multi-class grandmastery proposal
eckister
Member Posts: 37
so I was thinking the other night (because you know - why sleep when you can think about Baldurs Gate... :-D) and I thought about all those fabulous mods Baldurs Gate II was graced with over the years. two of those I came to like the most were the multi-class grandmastery mod and the multiple strongholds pack. the latter is a discussion for another time, of coarse, but its the former which led me here.
now I AM aware that the rules themselves prohibit dual/multiclasses from achieving grandmastery and I guess its an attempt to balance classes and give single-class warriors "a cookie" - all well and good, but irrational.
first of all - let me explain why I claim this to be "a cookie" - while grandmastery can give you a not-so-small bonus to damage and THAC0, a single-class warrior of level 40 is going to have more than enough bonuses (more HPs, higher THAC0 from gaining more levels, etc.) to be able to forfeit this one thing. dual classes reach half the experience, thus half the level and thus half the bonuses a single class would have. sure - they receive bonuses from their second (or even third) class, but that does not explain why they cannot learn mastery/grandmastery - they still learn and grow as warriors and if one ONLY uses longswords (for example), where in bhaals mercy did he learn to use an axe then? 0_o did Tyr himself lecture him on how his "unlawful behavior" is tearing up the multiverse and thus used his power to divert that martial knowledge? :-D
sorry about the cynicism, Ill be good now. ;-) point being - the character still learns and grows as a warrior, the proof is that they gain experience. thus it is simply not logical to divert his/her learning away from the thing that makes a warrior BE a warrior - mastery/grandmastery of his/her chosen weapon. would it be thus possible to bend the 2nd edition rules a bit here? please? pretty please?
)
now I realise this is not simple matter to change (for legal reasons), but Id wager it might make several people quite happy. ;-)
now I AM aware that the rules themselves prohibit dual/multiclasses from achieving grandmastery and I guess its an attempt to balance classes and give single-class warriors "a cookie" - all well and good, but irrational.
first of all - let me explain why I claim this to be "a cookie" - while grandmastery can give you a not-so-small bonus to damage and THAC0, a single-class warrior of level 40 is going to have more than enough bonuses (more HPs, higher THAC0 from gaining more levels, etc.) to be able to forfeit this one thing. dual classes reach half the experience, thus half the level and thus half the bonuses a single class would have. sure - they receive bonuses from their second (or even third) class, but that does not explain why they cannot learn mastery/grandmastery - they still learn and grow as warriors and if one ONLY uses longswords (for example), where in bhaals mercy did he learn to use an axe then? 0_o did Tyr himself lecture him on how his "unlawful behavior" is tearing up the multiverse and thus used his power to divert that martial knowledge? :-D
sorry about the cynicism, Ill be good now. ;-) point being - the character still learns and grows as a warrior, the proof is that they gain experience. thus it is simply not logical to divert his/her learning away from the thing that makes a warrior BE a warrior - mastery/grandmastery of his/her chosen weapon. would it be thus possible to bend the 2nd edition rules a bit here? please? pretty please?
)now I realise this is not simple matter to change (for legal reasons), but Id wager it might make several people quite happy. ;-)
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Comments
level of fighter, for example, caps at 24 fighter / 20 Wizard
single class fighter caps at 40 and single class mage caps at 31
that is 60% of fighter levels and 64.5% of mage levels you get there...
2. "higher THAC0 from gaining more levels"
also not really true.
the thac0 decrease of a fighter caps at level 20
so a max level fighter/mage has the same thac0 a max level fighter has.
3. you already have the same thac0 and 124.5% of the levels a single class would have, and the only downside at the moment is, that you can't reach grandmastery and that you have a bit less hp.
when multis now can reach grandmastery, then there would really any downside of going the multi route. other then not being able to take a class kit...
multis would get even more powerful then they already are, and they are already more powerful then single classes, most of the time.
and why even bother with grandmastery? what do you need it for? you get 2 more thac0 and 3 more damage. but why even bother with that tiny adventage, when you can boost yourself with spells or just backstabbing everything into pieces?
is it about the extra 1/2 attack?
for that you can wear "Gauntlets of Extraordinary Specialization"
you get 1/2 attack, +1thac0 and +2 damage with them.
with them a multiclass fighter mage can reach 5 attacks per round.
2 attack from figher
1/2 attack from weapon specialization
1 attack from dual wielding
1 attack from offhand weapons (Belm +2, Kundane, Scarlet NinjaTo)
and 1/2 attack from the gauntlets.
and then with improved haste, you get 10 attacks per round for several rounds.
a single class fighter gets 10 attacks only for one round with greater whirlwind.
http://www.gibberlings3.net/bg2tweaks/
after all - the thing that some "higher force" prohibits you from mastering your weapon seems kind of weak. seems I didnt get my facts together enough though, hats off to you sir!
decado - ye I know of the gibberlings3 site, thank you though. the point of my query was to ask, wether it could get implemented outright. ;-) if it can - awesome!!! if not ... its not like Im gonna start hating the game or anything... :-)
Use a mod, it's the best you will get.
espacially in bgee it is a really hefty class.
berserker half-orc with dual wield.
nearly no melee or archer can do much about you with you 19con
and when you approach a spellcaster just use you rage and you are immune to nearly all control effects.
you just wreck everything.
i soloed with one until i got to baldurs gate without any problems, but it got pretty boring then.
aaaaaaanyways - youve got me gentlemen, Ill use the mod. thanks for a constructive discussion!
espacially in bgee it is a really hefty class.
berserker half-orc with dual wield.
nearly no melee or archer can do much about you with you 19con
and when you approach a spellcaster just use you rage and you are immune to nearly all control effects.
you just wreck everything.
i soloed with one until i got to baldurs gate without any problems, but it got pretty boring then.
Allow Multiclass Grandmastery? [x]
Allow multiple strongholds? [x]
I really don't think multis need Grandmastery. Heck, duals out of fighter shouldn't be going past proficiency with their pips either!