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It's... confusion that leads to clarity!

chuukoguchuukogu Member Posts: 40
Some months ago, I read an article about D&D: 5th edition. It was a semi-compherensive look into the insides of the game, describing how it differs from earlier editions. There was something about the article that was left nagging inside my brain. I couldn't quite put my finger on it at the time, but it was not some minor detail in the article itself, as I initially suspected. It's funny how you can have a blind spot, especially when the answer is right in front of your eyes. However, the feeling of unease and confusion, ie. the lack of complacency, is often beneficial.

As I understand, when D&D first came about (I think it was in the 70s or so), the computers back then were but a shadow of greater things to come. Graphics and sounds, while functional, were hardly enough to convey a sense of adventure. There is no denying that the game systems and mechanics were as elegant as possible, considering that they were created not for computer games, but for the PnP format - pen, paper, dice. Combined with flavours borrowed from Tolkien, it's easy to see why D&D in particular become popular. I see the term PnP thrown around in discussions about actual computer role playing games. It is a novel way of reminding people of the humble beginnings of D&D. The advantages of PnP are questionable, however: instead of slaying a village of orcs, your party can actually debate the matter for 15 minutes, and then just slay the village of orcs. But is that enough for the modern gamer?

The D&D system, regardless of which edition(s) is used as basis for a video game, still works. For example, spell memorization is an interesting balancing mechanic that prevents spellcasters from being overpowered. There are games which benefit from the more recent spell/skill cooldown system, but for many games, there is no substitute for good old Vancian magic. Dungeons and Dragons (and role playing games in general) have met very important goals, and it's all thanks to the advances made in electronic platform. I can identify three important steps:

1) The computer: Even the most rudimentary computers can handle all the calculations (see thac0 and such) of a rpg system, so developing a computer game based on D&D was already a huge advancement. The elimination of the dungeon master and physical dice reminds me of the idiom "you can't make an omelette without breaking some eggs!"
2) The advanced sound & graphics cards: Even the most advanced game mechanic is next to useless without proper audiovisual representation, if you want to depict an actual game world and action. Today, these tools are invaluable to game developers, namely sound designers and artists.
3) The internet: Online role playing games are very popular and in constant state of evolution. It's like the slogan of Los Pollos Hermanos - something for everyone! Some games actually revive the role of the dungeon master! If that is not the necromantic achievement of the century, then what is? It seems that nothing is impossible!

So then! I did identify my confusion regarding the article I mentioned.
In this age of technology, why have multiple new editions of D&D have been released at all? Can't new rules and content be implemented without the throwbacks from the past? Does nostalgia really sell? We have cars that run on fuel and/or electricity now, we don't need steam engines anymore. And we've got computers now!

Comments

  • gorgonzolagorgonzola Member Posts: 3,864
    I am not a gamer outside BG2, and I had only played one of the modern computer games. Not one of the last ones, but one in which you see a 3D world from the eyes of your toon and you move him and really control what he do, as much as a keyboard and a mouse let you do.
    There you (or the pc for you) don't roll a dice, your real life reflexes let you be a good or bad fighter.
    There is a lot more immersion in that approach, not as it would be with a proper VR equipment, but you are really in the game, somehow in IE games you watch a movie where the toons you control move and do things, but you only say them to do it, don't really do it yourself through them.
    Fantastic, but I still prefer the old BG2, that was a season, BG2 is a lifetime love.

    I think that is because D&D was invented to be played around a table, with a dice and PnP. So is a turn based game, even if in CRPG version is a fake real time game. And is based on player's choices, not reflexes, is a chess game, not Pac Man. I hope you understad what I mean. This modern world is too much information, too speedy. Playng BG2 in more similar to sit near the fireplace and play chess game with a friend than sit in a fast car and run.
    Is not steam engine, is a gig hauled by horses, and is a lot more satisfying look the landscape (the huge tactical complexity) from a gig then look the asphalt from a technological super car.

    those are only my 2 cents.
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    chuukogu said:

    The advantages of PnP are questionable, however: instead of slaying a village of orcs, your party can actually debate the matter for 15 minutes, and then just slay the village of orcs. But is that enough for the modern gamer?

    That depends. Is the modern gamer a moron with the attention span of a gnat?
    In this age of technology, why have multiple new editions of D&D have been released at all?
    The publisher needed to sell books to make money.
    Can't new rules and content be implemented without the throwbacks from the past? Does nostalgia really sell? We have cars that run on fuel and/or electricity now, we don't need steam engines anymore. And we've got computers now!
    Given the popularity of restored steam railways and collectors of classic cars, nostalgia sells massively well.

    A steam train has a soul, modern trains are boxes with electric motors.
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455

    I am not a gamer outside BG2, and I had only played one of the modern computer games. Not one of the last ones, but one in which you see a 3D world from the eyes of your toon and you move him and really control what he do, as much as a keyboard and a mouse let you do.
    There you (or the pc for you) don't roll a dice, your real life reflexes let you be a good or bad fighter.
    There is a lot more immersion in that approach, not as it would be with a proper VR equipment, but you are really in the game, somehow in IE games you watch a movie where the toons you control move and do things, but you only say them to do it, don't really do it yourself through them.
    Fantastic, but I still prefer the old BG2, that was a season, BG2 is a lifetime love.

    I think that is because D&D was invented to be played around a table, with a dice and PnP. So is a turn based game, even if in CRPG version is a fake real time game. And is based on player's choices, not reflexes, is a chess game, not Pac Man. I hope you understad what I mean. This modern world is too much information, too speedy. Playng BG2 in more similar to sit near the fireplace and play chess game with a friend than sit in a fast car and run.
    Is not steam engine, is a gig hauled by horses, and is a lot more satisfying look the landscape (the huge tactical complexity) from a gig then look the asphalt from a technological super car.

    those are only my 2 cents.

    Good insight. I like both chess and Pac Man for different things.
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,754
    chuukogu said:

    Some months ago, I read an article about D&D: 5th edition. It was a semi-compherensive look into the insides of the game, describing how it differs from earlier editions.

    Can you find it? Because this topic is very interesting for me.
    chuukogu said:


    In this age of technology, why have multiple new editions of D&D have been released at all? Can't new rules and content be implemented without the throwbacks from the past? Does nostalgia really sell? We have cars that run on fuel and/or electricity now, we don't need steam engines anymore. And we've got computers now!

    The thing with new editions of D&D, and the 5E in particular, is a HUGE difference from previous editions. You can't simply edit/remove/add several paragraphs here and there and get a new version. The changes are fundamental.

    And, you know, I like new rule books. They're awesome to read, they have awesome illustrations. I will be happy if I got a printed version.

    To me, no matter what the computer progress is. I will always need those rule books on my shelf.
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