New run, two very different experimental options... advice?
SweetMagooMagoodle
Member Posts: 40
Hi. I am a BG series vet who has played through the original series many times. I also ran through the EEs once. With the latest BG2 patch, I am now getting ready for another run, and I am trying to decide between two very different, somewhat experimental options for a class, and I would love to get folks’ opinions about both of them (and which you personally might enjoy playing more). While I may get folks accusing me of cheese, that is not my goal -- I just want something different.
I should note I will likely play with SCS and will have a party of 4 (including CHARNAME).
Option one: a modified Avenger – a true shifter.
I always enjoyed the shape shifting druid in the original Neverwinter Nights—a true shifter with literally dozens of super cool shifting options. While I like the Avenger in theory, it bores me to think that you get all your shapes at one time (is it level 7?) and while the shapes upgrade modestly when porting over to BG2, essentially the shapes are the same for the entire game. The elemental forms are great but vanilla druids get them as well, so really they don’t add anything special to the Avenger.
I like the idea of adding via EEKeeper additional shapes. I have experimented and this can be done using the innate spells as long as the shapes are possible through the mage shifting spells (as those shapes become innate abilities). Thus I would add the mage’s polymorph self forms (Gnoll, Mustard Jelly, Ogre) – probably late in BG – level 9? Once per day each form. I tried and this works.
I would also add the uber powerful mage Shapechange forms once the avenger gets HLAs. I may just select the elemental HLA at each level up, and then replace the elemental through EEKeeper with one of the Shapechange forms – mindflayer, Giant troll, giant, wolfwere, Iron golem. So after 5 level ups with HLAs I would, instead of elementals, have these 5 powerful forms to use once a day each.
As a trade off, I may decide to never use (or delete through EE keeper) all the added mage spells the Avenger gets – except web, which has synergy with the spider form and just makes sense to have for a shifter with a spider form.
My goal is not to create an uber powerful avenger—it is to create an actual shifter class (and I don’t know how to use Near Infinity – this seems easier) to add enjoyment to the game for me.
Thoughts?
Option 2, and one that may seem far less experimental – a wizard slayer theif multi (through EE keeper).
I love the idea of trying a wizard slayer now that ranged weapons also have the miscast magic ability (as opposed to just melee). I like the idea of rogue-y dart throwing wizard slayer – plus dagger user for dagger of venom and throwing daggers for the strength damage. I would throw daggers at non magic users and hurl darts at magic users.
However, I find playing the entire series as a fighter class boring, and my last run I was a fighter mage and went with the fighter stronghold as Nalia was in my party. I want a different stronghold this time.
I love thieves! And I love thieves as multi classes. I can see a wizard slayer/theif backstabbing with dagger of venom but also able to hurl darts and daggers. I think the thief skills will be seriously gimped though because I can’t use any magic items – not even potions of master thievery. So, a challenge – I would put most of my skill points into stealth for backstabbing or for surprise dart throwing attacks (against stone skinned scs mages).
Admittedly once I get UAI there may be cheese, but I plan on only using UAI to allow me to gulp potions – any potion I want. And possibly use the green protection spells. But otherwise, I wouldn’t use anything else a Wizard slayer couldn’t use. This requires self control, but I could do it.
I imagine there would be interesting challenges with this class but could be fun as well.
Advice? Critiques? Thoughts?
Each option is radically different. I plan on doing one BG run and then trying to Dragon Age Inquisition for a bit, so I may not get back to BG for awhile and I want a really interesting run. Thanks!
(also i should mention that my third option is just to do a straight shadow dancer since I havent tried that kit yet -- if folks want to vouch for that over the other two please do!)
I should note I will likely play with SCS and will have a party of 4 (including CHARNAME).
Option one: a modified Avenger – a true shifter.
I always enjoyed the shape shifting druid in the original Neverwinter Nights—a true shifter with literally dozens of super cool shifting options. While I like the Avenger in theory, it bores me to think that you get all your shapes at one time (is it level 7?) and while the shapes upgrade modestly when porting over to BG2, essentially the shapes are the same for the entire game. The elemental forms are great but vanilla druids get them as well, so really they don’t add anything special to the Avenger.
I like the idea of adding via EEKeeper additional shapes. I have experimented and this can be done using the innate spells as long as the shapes are possible through the mage shifting spells (as those shapes become innate abilities). Thus I would add the mage’s polymorph self forms (Gnoll, Mustard Jelly, Ogre) – probably late in BG – level 9? Once per day each form. I tried and this works.
I would also add the uber powerful mage Shapechange forms once the avenger gets HLAs. I may just select the elemental HLA at each level up, and then replace the elemental through EEKeeper with one of the Shapechange forms – mindflayer, Giant troll, giant, wolfwere, Iron golem. So after 5 level ups with HLAs I would, instead of elementals, have these 5 powerful forms to use once a day each.
As a trade off, I may decide to never use (or delete through EE keeper) all the added mage spells the Avenger gets – except web, which has synergy with the spider form and just makes sense to have for a shifter with a spider form.
My goal is not to create an uber powerful avenger—it is to create an actual shifter class (and I don’t know how to use Near Infinity – this seems easier) to add enjoyment to the game for me.
Thoughts?
Option 2, and one that may seem far less experimental – a wizard slayer theif multi (through EE keeper).
I love the idea of trying a wizard slayer now that ranged weapons also have the miscast magic ability (as opposed to just melee). I like the idea of rogue-y dart throwing wizard slayer – plus dagger user for dagger of venom and throwing daggers for the strength damage. I would throw daggers at non magic users and hurl darts at magic users.
However, I find playing the entire series as a fighter class boring, and my last run I was a fighter mage and went with the fighter stronghold as Nalia was in my party. I want a different stronghold this time.
I love thieves! And I love thieves as multi classes. I can see a wizard slayer/theif backstabbing with dagger of venom but also able to hurl darts and daggers. I think the thief skills will be seriously gimped though because I can’t use any magic items – not even potions of master thievery. So, a challenge – I would put most of my skill points into stealth for backstabbing or for surprise dart throwing attacks (against stone skinned scs mages).
Admittedly once I get UAI there may be cheese, but I plan on only using UAI to allow me to gulp potions – any potion I want. And possibly use the green protection spells. But otherwise, I wouldn’t use anything else a Wizard slayer couldn’t use. This requires self control, but I could do it.
I imagine there would be interesting challenges with this class but could be fun as well.
Advice? Critiques? Thoughts?
Each option is radically different. I plan on doing one BG run and then trying to Dragon Age Inquisition for a bit, so I may not get back to BG for awhile and I want a really interesting run. Thanks!
(also i should mention that my third option is just to do a straight shadow dancer since I havent tried that kit yet -- if folks want to vouch for that over the other two please do!)
3
Comments
The True Shifter should be plenty of fun to play. You'd be shifting a lot, and you'd have to figure out which shapes when to use. They way you intend to set the kit up I don't think your character would become overpowered (and thus potentially boring to play).
I played a dart-throwing Halfling Wizard Slayer/Thief well into SoA a number of years ago. Never got her into HLA territory, but I found her a lot of fun to play. More versatile than a single class Wizard Slayer and a bit less straightforward than a traditional Fighter/Thief (which is a very potent class). As @Jarrakul said, your "use any potion" rule the character will assure that the game remains challenging. Your character won't be nearly as resistant to magic as a straight WS, but potions can help there.
Anyway, thanks for the votes of confidence on both ideas.
Basically, you gain new shapeshifting forms every 4 levels:
1: Ettercap, with poison attack
5: Troll, 2 HP healed per second,
9: Kuo Toa, slow on hit, can dispel illusions
13: Umber Hulk, stun on hit, can cast single-target confusion spell
17: Shadow, STR drain on hit
21: Beholder, casts random beholder rays when it attacks
25: Black Dragon, can use black dragon acid breath
However, the monk comes with various penalties and weaknesses. Most importantly, it is immune to almost all healing magic and shapeshifting causes HP loss (returning to natural form and the troll form's regeneration can heal it, however). Having tested it in an SCS2 run, it doesn't seem too overpowered, considering its weaknesses.
I could upload the relevant files someplace if anybody is interested, but I don't know if it would work with BG2:EE; I only have the original.