How to choose what/how to play

Jessica

History: I grew up watching my mother play Baldur's Gate 1, five discs and all, on the good old win 98+ computer. Dad gave it to her on her birthday and she gave him a look going "just what the heck did you give me", and yet the irony is that she's the only one (that I know of) that beat Baldur's Gate 1 and 2 (ToB kicked her so she didn't go fully for that), IceWind Dale I and II, and Neverwinter Nights 1.

Conundrum: I've given playing it a try, finally beating BG1 for the first time in the last year, and always have a hard time due to some familiarity with each of the games and their systems choosing and sticking with what to play. On the one hand I want to be myself, which means being the female druid that I probably would be most like (even though I dislike being in or dealing with nature most of the time, all the mechanics, spells and benefits have been appealing for 2e-3.75e/pathfinder). On the other, I have so many other metagame desires I want to attain. In NWN it's the two bladed sword use i almost always insist on; here, it's needing to be 'male' in order to explore desired romance options without mods, wanting grand mastery regardless of the class, wanting to use or have the option for specific weapons like the flail of ages or holy avenger. Then there's playing as myself which almost always is supposed to rely more heavily on spellcasting, when i prefer to just go in and butt some heads with Minsc (that guy is freaking mandatory, no matter the run for me =p). I know metagame wise I should be making more use of that casting, yet I'm not because it's inconvenient (or something)

I've always had such a hard time trying to sort or prioritize the above aspects. Do I play as more like myself, or do I try to powergame, only to be unhappy at some other aspect I can't fulfill, usually weapon use wise? Do I sacrifice the spellcasting and play as a character I don't thematically like, or do I play a character I just don't utilize well at all?
See the dilemna? How do you choose? If I had to guess, the whole issue of me not having fun with the powergaming should mean I should just play how I want, yet when I do, I then don't have fun with my preference because i'm not being effective. I don't seem to reach a happy medium.

Kilivitz

You know, I used to spend such a long time deciding between two or three party/PC options that eventually I realized I could have played the game two or three times already.

Nonnahswriter

Have you thought about playing a fighter/druid? All the spellcasting power of a druid plus all the fighting capabilities of a...well, fighter. Best of both worlds.

As for the gender thing, the Enhanced Editions added some new romances for girl characters: Dorn, Rasaad, and Hexxat in BG2. So even if you do decide to stick with your own lady-gender, at least you have the comfort that you don't just have Anomen anymore. I find Rasaad adorable, myself.

The thing about Baldur's Gate is that there are so many possible class/race/gender combinations that it's near impossible to explore everything the game has to offer on just one playthrough. That's why you play more than once! You could have one file be your "play myself" file, another one your "powergame" file, another labeled "romancing Aerie" file, or what have you. The possibilities are endless!

Jessica

@Kilivitz Yeah, it's part of why I'm trying to get over my frustrations with this, because I'm effectively keeping myself from playing

@Nonnahswriter Well, of course. I know in BG1 I finally beat the game for the first time as a fighter 2 dualed to druid, then EE Keepered it to be an avenger (because shapeshifter was so bad it was perceived to be the biggest handicap'd class I could hear of, unless that was fixed), but then there's the whole 'but fighter 13 -> whatever is the biggest bonus you could get' dilemna. I don't want to stop shorter than that, and the biggest issue at that point becomes the weapon selection, or lack thereof.
In regards to the gender thing, I've now installed a few mods, one of them actually removes the gender requirements so I can go after anyone now. I can now stop being 'sir'd' in game now (bad enough I deal with it irl.) But sadly I get tired of doing the same thing over and over, so I'll need to play/pick one file that you suggested and go with it till i need a reminder or want to reexperience that section with the differences. And let's not forget the whole 'do you start in BG1 to get the tomes and can import the save file, but take another 20-40 hours to get that only to get an xp boost to the right level anyway' thing... As I've mentioned, dilemmas dilemmas. Thanks for the advice so far, I'll keep thinking on it, for both of you.

Arunsun

My advice would be:
At first, play whatever class you like ( in terms of concept, I mean) without paying much attention to all that powergaming. All of them except Wizard Slayer, Shapeshifter, Beast master and Totemic druid are strong enough to go through the game even as a non-expert player. BG is great because its roleplayability is just huge, and its rules are simple to comprehend but hard to master which makes it a nice game for the powergamer within you. But this should, IMHO, come later, once you have completed the game at least twice or thrice.

wraith5641

Multi-class characters give you the most amount of options. I'd always advise anyone that hasn't played the game before to choose multi-class, since the late game benefits can be quite high. Fighter/Mage is always a great combination right the way through the game. Being able to cast protection spells on a fighter gives you some pretty insane advantages, while also being able to use almost every one of the best weapons.

I wouldn't worry about the roleplaying element, since there are so many different avenues you can explore with regard to that. Believe me, you will never be disappointed in that regard. Romances are actually some of the more duller elements in the game, in my opinion. So don't get too fixated on that either.

Unless you are soloing or duoing, your main character will be OK. You can make up for every weakness and every failure with the vast amount of NPCs in the game. No class will struggle with Edwin beside them.

At the end of the day, Amn is a huge playground waiting for you to imprint your own story upon it. Play in it however you like. There is no right or wrong way to play the game

JAuggie

Don't get caught up with the fighter dualling at 13. All of the threads that talk about that also bring up valid reasons for dualling a fighter at 3 (proficiency point), 7 (extra 1/2 apr), 9 (proficency point), and 13 (extra 1/2 apr). It sounds like you really want to play a druid so there is no point in dualling at 13 for metagaming because you will have a lot of time before you can dual...and A LOT of time before you get your fighter abilities back. There's nothing wrong with dualling at 2...you can still get grandmastery! I used to be hung up on that too, but now it's determined by what do I really want to play. Do I want to play a thief as soon as possible with some fighter skills? Dual early. Do I want to wreck the game with a thief, cleric or mage that has insane melee ability? Go through hell by doing the beginning of bg2 as a solo (and trust me after dualling a fighter at 13 and trying to solo as a lvl 1 xxx sucks without a plan) and dualling at 13. You vould just say screw soloing and try to regain your fighter abilities while in a party, but then your playing most of SoA as a single class anyways so what's the point? And just so you know my personal recommendation...don't wait until 13 to dual a fighter. The payoff at the end is not worth the pain.

wraith5641

@JAuggie Actually, I dualed my Kensai at level 13 (to a Thief), and it wasn't as bad as I thought it was going to be. I had some major difficulties at first, but after receiving some help on these forums, I knew exactly how to play the most effectively to regain my levels. I was solo, though. So regaining my levels didn't take that long. I can imagine dualing in a party of 6 at level 13 would be complete hell. Furthermore, I am quite an experienced player, so managing a low-level Thief in BG2 was fairly manageable. I think dualing late on a first playthough would be a bad idea and would lead to a lot of frustration. It would be better to just stick with multi-class, imo.

The grandmastery exploit is pretty cheesy, tbh. A Thief or Mage with two Fighter levels shouldn't end up as a grandmaster in anything, since they never earned the right to achieve it. It doesn't even make sense roleplay wise. That's just my opinion, though.

Edit: Also, it's worth pointing out that she is starting in the second game, so she won't have the option to dual-class early.

JAuggie

@wraith5641 Completely agree with both points. Having knowledge of the game definitely helps with Fighter 13 duals as I painfully learned myself after hearing how powerful they were. Grandmastery after dual 2 doesn't make sense, but I was letting OP know that her fighter 2/druid really wasn't that bad. Although rp wise it might make not sense, a fighter 2/ druid at 3mil XP with grandmastery, HLA's, and that ridiculous druid spell progression does sound pretty sweet for a new player. Hey, I may even try that one!

wraith5641

@JAuggie I was always under the impression that Druids in BG kinda sucked. I suppose combining it with a Fighter would be decent enough, but why not just do that with a Cleric?

Druids in IWD, however, pretty much dominate that game. Funnily enough, Clerics aren't fantastic in IWD. I can pretty much go the whole game without one. They seem pretty crucial in BG2, though. I would choose a Cleric over a Druid any day. The only reason for me to play as a Druid would be roleplay-wise. It certainly wouldn't be at the top of the list for a powergame run.

Jessica

@wraith5641 Actually, I considered playing a dual right from level 3 in BG1, it was my first file I beat the game with. Dualed at level 3 from fighter to avenger. I just thought about the benefits of more easily reaching higher levels in BG2 and so the investment into more fighter levels isn't as daunting then. Ultimately, If i wanted to finetune that, I can easily make a BG1 char, edit the save to give the xp I wanted, then import it into BG2 after the dual takes place.
Regarding grandmastery, I hope I had alreay said that I personally have zero objections to anyone getting grandmastery, on the grounds that if they feel they should be able to focus some/enough of their time as their class training, why can't they be a grandmaster? Why can't the rogue become a grandmaster with the shortbow (on the grounds of being an expert sniper for assassinating or shooting a trap wire/rope thing), or the druid with the scimitars, viewing them as the replacement for their claws since humanoids don't have that equivalent?
So why would I mention the dual class thing above? Well, I like my armor, in addition to the lack of need to save-edit one more character for the grandmastery, and dualing fighter to avenger overcomes the armor restriction component in addition to the combat stuff.

@JAuggie Yeah, it was a rather fun run for me, at least in BG1. The biggest frustration that I have, as I've mentioned, Is the difficulty in feeling I'm underutilizing the class.

I think I'll go ahead and play my fighter-avenger character, and I'll try to explain to myself the reason I don't cast or shift much is I'm just trying to restrain my power... not sure why I didn't think of that before. I always hold back just enough when swordfighting or debating where if my point has been driven home, I don't push harder than that amount... So that'd translate to my character with 'I know I can overpower you, but I respect you enough that I will only use enough to when you come to your senses... should you not, I will strike swiftly' or something...

I need to play IWD1/2 again here sometime soon... naturally, having never progressed beyond the beginning of chapter 2 (always faltering after the de'arnise fortress stuff, which is always my first quest) this comes first.

JAuggie

Admittedly my knowledge of druids is recent (only playing them in the last few days to get out of my multi mage/xxx or dual xxx/mage funk) but they're not bad. First, I find it enjoyable to play a class I'm not familiar with like a mage (something tells me I played a lot of arcane casters in the past), and second when they reach that sweet 3mil xp and gain ridiculous divine (druid) spellcasting they become pretty powerful. I've been powergaming them in bg2 (yay 30 days of leave) to see what they can do and with the exception of shapeshifter (which does seem inferior to pretty much any other class in the game...again just personal opinion so don't hate) they are much better than their description leaves them to be. I really think that's the problem...kinda like with a few other kits...their descriptions tend to ward off potential players because they don't understand the progressions. If you can handle them early (bg1 and early to mid SoA depending on how you play) you go from a lv 14 druid with 6/6/6/5/3/2/1 spells to lvl 15 druid with 6/6/6/6/6/6/6 spells. Thats a crazy transition. 3 mil XP With HLAs and I have 6 spots to use them! A bit different than a mage with 1 or 2 level 9 spots or a cleric with 3 level 7 spots (from memory I may be mistaken). Yeah they take a little work but once you reach those levels they're pretty cool. That's why I think a druid dual'd from fighter at 2 or 3 seems great. Yeah it's cheese that they can grandmaster a weapon, but the fact they can work towards grandmastery while wearing some awesome armor while they work on spellcasting abilities makes them viable choices for charname.

JuliusBorisov

I'm all with @Arunsun on this:

Arunsun said:

At first, play whatever class you like ( in terms of concept, I mean) without paying much attention to all that powergaming.

Do you have a character you gravitate towards? Maybe a sneaky thief? Or a tanky barbarian? Or a ranged fighter?

Have a look on http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/37566/anyone-have-characters-they-gravitate-toward and ask yourself the same question.

Also, druids don't suck, even in BG. They just offer a different style, relying on summons a lot. I've enjoyed playing as a Totemic Druid in both BG1 and BG2: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/30553/the-tale-of-the-totemic-druid#latest

reedmilfam

@Jessica You'd have to keeper to dual from fighter to a kit. As for Grand Mastery, that's only for fighters for a reason. Play-wise, it's to keep fighters from completely falling off. Especially versus magic-based classes, who get stronger with levels. RP-wise, it's because your class takes time for training/practicing/studying, and doesn't leave time to become a true master of a weapon.

Nonnahswriter

bengoshi said:

Also, druids don't suck, even in BG. They just offer a different style, relying on summons a lot. I've enjoyed playing as a Totemic Druid in both BG1 and BG2: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/30553/the-tale-of-the-totemic-druid#latest

Not to mention they get Insect Plague. Ohhh Insect Plague... How did I ever survive without you?

One of my favorite runs of BG2 was with a Kensai/Druid, dualed at level 9.