[Dupe 7374] Monster attack rolls

nehrujuman

Hi. I now think this is a bug. I am confused as to the attack and damage bonuses monsters seem to be receiving during play (at "core rules" difficulty).

For example, a wolf (a normal wolf) attacking my shapeshifter gets an attack roll bonus of +5 (reads: 14 + 5: hit); the damage the wolf does also seems to be high (it has done 10 points of damage for example). On the other hand, the attack bonus versus Jaheira in splint mail is +0 (this is specifically written in the attack roll display).

This seems to be in contradiction to the 2nd edition monstrous manual (damage 2-5 for normal wolf).

I have tested and confirmed that this behavior is different from the original baldur's gate.

Is this indeed a bug, or an undocumented alteration in the role playing combat mechanics?

HerrderGezeiten

Did you use range weapons in close combat?
Did the Charakter wear a helmet? (5 *2 Crit Dam?)

^^ it sounds like Imoen with Bow vs Wolf.

Last but not least Wolfs are not easy (~26HP is a damn hard opponent at level 1)

I never fight a Wolf 1vs1 in close combat at level 1. (2vs1 with range support)

nehrujuman

Thanks for the reply. I tested with various armor/weapon configurations and there is indeed a relationship with the configuration:

1. Having a ranged weapon or no weapon in melee range seems to confer an attack bonus for the OPPONENT (though realistic, this is nowhere in 2nd edition rules).
2. Having no armor also seems to contribute to a greater bonus being given the opponent (that makes no sense as armor class already accounts for having no armor; in any case, this is, again, contrary to 2nd edition mechanics.
3. The original Baldur's Gate seems to not have these issues.

By the way, a normal wolf has 2+2 hit dice and therefore averages 11 hit points.

nehrujuman

Oh, also, I wasn't referring to critical hits. Thanks.

nehrujuman

Oops. A wolf has 3 hit dice (from the 2nd ed. Monstrous Manual) and averages 13.5 hp.

HerrderGezeiten

Meh, don`t give much on the average I counted ~26HP at my last Wolf battle.

Must be a though bastard.

ranged weapon

http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/29494/serious-warning-you-miss-quite-critical-information/p1Info

in short :
ranged weapons suffer from +4 penalty to ac when attacked by melee and suffer from +8 Thac0 penalty in melee

EDIT:
I just tested a normal Wolf again 21Dam and a 5 Hit killed it -> 22-26 HP (maybe a mod but I think it is vanilla)

nehrujuman

Okay, but why does that apply to my unarmed werewolf form shapeshifter. The wolf is receiving a +5 bonus on attack rolls against him. I am testing this at the wilderness area south of the Friendly Arm Inn. Try it; using a werewolf form, rest until a wolf shows up and let it attack you. Doesn't seem to correspond to any rule I know.

nehrujuman

Wrote to soon. I see it in the comments of the post you linked: other than monks, unarmed receive +4 to AC AND damage received.

nehrujuman

Is this a DnD rule or specific to the game; if it is a rule, please tell me where it can be found, because I don't see it.

nehrujuman

DUNGEON MASTERS GUIDE: "A character attempting to punch, wrestle, or overbear an armed
opponent can do so only by placing himself at great risk. Making matters worse, an
armed defender is automatically allowed to strike with his weapon before the unarmed
attack is made, regardless of the initiative roll. Since his opponent must get very close,
the defender gains a +4 bonus to his attack and damage rolls. If the attacker survives, he
can then attempt his attack."

I am humbled. Beamdog knows their schtuff.

HerrderGezeiten

The link above states it, it was only in the Vanilla loading screen (not in the manual or in current EE mentioned)

Gate70

Have you been shapeshifted for 16 hours or longer. I can see a wolf getting +1 against my test shapeshifter, after 2 rests that increases to +5 and is accompanied by the shapeshifter paws being replaced by fists or another weapon.

http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/35647/known-7374-shapeshifter-druid-kit

If you could confirm @nehrujuman‌ I'll mark it up as such. If not the same, would you be able to zip and attach a save for inspection please.
Thanks

nehrujuman

Yes, that is exactly correct; I was level grinding in the wilderness. I also noticed that if I equip my shapeshifter with a staff (or any weapon I guess) the wolf bonus goes to +1.

nehrujuman

Basically, it seems that weapons (allowed weapons) can be equipped in werewolf form and their characteristics are factored into the combat (?).