Weapon Recommendations for Swashbuckler->Mage? (BG:EE saga)

manutd_fan_1999

May I ask for ideas for weapon styles with a Swashbuckler (10) -> Mage?

I am planning BG:EE as a swashbuckler & dual at the beginning of BG2:EE to mage, and having trouble deciding between single weapon or two weapon

a) single weapon for ease of switching between melee and ranged
or
b) two weapon style with (weapon style) and 2/3 in two weapon fighting

Any ideas for a swashbuckler>mage on when to take what weapons/styles?

Wilbur

Your off-hand THAC0 will be terrible in BG:EE so I would probably choose a single weapon style. Also the ease of use is really nice if you switch a lot between ranged and melee.

Wowo

I soloed BGEE with a swashbuckler (which I dualed at 26 in bg2 to cleric) and I can say that TWF'ing is totally excellent as it doubles your damage output.

Go scimitars and put lots of points into set trap initially and take out drizzt with 7 traps and you'll cruise through with a fun character.

In bg2 dual wielding scimitar+shortsword is the way to go unless you're happy to be a Mage with limited melee potential.

manutd_fan_1999

I am intending to be a primary mage with some trap removal, so would dual-wielding still be viable for a swash->mage or should I stick to a single weapon?

Wilbur

manutd_fan_1999 said:

I am intending to be a primary mage with some trap removal, so would dual-wielding still be viable for a swash->mage or should I stick to a single weapon?

If you have a high STR coupled with a THAC0 boosting item then I guess you'll be fine. Or if you have Drizzt's swords

But don't expect to hit too often with your off-hand against anyone with decent AC.

manutd_fan_1999

I was going to maybe use Dak'kon's Zerth Blade as an offhand option solely for extra spells, unless there are better options for the off hand

Blackraven

Supposing you'd dual at around level 10 (beginning of BG2), you'll only have a +2 Thac0 bonus compared to other Thieves and your Thac0 will progress very slowly after you become a Mage. So if you want your Swashmage to be a reliable (dualwielding) hitter in combat you'll have to do everything you can to improve Thac0. Eventually that will probably mean Belm in the off hand and Crom Faeyr in the main hand, plus maybe some Thac0 boosting items such as Gauntlets of Weapon Expertise. Of course *** in TWF will help your (off-hand) Thac0, as will specialization ** in Hammers and Scimitars.
The two weapons' equipped abilities complement each other nicely. The extra attack that Belm gives with CF is great and CF's amazing STR bonus will make you more likely to hit with Belm as well. You could buff with (Improved) Haste for further improving your performance in battle, or Tenser's Transformation although the latter spell shuts down you spellcasting while its active. Before you get CF there will always be DUHM that you could use to increase you STR twice per day (supposing you get those Bhaalpowers by maintaining a good reputation in BG1).

The disadvantage of using Belm is that it's only a +2 weapon. This means that a number of enemies later in the game won't be affected by your hits with it. A single-class Swashbuckler (or one dualled after getting UAI) would have access to Scarlet Ninja-To and thus be better off, but your Swashmage will either have to stick with Belm to at least still get two APR with Crom Faeyr, or switch to another off hand weapon to have 1 APR with Crom Faeyr and one with the new weapon. If using Haste to get a second APR with the main hand weapon, you'd have to look whether you want to keep CF still in the main hand or whether its preferable to put the other weapon in the main hand slot and CF in the off hand.

FinneousPJ

@Blackraven I don't think thieves may use war hammers.

Blackraven

@FinneousPJ, ouch there goes my advice.... (too much playing with mods I'm afraid). Thanks for pointing this out.
@manutd_fan_1999, with no access to Crom Faeyr you'll have to make do with STR belts. Scimitars are still a good option for off hand Belm. In ToB there will also be a good main hand Scimitar. For the main hand you could consider relying on Celestial Fury for SoA (Katana) if you plan on using Dakkon's Zerth Blade. Long swords are also a solid choice due to the large variety of enchanted long swords you'll find throughout the game. Daystar is great against undead, Equalizer (requiring True Neutraility to be wielded) gives very good Thac0 bonuses against most of your enemies, and (upgraded) Angurvadal has a STR bonus.

Jaheiras_Witness

Dualwielding katanas and scimitars would probably be your best bet with healthy use of Tenser's Transformation for some real melee power. You don't have many proficiency slots though so it won't be easy to get the most out of this since you'll probably want to use a bow too.

squiros

how melee do you want want to be? you can be as melee as you want, with a mage. if you want 5 attacks per round, shapechange to mindflayer. the best weapon is the black blade of disaster. add tenser's to it and you'll have the thaco, apr and damage of a fighter. stoneskin and whatever other protections are also good additions. if you cast shapechange, all subsequent clones will have the shapechange ability as well. this is likely cheesy, however, you can have a project image do this via scrolls without expending any items. shapechange: mindflayer, tensers, black blade. any protections you cast before that should persist, making the project image a simulated fighter for when you want to be a fighter at the cost of a level 7 spell. then you can go back to being a mage after a few encounters. simulacrums will require a 'restore' spell cast on them to have the correct levels, but can still be done. simulacrums have the advantage of being able to take hits after stoneskin wears off. interestingly, you can heal wounded soldiers by shapechanging to troll for the regen while out of combat. consider staying troll for 4 attacks and regen. i believe black blade gives you 5 proficiencies, which mitigates proficiency loss. also the blade qualifies as a backstabber.

i believe melf's minute meteors also works if you want to fake an archer. though speaking of archer, an army of cloned mindflayers using psionic blast and then a melf's barrage is hilarious (read:cheesy). in this case, i think you can carry the flail of ages in your offhand. this will result in a ranged off hand attack with the flail.

semiticgoddess

The Greater Werewolf has far better regeneration than the troll. The Greater Werewolf weapon regenerates 8 HP per second, or 48 per round. It's nearly impossible to kill. And you can double that regeneration with Improved Haste.

The Iron Golem form from Shapechange is also quite nice. With 24 STR and 4d10 base damage, it does an average 34 damage per hit. The only problem with the Iron Golem form is its 1 base APR, but you can still use Belm/Kundane/Scarlet Ninja-to in your off hand and get 3 APR. Also, the Iron Golem weapon strikes as a +4 weapon, meaning it can hit things that other shapeshifts cannot. And the Iron Golem is immune to magic and elemental damage, and has 20% resistance to physical damage.

Shapechange is terribly overpowered, but then, it is a level 9 spell. It works especially well with dual-classes.

Yannir

Blackraven said:

Equalizer (requiring True Neutraility to be wielded) gives very good Thac0 bonuses against most of your enemies

It doesn't require being True Neutral, any alignment can use it. I've had paladins wield it with great effectiveness. A pretty decent sword in any case.