Evil assassin party
Riderat
Member Posts: 136
Hey!
First of all - I searched in forums and google for similar questions but I couldn't find one, therefore a new topic.
I've recently started a new play-trough with an evil assassin. Not completely evil, but she is kind to the people that are kind to her and deadly to anyone who tries to cross her path or intimidate her.
I am planning to roll with as less npc's as possible (4 seems as an optimal number) for a complete, full saga run. So far my party consists of Dorn, Viconia and Edwin. This party is quite enough, since it has a main tank, cleric and a battle mage and they enable me to be an efficient assassin - backstabbing and poisoning everything and everyone. However, I have realized that the party is missing thief utilities - disarm traps and open lock. On the assassin I have spent all of the points into Hide in Shadows and Move silently (probably not the best decision taking that it's my only possibility to detect traps). Any ideas how to get the trap and lock skills into my party? Maybe I should take another rogue in my party.. Maybe a bard, but iirc bards are not good with disarming traps. Should I really go for a 5 person party, if so, what would be the best npc for the empty position - Imoen, Shar-tel?
Thanks,
R.
First of all - I searched in forums and google for similar questions but I couldn't find one, therefore a new topic.
I've recently started a new play-trough with an evil assassin. Not completely evil, but she is kind to the people that are kind to her and deadly to anyone who tries to cross her path or intimidate her.
I am planning to roll with as less npc's as possible (4 seems as an optimal number) for a complete, full saga run. So far my party consists of Dorn, Viconia and Edwin. This party is quite enough, since it has a main tank, cleric and a battle mage and they enable me to be an efficient assassin - backstabbing and poisoning everything and everyone. However, I have realized that the party is missing thief utilities - disarm traps and open lock. On the assassin I have spent all of the points into Hide in Shadows and Move silently (probably not the best decision taking that it's my only possibility to detect traps). Any ideas how to get the trap and lock skills into my party? Maybe I should take another rogue in my party.. Maybe a bard, but iirc bards are not good with disarming traps. Should I really go for a 5 person party, if so, what would be the best npc for the empty position - Imoen, Shar-tel?
Thanks,
R.
0
Comments
Technically, if you know the game well enough, you don't really *need* open locks and disarm traps. You can use the Knock spell on whatever you can't bash open and as for traps, if you don't remember where they are, you can use the Detect Traps spell and just avoid or tank through them. Generally, some electrical and fire protections should get you by most of them without problems. Other types, like arrow, magic missle, etc. are nothing that a tanky character couldn't handle. For really crucial trap disarms you can use Potions of Perception and/or Potions of Mind Focusing (you get +5% to disarm traps for every point in Dexterity above 17, up to 40% at 25 Dex). It's less convenient, of course, but a perfectly fine way to get through the game.
However, if you want those skills - and I'd really recommend them if you want to do Durlag's Tower - there are some options. If you're already an Assassin, taking another single class Thief feels like a waste, so you could consider a dual- or multi-classed Thief for utilities:
- Montaron or Shar-Teel dualed into Thief would be versatile fighting characters you could develop in any way you want: additional frontliner or ranged.
- Coran, pretty much the best archer in the game, although Good-aligned.
- Tiax for some more clerical spells and, primarily, his Summon Ghast ability.
Also, as a general guideline, in BG1 you only need around 80 in open locks and disarm traps to be successful in most cases. Even in Durlag's Tower most trap detection and disarm difficulty is between 60-80. However, there are a couple of exceptions where you'd need more. I believe there's not a single lock requiring more than 95 open locks. As for traps, there are a few requiring 100 (Durlag's Tower and Thieves Guild). Just mentioning this so that you don't have a feeling like you have to immediately max out those skills.
And I would trade Dorn for Shar-Teel or Kagain in a heartbeat (just wait for the Hands of Takkok - 18/00 to Strenght - if you choose Kagain or stockpile all Potions of Fortitude if you choose Shar-Teel).
Or mix it up. Drop Viconia, get Tiax. Take Shar-Teel and Kagain onboard. Keep Dorn.
Go kick puppies.
You're welcome.
@Raduziel About Viconia, it seems that her 50% magic resist is a biggie, also she has a high wisdom and dexterity, I was planning to give her them Ogre Gauntlets. You advice to kick Viconia, because Tiax is bringing cleric skills to the table? Maybe 2 clerics would be mean a more effective tanking?
Lots of Fighters have a lame Strenght (Kagain, Ajantis, Khalid, ao so it goes). I think giving her the ogre gauntlet is a waste. She can buff herself with DUHM, Holy Power and Righteous Magic when things heat up.
I seldom play an Assassin in BG and my dream team is: Kagain, Shar-Teel, Viconia, Tiax, Edwin, Charname.
Sometimes I trade Edwin for Eldoth because IMHO wizard's spells don't make a big difference in BGEE.
Elf Assassin (stealth, set traps, some DI)
Kagain
Viconia
Imoen, thief dueled at level 6 to mage (takes care of locks and traps)
Quayle or Tiax would also work well, replacing Imoen/Viconia. Montaron could also be great as extra (stealthy) muscle.
Grab Montaron along with your assassin (or a dualed Shar Teel) and equip both with stealth boots and have them both stealth and walk around backstabbing and exploring.
Don't forget to give them points in set trap and go kill Drizzt for his sweet gear.
The only thief that can be used throughout the saga (sorta.. ) is Imoen, so in your case I would either:
A: Bring Imoen and add her to your intended party; 5 members.
B: Bring Imoen as secondary thief, dual class to mage and kick Edwin; 4 members.
Also, and this is very important, don't forget that you can disarm traps and remain invisible. So it's quite reasonable to gulp 4 potions and run through a dungeon detecting and disarming all the traps before sending in the troops.
The only change I would make to your character is Detect Illusion. The invisibility spell (or item or potions) is the assassins best buddy. Even with say 15% in Detect Illusion you can stand next to mages undected for a minute and remove their defenses before attacking.
imoen is a good idea.
you'll still have an empty slot. i would recommend you to try out every NPC (give them a short stint) and see what they have to offer. it's interesting and rewarding.
@Aerakar at level 6 Imoen wouldn't max her skills. She starts with some 25 open locks and 35 find traps. By level 6 you have earned 125points and that means maxing out only one of the skills. But yeah, I guess it's possible to get some potions of thievery to increase the skills. Also, I probably would need someone to deal with the locks/traps while she gets her utilities back..
@Wowo to me they seem more as a utility. I don't see them as good in fights as other classes sadly.
@Skatan oh, the party members are not part of the deal. I'm riding solo. If I will find better peeps to hang out with, then the old ones will have to walk. hah
@Lateralus I didn't quite get the idea about detect illusions. I have never been able to stay in shadows for that long. Also, isn't the amount of potions preset for the whole game? Like, merchants don't have more than 5 invisibility potions and do not restock (this is just an estimate, idk the actual number).
@bob_veng I've done already most of the sidequests for other npc's in different runs.
Maybe I will go back to Friendly Arms Inn, and ask Imoen to return to party. After all, she is my sis.
- Set Traps is an amazing skill that will wipe many enemies away. I recommend 50 points on both thieves.
- Stealth (Hide/MS combined) is a bit of a trap. If you grab stealth boots for each and have good dexterity you can reliably stealth if you activate the ability while standing in a shadow. Later you can add Shadow Armor to boost your Assassin and give Monty Drizzts' chain mail. Once stealthed setup 2 backstabs per fight to really clean up your enemies.
- Open Lock/Detect Traps is skills that I like to split between 2 thieves. Let each one do one of them. You can even go as far as to stop at ~60 in open locks and ~80 in Detect Traps and rely on Thievery and Clarity potions.
- Pick Pockets is another skill I like to invest enough in to steal certain items without fail when I play no reload. Otherwise just keep reloading until successful or chug a couple of thievery potions.
- Detect Illusions I wouldn't bother with unless playing SCS.
Remember that as combatants there is very little difference in BG1 between the classes. It's only at higher levels when warriors superior APR starts to make a big impact. Finally, due to faster thief progression they have very competitive HP and THAC0 in BG1.
So try 2 thieves, get then some good gear and watch as they go to town!
Detect Illusion works just as well at 15% as it does at 100%, from my experience it just takes more time for it to work. Say for example Edwin casts invisibility on you, you can walk around and detect and remove all the traps while remaining unseen. And if there is a mage with Mirror Image just go stand next to him until the illusion is detected and it disappears and then you can backstab.
There are great items to boost stealth in the game. So you have many ways to build your character. If you pump around 40 points into hiding that might be all you need for the entire first game. So you could put a little in detect illusion and still be able to buff up traps and locks so you don't need to rely on potions as much.
or Slam it all into Move Silently (don't raise Hide only Move ! first will not help you walk around while actually hiding is a + of Both Skills to their fullest) and take a Second one Along who leeches XP just for Picking Locks
I prefer first , you get the +Sneak Armor and Boots Kind of Early on if you go for them, giving you just enough to Hide for a Backstab Attempt before a Battle actual scouting can be done by your mage with a Invisible Spell (cheap reliable and not prune to fail while you walk through a Horde of Bandit archers with Ice Arrows ! yuck !)
as for your Party ,
Healers : -Viconia- or -Branwen- , both can be grabbed early on with no problem , Viconia is better with a Sling but her Start HP Suck (but she actually gets the same + per lvl up as branwen) and has 50% MR what allows some good cheese with potions. (laughing at you enemy mages/clerics/nymphs)
(Honorable Mention for Yeslick with Helm of reversed Alignment as Secondary Cleric , he has a Decent Punch with those fighter levels)
Tankline : Dorn Hits like a Truck but can be taxing on your healer. Kagain on the Other hand can be stacked Stupidly with AC and regenerates natural during rest and travel , not to underestimate traveling with few people.
Magefront hands down Edwin is the Best in raw Offensive mage Power and Spells/Day but if you don't like visiting 3 shops to identify your loot you may take Baeloth instead (excellent start gear but you have to be Level 5 to get him so 10k xp on your Thief)
that's your party of 4 , consider to Add a 5th+6th Member once you Crawl over the lets say ~100k XP all your Main character can Look forward here is one more LvL while those 2 Extra Muscle just give more bag space and well uhh Muscle..
As a resident Thief enthusiast, I did play the exact same group as you do. Assassin + Dorn + Viconia + Edwin. Twice
Not having enough points kinda sucks, but you can do without them in 2 ways:
1) specific - drop Edwin, get Imoen, level her up to lvl 6-7 to get maxed out Open Locks and Find Traps and dual her to Mage. Before you know it, she'll be able to sling spells as well as pose as a decent burglar and you can focus on the deadly skills, like Set Snare. Or, if you wish - get her to lvl 3-4 and max out only one thing (Find Traps for example) and get Open Locks for your Assassin to about 70 (read below). It kind of makes sense to keep Imoen around for story continuity.
2) eligible for any Thief in BGEE - remember, that you can temporarily boost your skills. Via potions (can get expensive), but also via tampering with your Dexterity. Your Assassin should already have a high Dexterity, but each +1 point does additional 5%. There's a Dexterity Tome in BG city, right after you get in. That's a +5%
There's a +1 Dexterity buckler for Thieves to be found in BGEE. Another +5%. Draw Upon Holy Might innate ability attained in later chapters (when you keep your reputation a bit higher. Think a villain with good PR) will bump your Dexterity another +2-3 points = +10-15%. With these buffs, you'll get almost +25% to your skills, repeatedly and at will.
And if that is not enough, there are potions that add +20 or more % to each of your skills.
In my experience (I played thru BGEE with each Thief kit except for ShadowDancer, solo or with parties of max 4 chars), about 65-70% of Lock Picking will be enough to open 95% of the chests. You can get the rest of them via Dexterity buffing or mage spell Knock. Traps - if you plan to go to Durlag's Tower, get it to 100%. If not, lower is enough and most traps will just damage your tank (and Vicky will heal that).
don't forget that Durlags tower Traps do not vanish after being Triggered, so your party crawling over a fireball trap might end the party faster as they can say "Fuck"
so before you visit Durlags tower make sure you got 80 Pick lock and 80 Find traps under your belt.
Potion of Perception thief skills +20% for 6 hours can fill the gap, just don't abuse rest after chugging one.
I have not found it an issue to not have her thieving skills from the moment she duals up until about the Cloakwood Mines, which is usually where in my run-throughs she gets enough XP to regain her thief skills.
I gave the Gift of Peace, buckler +1 and Ankheg mail to Viconia and she is like the tankiest npc I have met so far. I didn't believe in it, but Dorn really seems as if he can deliver a good punch, but he can't take one himself, gave him the Brawling hands and now he is somewhat decent when going toe-to-toe with some melee fighters.
Also, about the bracers, say, I have the AC for my main char of 0, if I put bracers of defense AC 7 on her, it doesn't change nothing right? I might as well sell them to the merchant.
Lastly, if anyone has managed to get this far, whats the use of barkskin?
Thanks again!
Riderat
Barkskin: Useless.
The Bracers and Barkskin spell both set your AC so if you have another item that sets it lower then it's useless. Often these are best on a wizard or other character who can't wear armour.
Barkskin improves as you level up and at very high levels can provide very good AC.