Why are liches immune to spells of 5th or below?

SergeTroy

I've played pnp DnD for a fair while, through early 2nd ed and into 4th (forgive me!) And in none of those games did liches ha e this feature. Certainly there were types of spells they were unaffected by (3rd really was the first ed to compile that by my memory) but this blanket immunity was never there. Also, and I know it's not just me that feels this way, but why does Breach have to be considered to be targeting or effecting the creature when we all know it's targeting dispellable affects on the creature? Have to admit that once these enhanced editions are a bit more stable I can't see myself not installing. SCS' reliable Breach tweak, it just doesn't make sense otherwise.

JuliusBorisov

I believe it's a question that can be answered only buy the original Devs of BG and other IE games.

I check www.blackwyrmlair.net/~dl/Misc/Monsters/monstimun.html and see it's completely ok.

To me, this immunity has always been fine - liches are powerful enemies, rare to find so they needed something to make them hard to kill. It's like the Magic Resistance of Dragons or Elder Beholder Rays.

Still with the Protection from Undead liches are not hard at all

DreadKhan

http://www.dotd.com/mm/MM00185.htm

elminster

bengoshi said:

I check www.blackwyrmlair.net/~dl/Misc/Monsters/monstimun.html and see it's completely ok.

Good link but that is referring to the game, not PnP

SergeTroy

Holy, I thought this was a marked for ignore thread, thanks for replying you guys! In regards the 'Protection from' option with scrolls, I'd have to say one thing and admit another. Using those scrolls always felt cheap to me, along with setting up a truckload of traps prior to a scripted encounter. It's hard to argue with as a legitimate strategy per se, it just doesn't seem right. I'm okay with the protection from specific elements or energy, petrification, but for things like that, I may as well use the original, un-nerfed Cloak of Mirroring + berserker for powering through the beholders lair. My thoughts. Again, the biggest issue I have with it is blocking the Breach spell and other Protection counter spells.

DreadKhan

2nd Ed is a pretty cheesey system actually, in that it hugely rewards metagame knowledge; TONS of otherwise brutally difficult enemies are very easy with the right gear or tactics. Fight some enemies 'wrong' and you are toast, fight them 'right' and they are a pushover. Other editions have this too for certain monsters (anything reliant on one special attack falls under this heading), but seem less extreme.

meagloth

BG liches be trippin'.

SergeTroy

Those comments are definitely true on both counts. I have a very strong interest in exploring how SCS liches work, but I'm going to have to wait for some more patches. Hope I can make my EE investment count without going back to the originals on my GoG account.

SharGuidesMyHand

Because BG2's original makers couldn't come up with creative ways to make the game challenging, so they just kept giving senseless "immunities" to certain enemies, and consequently, made the combat very unbalanced.