@SionIV Hexxat doesn't fail because the themes/tropes/ideas she's based on are unmarriageable - she fails because she's written badly.
Whoever wrote her needs to take a step back, and analyze what they did wrong.
I'm not hating on the person, only the abysmal quality of their work. It's somewhat understandable, given the amount of pressure Beamdog was under, and how tight their deadlines were. All of them probably wore a dozen (or more) hats during development, shuffling through the days in a puffy haze of caffeine and stress. But good writing requires many re-writes, which they now have the luxury of pursuing.
@SionIV Hexxat doesn't fail because the themes/tropes/ideas she's based on are unmarriageable - she fails because she's written badly.
Exactly so. There's nothing fundamentally wrong with the notion of a vampire thief - hell, statistically speaking you'd have a better chance of bumping into one of those in Athkatla than, say, a drow or a Thayan. What failed here was the execution.
I thought the Valen mod was a pretty interesting vampire thief. Some of the mechanics were OP, but you can get around those if you choose to do so. Always appreciated the push towards evil since I don't naturally lean that direction in my play thoughs.
A dark skinned lesbian vampire in a game where every single vampire is evil and trying to kill you, I'll have to disagree there. Why didn't they add an albino gay drow male instead, oh wait ...
A dark skinned lesbian vampire in a game where every single vampire is evil and trying to kill you, I'll have to disagree there. Why didn't they add an albino gay drow male instead, oh wait ...
*clicks stopwatch* Aaaaaand there's the racist/homophobic combo. Right on schedule.
I thought the Valen mod was a pretty interesting vampire thief. Some of the mechanics were OP, but you can get around those if you choose to do so. Always appreciated the push towards evil since I don't naturally lean that direction in my play thoughs.
Valen really needs a modern remake - I feel like, with the benefit of time, writing experience and all the new stuff added to the EEs, she could end up being a great addition to the game.
I'm neither a racist or homophobic, if that was what you were pointing at. I just find it a highly peculiar combination in a game like Baldur's Gate, especially once you throw in the vampire card on top of it. I do apologize if someone find my post offending, that was not my intention.
There are many problems with Hexxat. The fact that she's black and/or the fact that she's a lesbian aren't among those problems.
Doesn't help the snowflake syndrome or make her fit into the world any easier. Anyway I won't derail this thread anymore, I'll keep my Hexxat musings for myself.
Valen really needs a modern remake - I feel like, with the benefit of time, writing experience and all the new stuff added to the EEs, she could end up being a great addition to the game.
Valen was a game breaker. However I must admit that the idea was superb. A remake? Perhaps. A total rewrite? More likely.
It's somewhat telling that this thread, whose OP is focusing on what Baldur's Gate game is (Baldur's Gate it is!), slowly moved to Hexxat discussion.
I'm sure that this best illustrates the most debated thing about the EEs as they are now. Before maybe one of the most debated things about the EEs was the quality of the release. Now when many bugs have been fixed, the Hexxat theme is number one among when it comes to evaluating the Beamdog's work.
I hope that when SoD is released, the people's focus will move and in the same time new stories and NPCs from SoD won't cause similar problems. It has to be one of the most important aims - to offer BG fans stories that can be talked about and not only heavily criticized.
Well, @bengoshi, that's the problem with empty praise - if it's undeserved, there's going to be backlash. Beamdog hasn't yet earned the right to be pointing at other games as false successors to Baldur's Gate, not based on what they've put out so far. If SoD changes that, more power to them, but they're not there right now.
Personally I think they deserve a fair bit of praise. They've poured a lot of man hours and dollars into bringing these games to modern systems so that countless more people can enjoy them once again and old hands like many of us can at last comfortably use them on a modern setup. Needless to say I didn't see anyone slowing down on their endless crusade for flashier graphics and faster paced action to work on these old titles.
I can see where he is coming from, every time there is a new RPG they're always mentioning how they're a successor to Baldur's Gate when many of them have nothing in common. In many cases they aren't even in the same setting. They might not have mastered everything they're doing yet but they are at least keeping the engine, the setting, the characters and the world alive, which I think is worthy of praise.
Valen really needs a modern remake - I feel like, with the benefit of time, writing experience and all the new stuff added to the EEs, she could end up being a great addition to the game.
Valen was a game breaker. However I must admit that the idea was superb. A remake? Perhaps. A total rewrite? More likely.
I didn't find it gamebreaking where you have her wield daggers instead of using the overpowered level drain. I thought the dialogue was not overwhelming the PC or plot and the occasions where she inserted herself into the plot to be a positive to the experience (particularly since it wasn't something that happened all the time). In short, the character was overpowered but I thought it was interesting and enjoyable.
Gameplay-wise, the mod had an option of granting level drain immunity to all sorts of enemies, while giving others Protection from Undead - that went a long way towards balancing Valen's claws. There were still bugs due to how the engine worked back then, but it would probably be a lot more streamlined with the EE improvements.
Story-wise, there were really only two points of contention I recall from her plotline: her interference in Ust Natha (because if you go to all that trouble to take Ardulace and Phaere out, the least Valen could do is let you enjoy it!) and the Vampire Hunters encounter, which was completely ridiculous and tone-deaf.
With a few tweaks and cuts, she'd be perfect for an Evil EE run. And with Weimer having basically relinquished control of his mods, she's pretty much up for grabs.
It has been too long so I don't remember the specifics of what you are referencing in Ust Natha, but I agree the Vampire Hunters encounter was deliberately silly and didn't fit the tone of the rest of the mod at all. It could be redone fairly easily so it is scaled back in difficulty (Weimer liked working up some ridiculous encounters that were like SCS on a game breaking level) and reworked to be much more in keeping with the story (change their identities, etc.).
If you trick both Ardulace and Phaere with fake dragon eggs, Valen will force you to surrender the real eggs to the demon in exchange for two magic items - neither of which will help against the silver dragon you just pissed off. It's one of those moments where I understand the concept, but the loss of agency is happening at exactly the wrong place, after you've just set up this epic triple-cross.
If you trick both Ardulace and Phaere with fake dragon eggs, Valen will force you to surrender the real eggs to the demon in exchange for two magic items - neither of which will help against the silver dragon you just pissed off. It's one of those moments where I understand the concept, but the loss of agency is happening at exactly the wrong place, after you've just set up this epic triple-cross.
Comments
Hexxat doesn't fail because the themes/tropes/ideas she's based on are unmarriageable - she fails because she's written badly.
Whoever wrote her needs to take a step back, and analyze what they did wrong.
I'm not hating on the person, only the abysmal quality of their work. It's somewhat understandable, given the amount of pressure Beamdog was under, and how tight their deadlines were. All of them probably wore a dozen (or more) hats during development, shuffling through the days in a puffy haze of caffeine and stress. But good writing requires many re-writes, which they now have the luxury of pursuing.
Hopefully, they'll make us proud with SoD.
A remake? Perhaps. A total rewrite? More likely.
I'm sure that this best illustrates the most debated thing about the EEs as they are now. Before maybe one of the most debated things about the EEs was the quality of the release. Now when many bugs have been fixed, the Hexxat theme is number one among when it comes to evaluating the Beamdog's work.
I hope that when SoD is released, the people's focus will move and in the same time new stories and NPCs from SoD won't cause similar problems. It has to be one of the most important aims - to offer BG fans stories that can be talked about and not only heavily criticized.
I can see where he is coming from, every time there is a new RPG they're always mentioning how they're a successor to Baldur's Gate when many of them have nothing in common. In many cases they aren't even in the same setting. They might not have mastered everything they're doing yet but they are at least keeping the engine, the setting, the characters and the world alive, which I think is worthy of praise.
Story-wise, there were really only two points of contention I recall from her plotline: her interference in Ust Natha (because if you go to all that trouble to take Ardulace and Phaere out, the least Valen could do is let you enjoy it!) and the Vampire Hunters encounter, which was completely ridiculous and tone-deaf.
With a few tweaks and cuts, she'd be perfect for an Evil EE run. And with Weimer having basically relinquished control of his mods, she's pretty much up for grabs.
Agreed on that one with the big build up and agency developed for the player.
I like the interjection in other places.