Using a PnP style Character in BG
Sharguild
Member Posts: 186
Many folk have played DnD PnP (Core Rules 2nd Ed) and found that rolling your stats provided you with a character as far removed from BG as could be imagined.
I focus on 2nd Ed because that is what BG is/was based on.
We rolled characters so flawed at times, we had no idea how they could possibly survive to level 2 let alone 20.
I was curious if any have utilized that concept to develop their PC in BG.
I have.
It is certainly not the same thing, as you do not have other humans involved to make the whole experience worthwhile but it certainly makes for an interesting game.
I've rolled stupid strong Mages with an Intel of 13, Clerics with awesome Dex and Wis of 12 and Rangers so thick they need a map to find the exit to an outhouse.
Well, interesting is one way to put it. Frustrating is another.
Main problem I find is that the PC is just not suitable sometimes to continue.
You can only lean on your NPCs so much I found and your PC needs to be able to step up to the plate.
I never finished a game with a flawed stats PC but I never over-powered one either.
Curious what others have attempted.
I focus on 2nd Ed because that is what BG is/was based on.
We rolled characters so flawed at times, we had no idea how they could possibly survive to level 2 let alone 20.
I was curious if any have utilized that concept to develop their PC in BG.
I have.
It is certainly not the same thing, as you do not have other humans involved to make the whole experience worthwhile but it certainly makes for an interesting game.
I've rolled stupid strong Mages with an Intel of 13, Clerics with awesome Dex and Wis of 12 and Rangers so thick they need a map to find the exit to an outhouse.
Well, interesting is one way to put it. Frustrating is another.
Main problem I find is that the PC is just not suitable sometimes to continue.
You can only lean on your NPCs so much I found and your PC needs to be able to step up to the plate.
I never finished a game with a flawed stats PC but I never over-powered one either.
Curious what others have attempted.
3
Comments
I've played PnP styled chars a couple of times, using a web-page roller (I don't have any dice), but usually I lose interrest since the RPG part in BG is less than in a PnP game. The game is very combat-heavy and if my charname is weak, I tend to lose interrest and suffer from restartitis.
I just love these more honestly offbeat characters. I have also recreated whole parties of characters, or often characters who were partners of some sort in PnP; best friends, siblings, spouses.
These characters are often much weaker than characters created FOR BG. No doubt the fact you can choose your class first, then point shift 1 for 1 (it was 2 for 1 in most PnP I've played; and in my own setting its only allowed make MINIMUM scores for a class).
But in BG its not too crippling. One party I have going now is husband and wife paladins, with the only bonus between them being from constitution for the man. But you still get to recruit the rest of your party. So fill in the party and give them a good team, and let the charismatic couple lead; that works for me!
It makes a much bigger difference in IWD. An all PnP inspired party may be very underpowered. I love it!
I was lucky with Dex 17, Con 15, Cha 12 and the other 10 or 11. I think it makes perfect sense for a halfling to have low strength and I gave him daggers to make it more challenging. I think it's good to have a more normal character, as it makes your party member's abilities more interesting. He still has the highest % of kill in the party. My party is pretty light on warriors, with Coran being my only one. I decided to pick all the guys I never really tried (Coran, Alora and Quayle).
However Shadowdancers have some pretty high minimum stats requirements compared to other classes, so anything I rolled would have been easily playable. But also different races get very different minimum requirements on the same class.
17, 16, 15, 14, 13, 12.
Arrange as desired, but you cannot move points.
Apply bonuses/penalties of chosen race/class
Races:
Halfling: -1 Str, +1 dex (the 17 wis is a maximum allowed to pick the race, not a penalty)
Elf: +1 Dex, -1 Con
Dwarf; +1 Con, -2 Cha (the 17 dex is a maximum allowed to pick the race, not a penalty)
Gnome: +1 int, -1 Wis
Half-orc: +1 str, +1 Con, -1 Int, -2 cha (Half-orcs, if done properly, are supposed to have a minimum of 13 Con and a maximum of 14 Wis and 12 Cha to pick the race, but since the humanoids book is notoriously bad, I'll leave it up to you if you decided to follow that rule)
Classes:
Avenger: -2 Str, -2 Con
You MUST meet the minimum requirements for your class.
It guarantees you have good but not great stats and allows you to resist the temptation of re-rolling, and you can dual-class as almost anything except a druid, which will require you to get at least 1 stat manual first.
I guess normally I'd be up for roleplaying type stat rolls, but in Baldur's Gate sadly a lot of those stats go un-utilized in actual gameplay (unlike Fallout 1 & 2 for example where Charisma, Intelligence, and the Speech skill have various effects on dialogue for more roleplay). What I mean is that there seems to be little difference between a stat of 14 and a stat of 7 or 8 aside from Strength and carrying weight, and the use of some equipment.
It's not really until your stat reaches 15 where you start to see some benefits coming from it, but a lot of the stats from say 10 to 14 hardly have much of an effect or change. Which is why Dorn's Constitution of 14 is annoying cus in 5th Edition he'd get some benefit from an above average Constitution like that but with something like the 2nd Edition Baldur's Gate way of doing things he doesn't really get anything out of it. So I guess it's why I feel the need for some stats to be higher for my PC, otherwise the actual effect on the game from my stats is more minimal if they're spread out as 14s across the board, just below that threshold where they start to do much. It's just the way the game is programmed and the way 2nd Edition D&D was handled. You also don't get little fun things like dumb dialogue similar to the Fallout games for some humor and hilarity (unless someone went through the effort of making a mod simulating that).
All stats were ultimately important in 2nd though the biggest added value came from the Non-combat Proficiency system (a precursor to the skill system in 3rd), which made every stat useful beyond just their combat value, since NCP had to do stat checks in order to determine their success rate and every NCP had a penalty of some degree that lowered your effective stat level and thus success chance.
Also high int resulted in a lot of bonus starting NCP points, so a high int warrior could make up for less then steller combat stats by branching out into other areas possibly even buying from a non-proficient skill pool since they could afford the 3x proficiency cost (this was also the primary strength of the bard...they had regular costs to every pool except Priest and had the highest amount of natural NCP point progression of any class (ONLY applied to True Bards however, the kits usually only had General/Rogue or occasionally General/Rogue/Warrior).
Though even by base rules there are A LOT of value to stats that simply aren't being used, Con especially, since Con determined whether or not you could be resurrected or not (and being rezed by any method except Reincarnation (which had it's own penalty to deal with) reduced your Con by 1 making it harder and harder to survive), and if you could survive being modified by transmutation effects (though immunity was acquired fairly quickly, around 14 or so, where as Res survival needed like 24 Con to reach immunity to survival rolls). And if you had 19+ you could start getting a bonus vs poisons.
I just ctrl-8 and ditch the spares.
My current Half-Elf Cleric/Mage has S12, D15, C13, I17, W16, Ch14.... Strong enough, but nothing dazzling.