Tales of a Bloody Blade (Pseudo-Fighter/Mage, Poor Bloke's-Mage/Thief also known as the Fake-Gish)
Skarose
Member Posts: 247
So, I was thinking about trying the "Blade" out. I'm an old Baldur's gate veteran, but yes, I'm one of those olde-school PnP D&D players who has never cared for bards. They've always seemed capable of contributing to the success of an overall party, but stand alone they are very mediocre, this coupled with the fact that I've always been a big fan of Fighter/Mages and or Mage/Thieves, so I've never really had the itch to play a Bard before.
I was thinking about playing a minimal to small party BGEE campaign, where my MainChar Blade was both the Arcanist and Melee specialist.
I was curious what this community thought about alignment/flavor/theme for a first time Blade(Bard) run?
Should he be Good, Neutral or Evil?
What weapons should he use?
What NPCs would you try and recruit?
I was thinking about playing a minimal to small party BGEE campaign, where my MainChar Blade was both the Arcanist and Melee specialist.
I was curious what this community thought about alignment/flavor/theme for a first time Blade(Bard) run?
Should he be Good, Neutral or Evil?
What weapons should he use?
What NPCs would you try and recruit?
Post edited by Skarose on
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Comments
Nah, part of my interest in playing a Blade would be the particular challenge of the run. Setting up the Blade with buffs, debuffs and battlefield control to where he filled the effective melee role for the minimal/small party.
For weapons, you can't go wrong with Long Swords. You'll be able to use a couple of the best one-handed weapons in the game, and you can import The Burning Earth into BG2 to give you a weapon that can hit at an effective +4 from the get-go (handy for beating Mantles and demi-liches). Scimitars are also a good pick regardless of whether you kill Drizzt or not, as you can pick up a couple of +2s without much hassle and in BG2 you'll likely want to use Belm and the Scarlet Ninja-to.
If you have a high enough base strength, consider taking Dagger proficiency, as the Dagger of Venom is an excellent weapon, and throwing daggers are a good ranged option if you can manage the encumbrance. At any rate, you'll definitely want to start with a ranged proficiency to carry you through the levels where you don't have the spells to buff for melee. As a Bard you can take your pick out of all of them, so consider the party you plan on taking and whether or not there's someone to use all the good ranged weapons in the game. That said, I've been on a dart kick recently, and I'd recommend it if you don't have any particular preferences. It's nice having someone in the party who can toss Darts of Wounding with a decent thac0 at spellcasters.
As far as party goes, there aren't any NPCs who have any particular synergy with a Blade PC. That said, if you normally avoid using Xan or Dynaheir as your mages, this might be a good opportunity to pick one of them up, as your Blade can fill in the gaps in their spellcasting. Kivan or Coran might be interesting choices (Montaron/Shar-teel if you're evil), as they are competent in both melee and ranged combat. They can tank at times when your Blade is hanging back and shooting, but can switch to ranged and fall back at times when your Blade is buffed up and ready to run into melee. If you're running with a minimal party, Coran/Montaron can even do double duty as the trap finder/lock picker.
For a really minimal party, you could do Coran and Branwen/Yesclick, relying on your Blade's spellcasting and wand usage to make up for the lack of a mage. You'd probably want to use BG1NPC's option to open up the first Cloakwood area from the start for that, so you wouldn't have to wait so long to recruit Coran. For a more evil party, you could do Montaron, Xzar, and Viconia, or even drop Viconia and dual-class Xzar to Cleric by using a Tome on him.
"For a really minimal party, you could do Coran and Branwen/Yesclick, relying on your Blade's spellcasting and wand usage to make up for the lack of a mage. You'd probably want to use BG1NPC's option to open up the first Cloakwood area from the start for that, so you wouldn't have to wait so long to recruit Coran. For a more evil party, you could do Montaron, Xzar, and Viconia, or even drop Viconia and dual-class Xzar to Cleric by using a Tome on him. " ~Kaigen
@Kaigen Yeah, part of the campaign I'm envisioning would have my "Blade" MainChar be the sole Arcanist in the party, at least for BG1EE. I'm thinking one or two NPC cleric healers and a thief NPC(3 or 4 person party)
I thought of a solo run, but I find solo runs less challenging than a small party run.
Have a seat, warm your bones by the fire and tell us your thoughts on the campaign...
The BG bard is very different from the PnP version. In BG, bards have unmatched versatility - they have average stats in everything and can use just about anything in a game world where you can store the fireball - one of the most powerful spells in the game - in a small pointy stick.
The trick is to find just the right combination of skills/gear that can allow your bard to fight just as competently as a fighter, nuke stuff just as well as a mage, steal equipment just as a thief would or do just enough of everything to overwhelm your opponents. This is particularly important if you want to play a blade, which represents the martial aspect of the bard class. Compare to skalds and jesters, which can theoretically get by with being naked and just singing/casting spells. These kits represent the minstrel aspect of the bard class.
Rule of thumb, use weapons with high APR. In late game, use Melf's Minute Meteors and Offensive Spin. That combo can give even plain fighters a run for their money.
BTW the vanilla bard/blade song removes and protects from fear. Considering how many low level casters in BG love casting the Horror spell, use this to your advantage.
That said, I'd try to steer away from throwing daggers and aim for something such as Crossbows. Remember, offensive spin maximizes damage rolls and adds an extra attack. That's 1d8(x3 chances) in BGEE, before magical ammunition, using the light crossbow of speed.
If you're interested, here is my "planned" progression for my own bard.
Lvl 1: Longsword, Crossbow
Lvl 4: TWF
Lvl 8: TWF
Lvl 12: Shortsword (Can now run Kudane in the offhand)
Lvl 16: Prolly finish out TWF
While speed weapons would be preferable, and katanas and scimitars both have good cases for them. Personally I just prefer how the Longsword/Shortsword combo looks, and it's not like there are bad options available.
Scimitars are also a good choice (hate how they look + my bard runs with Jaheria). Katanas have some nice options (Celestial and Dak'kons), but they aren't until BG2EE.
Eventually you should be able to get your 1 pip in almost every bladed weapon if you'd like to, by the end of ToB.
A hearty thank you to all my fellow forumites ( @Kaigen , @Nuin and @Dragonspear ) who gave me such good and well informed advice(and the good humored @fischsemmel ) I'll let you all know how this particular campaign unfolds
I actually considered a blade for my latest bg1 game, but was playing 2 player multiplayer with a buddy who had never done bg1 before so I ended up fighter/thief
Have fun!
I always advocate choosing scimis and/or shortswords for blades since the lack of APR (if you want to continue into SoA) is the only drawback of the class. Personally I prefer to have both, but if choosing one I'd argue that scimis are superior since you get wakiz and ninja-to's for free and that will open up options in the long run.
There are good scimis in BG1 (rashad's) even if you don't want to kill a certain drow and I agree with @Dragonspear that xbows is a very good option for ranged. The army schythe is one of my favorite weapons in BG1 and it's available in SoA as well. Both darts and daggers are good options, dagger since they give access to both melee and throwing options (ie poison daggers vs mages with PfMW, the boomerang in SoA etc) but you will not have a plethora of pips to distribute, so choose one ranged option than stick to TWF and melee weapons.
In the end you will miss the APR, should you not choose that option. Adding Belm and using something like Usuno's blade +4 in the main hand (fairly easily accessable from 1 floor watcher's) + offensive spin + stoneskin + tenser's etc will make the blade a melee powerhouse.
I used to always try and pre-buff Haste/Improved Haste/Tenser's Transformation/etc. back in the day but after a decade or so of playing the game on and off it finally just clicked that all I really needed to do was cast Melf's Minute Meteors + Offensive Spin. Instant +5 weapons, 5 APR, ranged attack, maximum damage per attack, good meteor count thanks to high bard levels, does a bit of fire damage that goes through Stoneskin, now available as early as BG1, makes the max THAC0 progression classes' collective jaws drop for a few seconds.
It's only when I really need more damage/To Hit (usually "boss" fights, like dragons) that I start using more buffs/drink unique potions. In ToB when warriors start getting flashy with their Whirlwinds/Greater Whirlwinds I simply summon Mislead/Simulacrum images and have them use Enhanced Bard Song to up my damage output to a comparable value.
So in the end, I'm fine with using Kundane/Belm/the Scarlet Ninja-To in BG2. You don't need +3 or better items most of the time. Darts are fine because of the unique darts and the default 3 APR, but I prefer longbows due to the sheer number and variety of powerful enchanted arrows.
While I agree, Scims do give you additional weapons to choose from with their proficiency, I believe that's mitigated by the sheer volume longswords. Particularly since you can have a specialized longsword for most enemies. Usually you can get them earlier and they're less of a hassle.
Example: While 2 Rashad's Talons in BGEE are nice, you can also use Varscona (who realistically, only khalid and possibly shar-teel will want as well), as well as Flametongue.
But, I'm also not a fan of how they look in game. Also, I feel your weapon profs are only particularly limiting until about lvl 12. Then you have 2 in TWF, a melee and a ranged or a melee and melee/ranged hybrid.
My issue with darts and daggers (although I did use daggers in 1 BGEE run..........and might again. Shut up Shar-teel, I'm the PC I get whatever weapons I want), is that they're only 1d4, so realistically, you don't gain AS much from maximizing their damage with offensive spin.
True, there are a plethora of great longswords and in BG1 it doesn't matter since there are no +APR weapons. So if playing only BG1, I wouldn't argue with you but thinking about the long run, I still think scimis are the better choice for all non-fighter classes. I fully agree, though, the look of scimis on a character is hideous!
Your point about daggers and off.spin, having lower hit die, is valid. But since daggers get STR bonus (edit: I mean throwing daggers), they are still a good choice and remain a competable choice throughout the game(s).
And thematically, especially with an evil bard. I love the idea of DWing Varscona and Dagger of Venom. I just also hate how heavy/inventory management for the daggers. Making me consider going back though.
And I will definitely agree that Belm/Kundane is the best combo, I'm just not a personal fan of that flavor
And my blade at least (lest I reroll her back to daggers), will have jaheria with her for scimitars anyway
Kinda tempted to restart my evil Blade with Longsword and Dagger though. A bard really is possibly the best compliment to an evil party.
Herm.....that's for another thread. I won't hijack this one
Super easy. I would always get bored around bg what with more wands and those exploding fireball arrows available. Between those arrows of biting, and drizzts gear a dual wield / wandy/ arrowy blade is super OP. Add in that hes lvl 10 and fireballs and skull traps are murdering everything. Definitely a fun class to play if ur sick of vanilla classes or standard f/m
Upon the restart, I decided Styx(Blade MainChar) would just use scimitars and Two Weapon Fighting. I avoided Imoen in the beginning and made a B-line staright to Shar-Teel. I recruited her, had some bloody adventures and got her to 3rd level and put a proficiency pip in Long Bows and immediately dual-classed her to thief. She finds, removes traps, opens locks and sets snares and is a support Comp Long Bow archer to boot, Styx handles the Melee duties. We then found a certain dark-skinned beauty being persecuted by some racist, misogynist thugs and helped her escape, she joined our little band and she whispered tales of another dark-skinned swordsman with powerful magic scimitars, so we hunted him down and he proved too weak to maintain ownership of his powerful items and subsequently, Styx got a powerful scimitar and some really nice traveling chain mail. Styx and the girls went back and found his stepsister and she volunteered to help us (I had Imoen put all her points in Detect Illusion and then I dual classed her to mage.)
Right now, the four of us are wandering the Sword Coast having bloody adventures. We haven't started the main quest, but I am having fun with fluctuating reputation, some times Viconia and Shar Teel are calling me an idiot and other times Imoen is calling us riff raff. It's getting fun, now I have multiple Offensive Spins and Vic can chant for a greater to hit bonus. I picture Styx as a charming, under the table sort of fellow who likes portraying himself as a deadly swordsman and a dark romantic poet. Urbane and polite, he enjoys the company of women and prefers their cooperative natures to the ego-centric, and petty rivalries of other male adventurers. I also imagine he relishes the idea of some of his enemies being sexist and underestimating Styx the poet and his lady mercenaries.
Here is Styx and the girls in the Cloud Peaks, murdering some lumber men and taking their stuff. I'll post another update after I start the Main Quest .
"Oh drat, whom is the devil that keeps sending these paltry opponents to die at our hands? I suppose someday we'll have to look into finding out the reasons behind this, but for now there are dark deeds and hoards of treasure to acquire. Styx has discovered he has expensive tastes. Only the best will do for he and the ladies!"
Neera was a little too flaky for our group and Dorn was a dreadful bore so we ditched them both pretty quickly. We ended up recruiting Rasaad and managed to find out about a Sharite stronghold hidden in the Cloudpeaks. Viconia believes the Sharites will have stockpiled any treasure they have recently captured and the base being secret, who is to know if a band of marauders were to raid and the loot the place? Vicky also believes that if these Sharites aren't strong and clever enough to protect themselves from marauders, then it is Shar's will that we get their loot!
Styx and the Ladies have gotten to Baldur's Gate City and have ditched Rasaad, he's probably a little too goody two shoes for the blood soaked road we have ahead. Styx has acquired a few more tomes and his Stats are increasing.
Styx only ever seems to use offensive spin. He uses it all the time, to this point, he's only ever used defensive spin twice. Probably due to my party make up and play style. Styx has 90% Fire Resistance, so he likes tanking mobs and then dropping a fireball at his own feet, offensive spin finishes 'em all off after they've been singed!
I'm having fun with this run and find that a Bard(Blade) needs to utilize every trick he can in order to hit his enemies, especially with him being the primary melee specialist, between his familiar's Glass Dust, Vicky's Bless and Chant and Offensive Spin, he does a pretty efficient/scary job of it. Can't wait to try out Melf's Minute Meteors.
Oh well, time to leave the civilized environs of Baldur's Gate and journey south to the Cloudpeaks. Dark, fell and bloody deeds await...