Just a note: Beamdog doesn't create a custom patch file for GOG; if GOG uses a patch executable that's entirely offline, it's because they've created one themselves.
Yes Dee, I'm cognizant that GOG creates their own offline install and patch files. Let me ask a more direct (though obviously rhetorical) question (because I'm already fairly sure of the answer), will the DVD that is part of the Collector's Edition have an offline installer? If the answer to that question is yes, then would be fair to assume that the programmers at Beamdog are capable of compiling offline install & patch files that could be used independently of a DVD or other optical media? If this is also true, then would also be fair to assume that the programmers at Beamdog are capable of compiling offline install & patch files that could be used downloaded directly from the Beamdog website and be used to reinstall and/or patch one's lawfully purchased copies of BG:EE and/or SoD? One final question, am I expecting too much in expecting offline patching especially in light of the fact that myself and anyone else who has purchased the Collector's Edition has paid $130 USD + at least $20 USD shipping for a hard copy of the game?
@ValamirCleaver: There's a difference between the SoD CE and the EE DVDs, as the SoD CE is published by Beamdog in house, and thus falls within their responsibility, whereas the EE DVDs are published externally.
I do think it's fair for Beamdog to make sure the CE version can be updated. Admittedly, you also do get a downloadable copy with the game, which of course can be updated the normal way, but it's kind of weird to say: "Look, we gave you these fancy discs to install the game from, but if you want patches, you need to instead use the key that we sent you, and download the game through our client." (Personally, for the last couple of CEs I bought, that is exactly what I did, though: Never touch the discs, but register the key online and download the game, but if you include discs, people should have the option to use the discs and not miss out.)
However, having a "One size fits all" kind of offline patch is quite unlikely to work. Different producers use different folder structures. It's also known that the DVD version has some issues with certain mods because of this. They'd have to dynamically check which file is located where, which could lead to all kinds of problems. It'll take quite a bit of time to ready, and really only applies to people who bought the DVDs, which really is the DVD publisher's responsibility.
Also, how does GoG build the patch installers? How big are their patch installers? Do they actually 'patch' the existing files, or do they simply replace them with newer versions extracted from the patch installer?
If I buy or install a game online that takes several gigabytes, I'm not going to worry about patches that also take several gigabytes. That's only normal. However, if people have a really poor or limited internet connection, and buy the DVD to avoid having to perform big downloads, you can't just shove a 1.4 GB patch down their throat!
I do think it's a little bit different for the CE, because the primary reason to buy the CE is all the extra goodies, whereas the primary reason to buy the DVD is to avoid huge downloads, so I do think they can get away with large updates for the CE version.
It would probably be best if the CE install includes, and is compatible with, the Beamdog installer, so the Beamdog installer can handle the updates for the CE version as if it was a regular download version, but we'll see what the devs come up with. Unfortunately, the CE is way too expensive to buy in the EU, so it won't affect me personally.
In the end: Should they make sure the CE version can be updated? I think so, yes. Should they make sure that the DVD version can be updated or provide offline patches that are compatible with all platforms? Nope, not their responsibility.
I'm not sure if this is relevant but I recently had to re-install everything onto a new computer after my old one died. I started from scratch with BG and only installed my Deep Silver versions of the games. When I then tried to install the XP cap remover and DbG I noticed that the game folders and files are named/arranged differently in the DS versions and these two mods wouldn't work. I managed to get the XP cap remover to work by creating an override folder, but when I finally got DbG to run (in what I thought was the right folder) it just caused the game to crash and I had to uninstall/reinstall.
Even without having a DVD version to play around with, I'd be willing to lay money on this being on the install path rather than the file structure. Windows is awfully protective of the Program Files directories to the point where most new mods--including mine--carry a standard warning that you shouldn't install your game in the Program Files path. That's true for EE games as well as vanilla.
For the record - Obsidians Pillars of Eternity DVD versions also have update issues currently patches are only available up to 2.03 (3.02 is the current patch) and only those backers that got the expansion through their tier have access to the expansion for DVD versions (those of us that just got the Game DVD as part of our tier have no option to purchase the expansions for DVD versions - yet)
My point being that these update issues for DVD versions seem to be prevalent in more than one place these days.
I didn't know about that. Is there any statement from Obsidian anywhere why there is no current up-to-date patch for the DVD backer version?
They are working on it (that's the basic statement) - this thread talks about it - they are apparently having serious issues trying to build the DVD patches.
Comments
I do think it's fair for Beamdog to make sure the CE version can be updated. Admittedly, you also do get a downloadable copy with the game, which of course can be updated the normal way, but it's kind of weird to say: "Look, we gave you these fancy discs to install the game from, but if you want patches, you need to instead use the key that we sent you, and download the game through our client." (Personally, for the last couple of CEs I bought, that is exactly what I did, though: Never touch the discs, but register the key online and download the game, but if you include discs, people should have the option to use the discs and not miss out.)
However, having a "One size fits all" kind of offline patch is quite unlikely to work. Different producers use different folder structures. It's also known that the DVD version has some issues with certain mods because of this. They'd have to dynamically check which file is located where, which could lead to all kinds of problems. It'll take quite a bit of time to ready, and really only applies to people who bought the DVDs, which really is the DVD publisher's responsibility.
Also, how does GoG build the patch installers? How big are their patch installers? Do they actually 'patch' the existing files, or do they simply replace them with newer versions extracted from the patch installer?
If I buy or install a game online that takes several gigabytes, I'm not going to worry about patches that also take several gigabytes. That's only normal. However, if people have a really poor or limited internet connection, and buy the DVD to avoid having to perform big downloads, you can't just shove a 1.4 GB patch down their throat!
I do think it's a little bit different for the CE, because the primary reason to buy the CE is all the extra goodies, whereas the primary reason to buy the DVD is to avoid huge downloads, so I do think they can get away with large updates for the CE version.
It would probably be best if the CE install includes, and is compatible with, the Beamdog installer, so the Beamdog installer can handle the updates for the CE version as if it was a regular download version, but we'll see what the devs come up with. Unfortunately, the CE is way too expensive to buy in the EU, so it won't affect me personally.
In the end: Should they make sure the CE version can be updated? I think so, yes. Should they make sure that the DVD version can be updated or provide offline patches that are compatible with all platforms? Nope, not their responsibility.
My point being that these update issues for DVD versions seem to be prevalent in more than one place these days.
They are working on it (that's the basic statement) - this thread talks about it - they are apparently having serious issues trying to build the DVD patches.
http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/82218-201-dvd-updates-are-live-for-windows-and-linux/page-2