also go with axes, but you won't be allowed to use them from the moment you dual).

If you're running a party you would do well to stay in the back until you've got a decent number of hitpoints.

DreadKhan

You can throw weapons, axes or daggers. Kiting is VERY MUCH advised until you get the amulet. Imo, single weapon style isnt a bad choice, you need early AC, and the crit bonus isnt bad. See below...

Daggers are a druid weapon, right? Dagger of venom is beastly, and in BG2 you can get the early returning dagger, so this imo isnt a bad idea. You can just put 2 pip in dagger and take something else after... that said, in ToB I assume you will rely on Elemental Forms, right? So you dont need to worry about weapons anymore... but I have heard shapeshifted weapons are usually 1 handed, and benefit from single weapon style, but I never verified this personally, so feel free to double check!

DreadKhan

Oh yeah, dont engage hard hitting enemies if possible, since you have a helm. Crits suck!

TheElf

I did this just recently, planning to do the same thing in BG2 actually. Honestly, wasn't nearly as tough as I expected. My advice, get quarterstaff +3 early, hit stuff really hard with it from behind a couple tanks.

Tresset

What I do for my armor challenged characters is get all three belts vs. damage type and switch them out as needed. So if I am going to fight a bunch of archers I put on the girdle of piercing to get a +3 bonus vs. missile and piercing weapons. If I am going to fight some ogres then I switch tho the girdle of bluntness for +4 vs. blunt weapons. Then if I fight swordsmen I use the golden girdle for +3 vs. slashing. The tricky part is knowing what creatures do what kind of damage but that isn't too hard to figure out usually.

elminster

Get the Wand of Sleep (despite what its description says it works on enemies that are level 4 or less, which is everything from black talon elites to ankhegs, giant spiders, huge spiders, gibberlings, xvarts, wolves, dire wolves, black bears, gnolls, gnoll elite, hobgoblin, hobgoblin elite, chill hobgoblin, gnoll veterans, flind, bandits, half-ogre, ogre, ogre berserker, ogrillion, tasloi and kobolds).

Also like others have said with the Shield Amulet active you'll have the same AC as a fighter with +1 plate mail on (not counting how different AC types are treated with plate mail armor of course).

Ygramul

What sucks most as Kensai is that is that you can't wear helmets (and there are no Ioun stones in BG).

i.e. even with the best armor [e.g. mage casts Spirit Armor on you] you will still take twice as much damage (via critical hits).

Monks suffer the same handicap.

shylaman

Thanks for the tips. I'll see how it works out.

I got a pretty decent roll:

14
16
18
10
15
16

I'll use tomes to get a couple required stats up before dualing. I wasn't sure on DEX and CON. I need AC and HP with the Kensai. I figure get full HP dice rolls was better from the beginning. I was originally thinking 17 and 17. What you guys do?

2** QS and 2** two handed start. The idea is kind of a sword saint nature monk. Though not having throwing daggers may be too tough in BG1.

Stormvessel

shylaman said:

Thanks for the tips. I'll see how it works out.

I got a pretty decent roll:

14
16
18
10
15
16

I'll use tomes to get a couple required stats up before dualing. I wasn't sure on DEX and CON. I need AC and HP with the Kensai. I figure get full HP dice rolls was better from the beginning. I was originally thinking 17 and 17. What you guys do?

14 Str doesn't do anything besides carry weight. Since you ask, I would dump Charisma altogether and allocate the stats as follows:

18
18
18
10
18
7

Edit: Also, I never start with less than 18 on a fighter because the jump to 19 is MASSIVE.

elminster

Stormvessel said:

shylaman said:

Thanks for the tips. I'll see how it works out.

I got a pretty decent roll:

14
16
18
10
15
16

I'll use tomes to get a couple required stats up before dualing. I wasn't sure on DEX and CON. I need AC and HP with the Kensai. I figure get full HP dice rolls was better from the beginning. I was originally thinking 17 and 17. What you guys do?

14 Str doesn't do anything besides carry weight. Since you ask, I would dump Charisma altogether and allocate the stats as follows:

18
18
18
10
18
7

Edit: Also, I never start with less than 18 on a fighter because the jump to 19 is MASSIVE.

Umm...shylaman wants to be a Kensai/Druid. You need 17 wisdom, 17 charisma, and 15 strength for that (which shylaman can get by using the strength and charisma tomes).

Stormvessel

elminster said:

Stormvessel said:

shylaman said:

Thanks for the tips. I'll see how it works out.

I got a pretty decent roll:

14
16
18
10
15
16

I'll use tomes to get a couple required stats up before dualing. I wasn't sure on DEX and CON. I need AC and HP with the Kensai. I figure get full HP dice rolls was better from the beginning. I was originally thinking 17 and 17. What you guys do?

14 Str doesn't do anything besides carry weight. Since you ask, I would dump Charisma altogether and allocate the stats as follows:

18
18
18
10
18
7

Edit: Also, I never start with less than 18 on a fighter because the jump to 19 is MASSIVE.

Umm...shylaman wants to be a Kensai/Druid. You need 17 wisdom, 17 charisma, and 15 strength for that (which shylaman can get by using the strength and charisma tomes).

Oh, I didn't realize Druids required such a high Charisma. I would probably still figure out a way to hit 18 strength though if I were going to be a fighter or fighter/, because of what the jump to 19 offers.

DreadKhan

A few points...

@shylaman‌ NOTE! You must have 15 strength to allow a fighter to dual class, and MUST have 17 charisma and 17 wisdom to dual to Druid! If possible, I would take an 18 in dex probably, its a key stat you wont be boosting easily. Dont go below 16 cons with a kensai unless you know the game very well. Intelligence must be your dump stat I suspect, and it will be low. Dont worry, this is only an issue in BG2. Kensai to druid is very stat intensive!

General early advice since you use staves: try to get the staff for sale in Ulgoth's Beard as soon as reasonable. Do not stand still with your PC after he attacks an big, hardhitting enemy, like a bear, ogre, or ogre mage. Enemies that look like human/dwarf warriors and have names often hit harder too, so let an npc get their attention. Staves have reach, so use it. I still prefer daggers, but you arent screwed by any means, staff is easily next best for a to be druid. If you find the game too hard, and changing tactics/lowering difficulty isnt enough, consider restarting or editing your stats to get an 18/xx strength score, and 18 dex/cons

Stormvessel

Blackraven said:

...Druids can use daggers, so you'll be able to continue to use them after you complete your dualling process.

You would be able to use them anyway once you exceed your original level, unless I am mistaken (which is very possible). For instance, I know from experience that when dualing Sharteel to thief she can't use longswords until you exceed the Fighter level (but then you can). Or if you dual Imoen to Mage, you can't use Shortswords until you exceed your thief level (and then you can). So even if he took a weapon that Druids can't use (such as Katana), he should still be able to wield it once he get's his fighter levels back.

Unless, like I said, I am mistaken.

elminster

Well the roll is an 89 if I'm not mistaken. You probably aren't going to do much better than that as a human fighter. I think all the main things have been covered.

The only thing I might have changed (assuming this is not a solo playthrough) is reduced intelligence to 8 and then increase dexterity. Broadly speaking I think dexterity would prove more useful, at least as long as you have no plans to have that character use any wands. Plus for the few encounters in bg2 where having more intelligence could prove useful there are many potions available to do that.

shylaman

If starting in BG2 I'd dual at 9 and get to Druid 10 in no time. Considering this is complete saga run, I am thinking 7 might work better? Otherwise, running a party of five I'd probably be a Kensai all of BG1 correct?

Stormvessel

elminster said:

Well the roll is an 89 if I'm not mistaken. You probably aren't going to do much better than that as a human fighter. I think all the main things have been covered.

The only thing I might have changed (assuming this is not a solo playthrough) is reduced intelligence to 8 and then increase dexterity. Broadly speaking I think dexterity would prove more useful, at least as long as you have no plans to have that character use any wands. Plus for the few encounters in bg2 where having more intelligence could prove useful there are many potions available to do that.

Bringing it down to 7 (or 6 + the Tome) would even work well because a pot of genius adds 4 bringing it up to 11 which is a good number for attacking mindflayers.

luskan

A good defense for a Kensai is a devastating offence. Druids can use scimitars, and if you're good aligned and don't mind a little cheese use an invisibility potion and watch the gnolls kill Drizzt and grab Twinkle and Icing Death to dual wield. Once you level up a couple of times with max HP you'll survive regular mobs critical hits if you don't get surrounded.

There are good scimitars in the sequel too, so it flows pretty nicely.

DreadKhan

Ha, just realized you're planning a pretty late bg1 dual. So you'll have tomed by then. Heh. Anyways, consider catefully what level you drop kensai. 9 is a nice level to dual out, since you get another +1, right? Druids start getting xp really slow, so this can force an earlier duel than folks would do on a kensai mage. I would dual at 13, ie in bg2, and rely on elemental forms to stomp around in ToB, but 14 is a slog for druid.

@elminster‌ I heard that sws boosts shapeshifted natural weapons, is this true?

Stormvessel

shylaman said:

If starting in BG2 I'd dual at 9 and get to Druid 10 in no time. Considering this is complete saga run, I am thinking 7 might work better? Otherwise, running a party of five I'd probably be a Kensai all of BG1 correct?

I am running a Berserker right now and I plan on dualing at 13 for the extra .5 apr that comes at that level. I will also get an extra pip the level right before dualing (12).

You can dual at 13 and still hit druid level 28 (at 7,750,000xp). That should be more than fine because Druids hit their spell cap at 25.

shylaman

Definitely not 13 for me. I get the fighter bonuses, but Druids are my favorite class. So, I'd prefer to play a Druid sooner. That is where 9 is a good compromise, but last time I did a F->D dual I started in BG2, so it wasn't long before I was a full F/D.

Playing a BGT run through, I don't know if I want to wait until 9. That is probably the whole BG1 part of the trilogy.

elminster

DreadKhan said:

Ha, just realized you're planning a pretty late bg1 dual. So you'll have tomed by then. Heh. Anyways, consider catefully what level you drop kensai. 9 is a nice level to dual out, since you get another +1, right? Druids start getting xp really slow, so this can force an earlier duel than folks would do on a kensai mage. I would dual at 13, ie in bg2, and rely on elemental forms to stomp around in ToB, but 14 is a slog for druid.

@elminster‌ I heard that sws boosts shapeshifted natural weapons, is this true?

Not sure 100% but I am under the impression it does. Can't test it at the moment.

DreadKhan

Thanks El, I cant test either, but my limited background screwing around suggests they do.

So, how are you planning to use your character? If its not going to shapeshift later into elemental form, the level you dual isnt as important. But if you plan on melee combat shifted later, I know I would wait for 9. I'd also take sws once or twice. Running a casterbased druid is fine too, and you can use those decent druid staff options effectively.

shylaman

Melee based in mid game with Iron Skin and support from Fire Elemental with Insect Plague to distract casters. Later game with high level druid spells I'd transition to more of a summoner/caster and support fighter.

DreadKhan

You should do fine with 7 then, druids get cleric THAC0, right? You will get more hp and an extra attack, so you shouldnt worry much. 7 will be more fun for you than 13, and you arent loosing a heap by not hitting 9, you wont need the speed factor, and have enough boost.

Archaos

You play the Kensai like a Thief or Monk. You let the tanks go in, you follow, deliver some painful strikes and disengage.

elminster

I would still go with level 9. It doesn't take that long to get to druid level 10 but you might as well get that extra 1 thaco and 1 damage boost.

shylaman

Sounds good. Going back and forth between 18 for CON or DEX. Or 17 and 17. I want to keep INT 10.

DreadKhan

Well, 19 cons is the cap really, so 17 cons should be enough I think.

Dualing at 9 will be stronger.

elminster

17/17 would be fine. 18 dexterity (which you can eventually get with a tome) is the same as 19 from an AC standpoint and the 18 con you can get with the tome is still excellent.