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most challening party of six - what would it be for you?

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  • sandmanCCLsandmanCCL Member Posts: 1,389
    Brude said:

    PS: I think the most challenging NPC group would be the low-CON party: Shar-teel, Viconia, Alora, Quayle, Garrick, Xan etc. Very little room for error.

    Eh. Not really. Everyone has low constitution outside of Khalid, Jaheira, Yeslick and Kagain. They are the only people who gain significant bonuses from their constitution.

    Assuming you get max HP a level, Xan/Xzar end up with 36. Dynaheir and Edwin end up with 54. Not really that big a deal. And that's the most pronounced differences. Mages are pretty much insta-dead if you're not roiding up with spells anyway.

    Shar-Teel still rolls d10 per level. She'll hit 80 HP at the end. Khalid ends up with 104. It's noticable but it's probably not going to matter all that much. Minsc only gets an extra 1 HP a level so he ends up with 88. That's barely even noticable.

    Viconia vs. Branwen, it's literally only a single HP per level. 64 vs. 72.
  • BrudeBrude Member Posts: 560
    @sandmanCCL You're right that the difference is negligible for most heavy-armor NPCs (eg: Shar-teel and Minsc). But I disagree about the rest, especially in the early game.

    Xzar and Xan can get one-shotted by AoE and arrow volleys from kobolds, while someone like Edwin will be hurt but won't die.

    This makes a huge difference in the early game, where you won't have a good number of pots or healing spells. Taking multiple low-CON NPCs along for the ride means much more hand holding on the part of the player.

    Endgame, eh, maybe it doesn't matter so much. But the entire game isn't endgame. You gotta get there first.
  • sandmanCCLsandmanCCL Member Posts: 1,389
    I find Edwin dies just as quick. Plus he also gets hit way more often. That extra -3 AC from Xan and -2 from Xzar are noticable. The difference between dying in two hits vs. dying in 3 hits is you're probably dead if you get hit at all.

    And those really are the only guys it's noticable on, at least when it comes to a max HP standpoint. A lot of the later NPCs join with less than average HP, which is really stupid. I think Alora joins as a level 6 thief and only has 19 HP, which means an average 2.6 HP a level. She should have closer to 23 or 24 HP if we're going off a pure average dice roll per level.

    My point was really just to say most the NPCs in the game have crap constitution. There are 25 NPCs. Only 13 of them have bonus HP due to constitution (52%). 4 of those people only have 15 constitution, which hardly makes a difference. Imoen, Kagain, Dynaheir and Edwin are the only people where the constitution bonuses are really noticeable, IMO.
  • BrudeBrude Member Posts: 560
    Fair points. I should probably amend the challenge to "squishiest."

    Take a toon like Shar-teel, who can't easily be 'fixed' by giving her one set of magic gauntlets or the other. That makes her a riskier proposition as party lead, despite the overall HP difference between her and someone like Minsc being rather small on paper.

    You compound that by backing her up with NPCs like Garrick, Quayle, and Dynaheir. Low physical stats in your backline means not only less mitigation for them individually, but it also translates into lower physical DPS. That translates into Shar-teel taking more damage from trash mobs . (This is assuming the player isn't wasting spells on non-boss fights and abusing rest mechanics).

    Overall, I think this would be a much more challenging (and incredibly annoying) party build. Especially for inexperienced players.
  • MortiannaMortianna Member Posts: 1,356

    Everyone has low constitution outside of Khalid, Jaheira, Yeslick and Kagain. They are the only people who gain significant bonuses from their constitution

    Unless you're only counting single and multi-class fighters, don't forget Tiax. His 16 CON gives him the stamina to rule all!

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