I don't understand why people are making such a big deal out of it. I took it as a joke myself.
Since the beginning of DnD and RPGs, goblins have been the laughing stock of adventures and adventurers. Goblins are known to be evil and/or stupid and being basically cannon fodder with no personality.
The line said by the goblin is this: "So, all goblins look alike to you? That's what you're saying? Racist."
To me, it's simply making fun of that stereotype. Like in PnP, you can make a goblin or such character that isn't stupid or evil and mess with the adventure's NPCs.
PnP example: NPC: It's a goblin! Of course it's evil! PC Goblin: That's racist. Can you prove it? NPC: ...Uhh... PC: Yeah, thought so.
Or:
NPC: You're a halfling. Most likely you're the thief. PC: That's racist. Not all halflings are thieves. Do you have any proof or not?
It's the same analogy. There were many monstrous NPCs that went against the stereotype for comedic reasons. Another example is Deekin from Neverwinter Nights. An atypical Kobold dragon-blooded Bard that sings.
The goblin IS actually correct. It is racist to stereotype them like that. It's also true that Faerun is racist generally. It has to be. It's a matter of survival, not political correctness.
TL;DR: It's a joke that makes fun of the stereotype.
I watched some "let's play Siege of Dragonspear" on you tube, including the transgender conversation. In fact, Mizhena only mentions her strange birth if you ask about it. She does not "ram it down your throat". Gender swap issues are mentioned in the original BG1 where you can get a gender swap belt, so nothing new here. Regarding the writing, the writing in the original BG series was not exactly in Shakespeare's class, fairly juvenile but good fun!! I have no issues there. The bugginess is the only thing that scares me so I will wait a few months before I jump on board with this. The only other thing that worries me is some mention that you cannot re-visit maps or areas that you have already finished. Can someone tell me if this is true? I often "backtracked" in BG1 & 2 and like the freedom of being able to that.
I watched some "let's play Siege of Dragonspear" on you tube, including the transgender conversation. In fact, Mizhena only mentions her strange birth if you ask about it. She does not "ram it down your throat". Gender swap issues are mentioned in the original BG1 where you can get a gender swap belt, so nothing new here. Regarding the writing, the writing in the original BG series was not exactly in Shakespeare's class, fairly juvenile but good fun!! I have no issues there. The bugginess is the only thing that scares me so I will wait a few months before I jump on board with this. The only other thing that worries me is some mention that you cannot re-visit maps or areas that you have already finished. Can someone tell me if this is true? I often "backtracked" in BG1 & 2 and like the freedom of being able to that.
Hello friend. The conceit of this campaign is that you are marching towards a certain location as part of a military force. Naturally things occur and only the heroes can solve a problem before everyone can move forward. Each chapter is basically a few areas that you can freely move between as much as you like but when you solve the main quest for that chapter you march on and theres a whole new set of areas and you can't go back to the previous ones.
In the first BG1 there multiples lines where Montaron are saying almost the same thing when you pick the line where charname say "you a halfling so you musn't do that no ?" and he say something like "you think all halfing are the same ?"
Damn...
People here have play a least one of the game in this serie ?
What I personally find funny with rants like these is that the authors don't even understand the definition of mansplaining. The scene with the little girl has nothing to do with that.
It's like they get upset whenever a non-antagonist character contradicts charname in any way.
The girl says the same thing if you play female too. Maybe she just doesn't like CHARNAME being presumptuous.
In other words, people seem more annoyed by the word itself, no matter that the statement IS correct.
"So, all goblins look alike to you? That's what you're saying? Racist." "So, all goblins look alike to you? That's what you're saying? We're not all the same."
These statements are basically identical and mean the same thing. The former is from the game, the latter was changed to say the same thing with different words.
I don't understand why people are making such a big deal out of it. I took it as a joke myself.
Since the beginning of DnD and RPGs, goblins have been the laughing stock of adventures and adventurers. Goblins are known to be evil and/or stupid and being basically cannon fodder with no personality.
The line said by the goblin is this: "So, all goblins look alike to you? That's what you're saying? Racist."
To me, it's simply making fun of that stereotype. Like in PnP, you can make a goblin or such character that isn't stupid or evil and mess with the adventure's NPCs.
PnP example: NPC: It's a goblin! Of course it's evil! PC Goblin: That's racist. Can you prove it? NPC: ...Uhh... PC: Yeah, thought so.
Or:
NPC: You're a halfling. Most likely you're the thief. PC: That's racist. Not all halflings are thieves. Do you have any proof or not?
It's the same analogy. There were many monstrous NPCs that went against the stereotype for comedic reasons. Another example is Deekin from Neverwinter Nights. An atypical Kobold dragon-blooded Bard that sings.
The goblin IS actually correct. It is racist to stereotype them like that. It's also true that Faerun is racist generally. It has to be. It's a matter of survival, not political correctness.
TL;DR: It's a joke that makes fun of the stereotype.
The word "racist" is a fairly newish real world term. Feels off in the Forgotten Realms. The same way "dude" or "bro" or something like that would feel off.
I don't understand why people are making such a big deal out of it. I took it as a joke myself.
Since the beginning of DnD and RPGs, goblins have been the laughing stock of adventures and adventurers. Goblins are known to be evil and/or stupid and being basically cannon fodder with no personality.
The line said by the goblin is this: "So, all goblins look alike to you? That's what you're saying? Racist."
To me, it's simply making fun of that stereotype. Like in PnP, you can make a goblin or such character that isn't stupid or evil and mess with the adventure's NPCs.
PnP example: NPC: It's a goblin! Of course it's evil! PC Goblin: That's racist. Can you prove it? NPC: ...Uhh... PC: Yeah, thought so.
Or:
NPC: You're a halfling. Most likely you're the thief. PC: That's racist. Not all halflings are thieves. Do you have any proof or not?
It's the same analogy. There were many monstrous NPCs that went against the stereotype for comedic reasons. Another example is Deekin from Neverwinter Nights. An atypical Kobold dragon-blooded Bard that sings.
The goblin IS actually correct. It is racist to stereotype them like that. It's also true that Faerun is racist generally. It has to be. It's a matter of survival, not political correctness.
TL;DR: It's a joke that makes fun of the stereotype.
The word "racist" is a fairly newish real world term. Feels off in the Forgotten Realms. The same way "dude" or "bro" or something like that would feel off.
In the original Baldur's Gate 2, there's some more recent words as well. For instance, Edwin says "whatever" at least once, which hasn't been around since circa 1950's/60's; the word "racism" has been in use as a noun since around 1932, so what's the cut-off for acceptable modernism?
I really don't care anymore. Baldur's Gate was ruined for me when they released the first "Enhanced Edition" and it's not like you, I, or anyone else is going to stop them now.
Plus I've seen SO many things ruined by this point (Hollywood, video game industry) that my expectations are so low they're right next to dinosaur bones. Eventually you reach the moment where you gotta ask yourself: am I just going to live in a bubble for the rest of my life?
It's a bit funny we fight for the right of the goblins here when very early at middle of BG:EE Charname devastated an entire Xvart Village. And seeing that it was an entire village, i'm pretty sure this include womans and childrens too, that even if not directly killed, can't survive on their own.
The own leader of the village says he was just protecting his territory and we did that without justify...
So let's discuss this, then, later, we speak about racism !
I really don't care anymore. Baldur's Gate was ruined for me when they released the first "Enhanced Edition" and it's not like you, I, or anyone else is going to stop them now.
...How was it ruined? You can still buy and play the originals at GoG.com, you know. You could ignore the EEs like they never existed.
Personally, I enjoy the additions and improvements.
The OP have expressed ... whatever they wanted, and the first page of this thread has clearly given all possible reactions to it. All these things have already been discussed time and again, and there's no sense in continuing this thread.
Comments
I took it as a joke myself.
Since the beginning of DnD and RPGs, goblins have been the laughing stock of adventures and adventurers.
Goblins are known to be evil and/or stupid and being basically cannon fodder with no personality.
The line said by the goblin is this:
"So, all goblins look alike to you? That's what you're saying? Racist."
To me, it's simply making fun of that stereotype.
Like in PnP, you can make a goblin or such character that isn't stupid or evil and mess with the adventure's NPCs.
PnP example:
NPC: It's a goblin! Of course it's evil!
PC Goblin: That's racist. Can you prove it?
NPC: ...Uhh...
PC: Yeah, thought so.
Or:
NPC: You're a halfling. Most likely you're the thief.
PC: That's racist. Not all halflings are thieves. Do you have any proof or not?
It's the same analogy. There were many monstrous NPCs that went against the stereotype for comedic reasons.
Another example is Deekin from Neverwinter Nights. An atypical Kobold dragon-blooded Bard that sings.
The goblin IS actually correct. It is racist to stereotype them like that.
It's also true that Faerun is racist generally. It has to be. It's a matter of survival, not political correctness.
TL;DR: It's a joke that makes fun of the stereotype.
Damn...
People here have play a least one of the game in this serie ?
"So, all goblins look alike to you? That's what you're saying? Racist."
"So, all goblins look alike to you? That's what you're saying? We're not all the same."
These statements are basically identical and mean the same thing.
The former is from the game, the latter was changed to say the same thing with different words.
Plus I've seen SO many things ruined by this point (Hollywood, video game industry) that my expectations are so low they're right next to dinosaur bones. Eventually you reach the moment where you gotta ask yourself: am I just going to live in a bubble for the rest of my life?
Time to adapt and rejoin...
The own leader of the village says he was just protecting his territory and we did that without justify...
So let's discuss this, then, later, we speak about racism
You could ignore the EEs like they never existed.
Personally, I enjoy the additions and improvements.
Thread closed.