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Ankheg plate mail has incorrect AC

2

Comments

  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    edited December 2012
    I'd like that too but there are many things that need to be fixed, right now the simplest fix is the most likely to happen.

  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    Well, the simplest fix would be to reduce its AC from 1 to 2, since the magical flag is already not there.

    Then they can create a new item when they build it into BG2, with an added line of text in the description to denote its origin. At which point they can (if they want) add the enchantment as an optional side-quest back into BG1.

    lolien
  • CamDawgCamDawg Member, Developer Posts: 3,420
    The simplest solution is to keep it as it was in BG and BG2--a magical, AC 1 armor. The justification for the change remains nonexistent.

    lolien
  • RiolathelRiolathel Member Posts: 330
    edited December 2012
    i still don't think this should be considered a magical item.. If it is converted to magical there is no point in even making it. You can get full plate mail for twice the price which allows you to wear protective gear as well and by that time in the game 9k is nothing.

    Ankheg would be rendered obsolete..

    If any fix will be implemented i hope they just reduce the AC to 2

    but i guess the magical plate mail would be useful to druids.. no extra saving throws but lots more AC

  • SplodSplod Member Posts: 114
    My understanding as to why it was increased to AC1 was to actually separate it from the plethora of plate lying around. It's not overly cheap either, so I really don't see the issue with it being AC1?
    It is described as 'providing a greater degree of protection than traditional plate mail.' All seems above board to me.

    lolien
  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    CamDawg said:

    The simplest solution is to keep it as it was in BG and BG2--a magical, AC 1 armor. The justification for the change remains nonexistent.

    I thought it was non-magical AC2 in BG1? From what I understood, it was left at AC1 because it was using the same item as the one in BG2. They removed the magical flag to make it more like the original BG1 version, but left the AC where it was "for reasons".

    lolien
  • CamDawgCamDawg Member, Developer Posts: 3,420
    /double-checks

    Well, let me clarify a bit. It's AC 1 and on the item exclusion list--meaning it can't be worn with Rings/Cloaks/Amulets of Protection--but not actually flagged in its item file as magical. It's the same in both BG and BG2.

    Flagging armor as magical only matters in one place in the entire series--if you surrender your items to Nizidramanii'yt.

    lolien
  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    Ah.

    In that case, there's no reason to change it then. (That is, no reason to change it from the original.)

    I was thinking it used to be AC 2 and non-exclusive. If it wasn't, then certainly that's something that ought to be remedied.

    (Although, on a personal note, I still prefer my idea. ;) )

    lolien
  • bob_vengbob_veng Member Posts: 2,300
    i still prefer your idea too. mod pls.

  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    edited December 2012
    Aosaw said:

    I thought it was non-magical AC2 in BG1? From what I understood, it was left at AC1 because it was using the same item as the one in BG2. They removed the magical flag to make it more like the original BG1 version, but left the AC where it was "for reasons".

    Naw, in BG1 was AC1 and you could not wear any +1 protections items with it. The AC2 argument is that Ankheg is AC2 in PnP.

    My theory is that the original BG developers intention was the armor as Ankheg +1. That would explain why it is AC1 and why you couldn't wear +1 protections.
    Riolathel said:

    i still don't think this should be considered a magical item.. If it is converted to magical there is no point in even making it. You can get full plate mail for twice the price which allows you to wear protective gear as well and by that time in the game 9k is nothing.

    Ankheg would be rendered obsolete..

    Ankheg armor should be obsolete by the end of the game. In the current form it's a low level item that makes high end items obsolete.

    I don't care how they fix it, but it needs to be changed back. Either allow it to be used with 'item' of protection and move it to AC2, or leave it on AC1 and not allow you to use it with 'item' of protection.

    My vote goes to leave it on AC 1 and not use it with 'item' of protection, like it originally was. This would make the higher end plate mail items worth to be used again.

    Post edited by bigdogchris on
  • RiolathelRiolathel Member Posts: 330
    edited December 2012
    well im talking around chapter 3-4.. 9k is easily acquired by then. The only difference between Full and ankheg is the weight difference and i'm not going to bother picking up the shells, bringing them to the smith, and waiting for it to be made, and paying 4k just to have an inferior set of armor which will be replaced very quickly..

    I agree that it makes high end items obsolete, but this is because the high end magical items don't allow the use magical protective equipment which i think makes no sense.

    At the very least you should still get the saving throw bonuses from the ring/necklace/cloak.

    Items like the +3 plate mail should have added bonuses to them.. they are late in the game and the effort to acquire them is rather difficult..

    My idea would be a small elemental resistance.. 10-15%.. or thac0 +1

    Enough to make a difference and a better alternative than full plate with a +2 ring/cloak

  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    edited December 2012
    Riolathel, if you're trying to argue that Ankheg should say like it is (overpowered) but to remedy that, further enhance the armors later in the game to make them feasible, I don't buy that at all. That's a lot of changing and a lot of overpowering, just to keep 1 item that you loot at level 1 usable at high levels.

    My Proposal
    -Leave Ankheg Armor at AC1
    -Add Ankheg Armor back to excluded item list & add magical flag
    # This would set the armor as it was originally in vanilla and how it should be now
    # Additionally:
    -Modify name description to "Ankheg Plate Mail +1"
    -This addition would make it easier to understand why you can't equip magical protection with it.
    -It could help better explain the lore (Ankheg Plate being AC2/non-magic in books, but being AC 1/magic in game)
    -Everyone wins because the item is as originally designed but with an enhanced description.
    -There's nothing wrong with adding PnP flavor to a D&D game which is based on PnP D&D

    Post edited by bigdogchris on
    Deetypo_tilly
  • IchigoRXCIchigoRXC Member Posts: 1,001
    My Proposal is

    -Ankheg armour found in the 'hidden' stash should be "Weathered/battered Ankheg Armour" AC3
    -You should be able to forge Ankheg Armour as usual, AC2
    -You then should be able to magically enhance it by visiting Thalantyr, spending lots of money, possibly quest related too. Ankheg Armour +1 (magical) AC1

    3 sets of viable armour for druids (or weaklings... I am looking at you Viccy)

    bigdogchris
  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    IchigoRXC

    I like your idea. If the developers had extra time I would push for something like that. If they can only do a 'quick fix' they might have to just reset it to how it was.

    IchigoRXC
  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    See, I was gonna go the other way with it. Put the +1 version in the hidden cache (as in, "already been enchanted"), and make the Thunderhammer version the mundane AC 2 version, which can then be brought to Thalantyr.

    But as for the vanilla game, I'm fine with it being AC 1 and +1 magical.

    bigdogchris
  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    @Aosaw
    AC1 total (AC2+1) not AC1+1 = 0, right?

  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    Right. Sorry, I meant AC 1 with the +1 descriptor to mark it as magical.

  • CamDawgCamDawg Member, Developer Posts: 3,420
    Different sets of ankheg armor (or some FedEx quest to add to it) are both bad ideas.

    Let's make it all magical, AC 1 like it was in BG and BG2.

    ShokkiSirK8
  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    edited December 2012
    What do you think about changing the name to Ankheg Plate Mail +1? I've updated it and believe it's decent logic.

    Post edited by bigdogchris on
  • SirK8SirK8 Member Posts: 527
    CamDawg said:

    Different sets of ankheg armor (or some FedEx quest to add to it) are both bad ideas.

    Let's make it all magical, AC 1 like it was in BG and BG2.

    Agreed.

    Setting Ankheg armor as AC 1, AC 2 or AC 1 due to a +1, I am ok with any of those options. But please, please do not mess with the easter egg set in Nashkel, don't make it a "weaker" version of Ankheg armor, don't remove it, don't move it, etc. just because it's easy to get early on and powerful. There is an easy solution if you think the armor is too powerful too early... don't get it. If you don't want it in your game at all or want it somewhere else or want it to be a different item, mod the game. Thanks.

  • thedemoninsidethedemoninside Member Posts: 188
    I know i would feel especially important if i convinced the devs to change this.

  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    edited December 2012
    Could a mod check to see if there a reference to Ankheg Plate Mail and/or this issue in the tracker? I'm just wondering if it's been officially recognized. I know the "Move to AC2 per PnP is noted" but that's really a non-issue here because this should be "magical/non-protection/excluded" version of Ankheg Plate Mail.

  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    I think you'd need a developer to say something like that. I'm pretty sure we're still bound by the NDA where things like that are concerned.

    I'll tag @Nathan, but he might already be on vacation. ;)

  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    Often time mods here have said "Added to tracker", so I don't think it's a big secret what is on the "to do" list of bug fixes. If people knew what was being fixed there would be a lot less spam on here.

  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    Well, saying it's been added to the tracker is different from saying "it's going to be done". I misunderstood what you were asking. :)

    As for whether it's been submitted to the tracker...that I don't know.

  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    edited January 2013
    I'm really disappointed that the Ankheg got attention to remove Druid and Archer restrictions, but that the overpowered-ness, because of the ability to now equip + protections items with this armor, was not addressed.

    Ankheg plate + ring of protection +1 is now a more powerful combo than practical defense +3, which is one of the most difficult armor to obtain. Practical defense sits in my bags, completely worthless.

    Please add this back as an item excluded from being equipable with + protection items. It should of never happened in the first place.

  • ZanathKariashiZanathKariashi Member Posts: 2,867
    Well...the druid part at least was semi-legit...in BG1 the armor said it was restricted to druid, but actually wasn't, and in BG2 they removed druid restriction from the description...though that still doesn't explain why a beastmaster can't wear it....if a druid can use it, it's not metal (I REALLY wish they'd implement that properly...Fighter/Druids wearing metal armors (including studded leather) should have their spell casting and shapeshifting disabled for 24 hours, as per PnP for violating their oaths. Only armors crafted from natural materials such as padded, leather, hide, rhino, dragonscale, ankheg, are allowed), and thus there's no reason a Beastmaster shouldn't be able to wear it either.

  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    edited January 2013
    I really don't like the way this armor is turning out in this game.

    It's an easy to obtain armor at the beginning of the game (you get two sets) and now it's still the armor you're wearing at the end of the game.

    That makes no sense and it makes no sense how this change was put in while ignoring the primary problem with this armor.

  • TJ_HookerTJ_Hooker Member Posts: 2,438

    I really don't like the way this armor is turning out in this game.

    It's an easy to obtain armor at the beginning of the game (you get two sets) and now it's still the armor you're wearing at the end of the game.

    You could say the same thing about full plate (except you have to wait a bit for the second set).

  • ZanathKariashiZanathKariashi Member Posts: 2,867
    Well..it's not a huge issue..I already fixed the copy in my version to have 2 AC as per PnP, and added Beastmasters since there's no reason they shouldn't be able to use it if druids can.

    I mean for god's sake, it says they can't wear armor heavier then studded leather (same as druids)....Studded leather = 25 lbs, Ankheg armor = 25 lbs, Studded leather = very little metal with mostly animal hide, Ankheg armor = very little, if any, metal with mostly ankheg carapace.

    And no...before TotSC added that hidden suit, Ankheg armor was THE most annoying armor to get. Not only did you have to hunt ankhegs, which are extremely dangerous till higher levels, it cost a lot of gold AND you had to wait for 10 days to pick up the armor...I typically beat the game in 6-8 days...meaning it's potentially the last armor in the game you could get, if you hadn't already beaten the game by the time it was ready.

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