Odd bguard solo thought.

Aewyrven

So after lower discussions I've decided to repost.

Posts regarding this will be after my post of editing this post to allow posts to be more accurately thought of on the original post.

Got that? Good. Clear as mud. Moving on.

SoA. Solo. Blackguard. Neutral Evil.

Start stats:
Str: 12
Dex: 18
Con: 18
Int: 5
Wis: 5
Cha: 18
Required roll: 76

Higher rolls. Int=str=wis

What does that mean?

It means add the stats equally in that order. Int gets priority because of brain drain.

Basically if you roll a 77. Your stats become: 12/18/18/6/5/18
Roll a 78: 13/18/18/6/5/18
Roll a 79: 13/18/18/6/6/18
Get the idea?

Why?

Int prevents brain drain from a variety of sources. Str takes second place but isn't really important in this build. Wis is added in because having 3 wis well.... it could be bad. I dunno. 3 or 5 in anything never a good idea. At least get it to 10. That's my personal motto. Others will scream at me go do this or that. I take input but don't want to be perfect min max. Where's the fun in that? Plus my build and I'm looking for feedback so I can reject and accept input ya?

Weapon skills, 6 to start with. Start at level 7. 7th skill at 10... priest skills 9...

Warhammer 2*
Flail 1*
Axe 1*
Bastard sword 1*
Scimitar 1*

Reason:

Warhammer: Main weap gonna be crom feyer. Sets str at 25. And this is a solo char. It's also a +5 weap. Negates reason to have 18 str so str isn't that important. Also added in with the priest spells i have for fights and various belts... it's meh. I can also access the priest str spells and the belt early on so again due to being solo, meh.

Flail: Once im done talking to galen (coo!) Im gonna get kicked to stronghold. D'arnise. Gives me the Flail. Smexy +3 trip element. 1 point in it now no penalty. 1 point later if I really like it.

Axe: Smexy axes in the stronghold. Also from cop coronet. And I can lob em at guys. So I get a ranged opener or closer while hiding behind my shield. Can head over to watchers keep and get axe of unyielding. Gives me vorpal no save in ToB when upgraded as a 1 hander.

Bsword: Larochs on hit. So it's basically an improved sword of chaos you get off cambion in the irenicus dungeon except I can keep a shield on. Also in watchers keep. Should be easy to get.

Scimitar for belm. Mow weak enemies faster from the bonus to apr.

Plan. mail of dead from irenicus. Smack around lethinin in the copper coronet to unlock the azure axe. Slide over to windspear hills for some ankheg plate. Quick jaunt to darnise since i have an axe that can kill trolls for the Flail and my stronghold. Go save cernd and a bunch rich pompous dorks for belt barrier blur cloak and shield of harmony and then electric slide around the rest of the quests in chapt 1 to upgrade things and level up.

Along the way I can choose to 2 prof into a second weapon, work on dual wield, or pick up an entirely new one, and with the priest spells available pretty much turn my solo into a 6v1.... unless it has death spells...

Thoughts?

TheArtisan

Wisdom only provides bonus spells to clerics and druids. For a blackguard/paladin, it's worthless. You're better off putting those points in Strength.

Lord_Tansheron

Personally, I do believe Blackguard is quite a powerful class. The Unholy Avenger is not quite as good as its counterpart, but I guess it's good enough.

That being said, I'd still rather have Inquisitor True Sight and Dispel Magic in most cases, especially in LoB mode where enemy levels shoot through the roof and you almost have no chance of dispelling them regularly (for a long time, anyway).

Aewyrven

Artemius_I said:

Wisdom only provides bonus spells to clerics and druids. For a blackguard/paladin, it's worthless. You're better off putting those points in Strength.

You're actually right on that.... I just ran through several variations and wisdom is having no effect on the abilities....

At that point I am going to guess the blackguard cleric spells are based off the charisma score. Max cha on it like you would wis on a cleric.

My only concern would be using items like scrolls and say rod of res, but if it uses the cha modifyer.... my original stat roll would stand but simply swap the wisdom and int scores for less brain suckyness. Dumpstat the wisdom instead.

As for raising the str, see above as to the reason the str is what it is, unless wisdom has zero affect on anything to do with a blackguard then yeah, Dumpstat to str. (Either way makes no difference aside from letting you run with a lower base roll)..

@Lord_Tansheron haven't tried that yet and I would hope by the time I'm taking on the insane modes I've enough knowledge of how to do it.

The stat roll aside. How is the rest of the plan?

TheArtisan

No. Paladin spell progression is set in stone. There's no stat that will give you bonus spells, so there's no reason not to cap strength if you can.

Regarding weapons - paladins use two-handed swords because they can wield the holy avenger. The blackguard can't (the unholy avenger is mediocre) so the optimal build is to dual-wield weapons. Your proficiencies are fine. I recommend bastard swords at higher levels for the Foebane sword though.

Aewyrven

Yeah. I'm stuck in an odd oldschool weirdness where int and wis would boost save throws and spells for some reason. It's been a long time since I played and I don't have my old shadows of amn manual. Remember that 1 inch thick sucker?

It's all cha. Just like a sorcerer. Go cha screw int.

So THAT aside.. it simply drops the stat rolls required from gargantuan 90+ to.... *checks* ...I was going to say I want 10 int and wis for level drain but then remembered bg isn't affected by it so it'd just be int for flayer psionics.

In that case you could get away with a heck a 79 roll gives you 10 int 3 wis and the min 12 str. So it'd be a 87 roll and you're laughing on the build (not hard to get)
12/18/18/18/3/18 at 87.


Foebane is nice and achievable as an additional. That Laroch would come in very nice and can be used with a shield. I like it. That would probably be the first pip unlocked I'd go for.

My only other concern running the above stat setup would be a Stat drain... but... bg inane beg plane immunity removes that ability doesn't it? So a shadow hit would never actually affect the 3 wis since at 0 of a Stat you die. Correct?

I guess alternative would be 18/18/18/x=x/18 if you wanted.

Lord_Tansheron

Best bet is probably Crom Faeyr + Belm/Kundane, possibly switching to Flail of Ages+5 whenever you go into Greater Whirlwind (ideally combined with DuHM).

If you can stack enough STR via DuHM reliably, Foebane or Club of Detonation may be a better mainhand, too.

If you're not using Improved Haste (for whatever reason), use Flail of Ages+5.

Aewyrven

Lord_Tansheron said:

Best bet is Crom Faeyr + Belm/Kundane, switching to Flail of Ages+5 whenever you go into Greater Whirlwind (ideally combined with DuHM).

If you can stack enough STR via DuHM reliably, Foebane or Club of Detonation may be a better mainhand, too.

If you're not using Improved Haste (for whatever reason), use Flail of Ages+5.

It's a solo run so I don't have access to imp haste. And it's a start from SoA. Not tob.

Edit: and the original idea was eventually crom as main the other skills as placeholders until it's built. (Using the base 6 points you get then adding in others later, so there is room to dual wield later on)

I'm still working through all of chapt 1 and by all I mean every quest so I'm accumulating a lot of gear on my main save game and weighing things.

Aewyrven

Editing main post.

Aewyrven

Updated. New thoughts guys?

moody_mage

Why are you so obsessed with 12 Strength? You had a roll of 96, that's plenty to max out several stats. 12 strength solo is going to be tough, the items you are hoping to negate this handicap are all late game items.

Yes you can get various belts etc early on but it seems redundant. May as well have a roll of 75 and call it a minimum stat solo run.

Aewyrven

decado said:

Why are you so obsessed with 12 Strength? You had a roll of 96, that's plenty to max out several stats. 12 strength solo is going to be tough, the items you are hoping to negate this handicap are all late game items.

Yes you can get various belts etc early on but it seems redundant. May as well have a roll of 75 and call it a minimum stat solo run.

So call it that then. Do you have anything to contribute at all aside from a rip on the build with no useful tips?

It is posted as a 76 so... I guess it'd be 1 less in wisdom? Lol.

Gotural

Having played a lot of Blackguard, I can assure you that the best weapons you can use are going to be The Flail of Ages and the Defender of Easthaven.

This way you only use one proficiency, both weapons are accessible right from Chapter 2, both deal crushing damage and are atleast +3.
There are no better choice.
With the various Str bonuses during the game you'll easily hit 25 Str with DUHM without Crom anyway, and with Hardiness + DoE + Armor of Faith you are going to reach 85% physical damage resistances A.K.A. "I'm invincible and can solo every encounters in the game as easily as a point and click"

Max strength, dexterity and constitution at creation, get either 11 or 16 Intelligence as well (Mind Flayers remove 5 per hit).

Pteran

Your badass Blackguard is gonna die from one mind flayer hit.

You may as well remove points from Charisma to whatever the Blackguard min is. Unlike later editions of D&D, you're not getting any stat bonuses from it other than reactions and price reductions at stores. That can easily be achieved with the Ring of Human Influence, which is basically thrown in your face as soon as you leave Chateau Irenicus.

I second putting pips in Flails. Bastard Swords and Axes would also be fun.

Aewyrven

Gotural said:

Having played a lot of Blackguard, I can assure you that the best weapons you can use are going to be The Flail of Ages and the Defender of Easthaven.

This way you only use one proficiency, both weapons are accessible right from Chapter 2, both deal crushing damage and are atleast +3.
There are no better choice.
With the various Str bonuses during the game you'll easily hit 25 Str with DUHM without Crom anyway, and with Hardiness + DoE + Armor of Faith you are going to reach 85% physical damage resistances A.K.A. "I'm invincible and can solo every encounters in the game as easily as a point and click"

Max strength, dexterity and constitution at creation, get either 11 or 16 Intelligence as well (Mind Flayers remove 5 per hit).

Yeah I was thinking dhm would kinda op me....

I had to Google defender since I haven't come across it yet... Yeah that stacks even worse.... it really does let you go lol at things....takes the wind out of the sails for fun on that... the damage redux is just silly.

Aewyrven

Pteran said:

Your badass Blackguard is gonna die from one mind flayer hit.

You may as well remove points from Charisma to whatever the Blackguard min is. Unlike later editions of D&D, you're not getting any stat bonuses from it other than reactions and price reductions at stores. That can easily be achieved with the Ring of Human Influence, which is basically thrown in your face as soon as you leave Chateau Irenicus.

I second putting pips in Flails. Bastard Swords and Axes would also be fun.

Wow I just looked at that..... and yeah there's no change at all in any variation of int wis and cha on the ToB start when naked...... might as well just min em out..... and using what Gotural said.... with that kind of stuff... heck make a ftr cleric or even a thief cleric and same result mostly....

An 86 roll gives you 3 hits at -5 from a flayer.... (it's 15 int and str dex con max)

That's just silly....

Well now I'm bummed out haha.

Aewyrven

And looking at it from those points of view.... you can kinda do that with almost every class combo in the game. Just nail up 3 main stats and Dumpstat int.

Str con dex int. Con dex int. Con dex wis int.....

Like that you opened my eyes to it... hate that you did but at the same time... I guess it's time when I don't want to play the main to try weird weapon combos. (Was bound to happen as I played through)

Guess my newest gripe is the restrictions on class combos. Nwn kinda did away with it.

That and I have to play within the confines of the mobile app. Ho hum. I asked and recieved. Now I have to deal with it.

moody_mage

I'm not ripping the build (much ), I'm just confused about what you are trying to achieve here. It took me less than 2 mins to get a roll of 91 which was enough for the following;

STR: 18/xx
DEX: 18
CON: 18
INT: 16 (survives 3 hits from a flayer)
WIS: 7
CHA: 14

If you were trying to give yourself a handicap then I understand that, but you don't seem to be. You just seem to be focused on the stat changes given by certain weapons and deciding that because of that you can neglect that score from your initial stat allocation.

Aewyrven

decado said:

I'm not ripping the build (much), I'm just confused about what you are trying to achieve here. It took me less than 2 mins to get a roll of 91 which was enough for the following;

STR: 18/xx
DEX: 18
CON: 18
INT: 16 (survives 3 hits from a flayer)
WIS: 7
CHA: 14

If you were trying to give yourself a handicap then I understand that, but you don't seem to be. You just seem to be focused on the stat changes given by certain weapons and deciding that because of that you can neglect that score from your initial stat allocation.

That's what I was attempting to do, because at the time I believed cha affected turn undead and spell power enemy save vs and the following as save against...

...wis affected the priest spells we gained alongside wand/death/staff/rod/spell. Int affecting wand/rod/staff/spell/death + brain suck. Con affecting petri poly parallel poison and hp and dex affecting ac Para psn breath...

Thus using that mantra you bump up the save throws and the bonus to the enemy making the saves (con dex wis int cha) and since str was easily attainable through items you could neglect it and thus max out on potential base boosts that would require items to cover.

The idea was you could, because of base stats, let the stats deal with saves and gear to raw damage, bypassing the need for immunity gear since your saves were already stupid high.


I rememer vaguely reading about paladins needing cha for their spells to land and to resist as well as turn undead from waaaaaay back. Naturally you add in con for hp dex for hit and ac. Since they cast divine spells naturally add wis.

Make sense no?

I have since been edumicated. All that matters to a bg is str con dex. Dumpstat int.

Then pick weapons to make your life harder or easier.

Kinda sucks... but I did ask and recieved. So I'm not too bitter.


Edit: I want to shoot autocorrect.

Pteran

In all fairness, those saving throw bonuses you were aiming for were added in later D&D rulesets. You weren't totally crazy for thinking that lol.

Aewyrven

I'm probably thinking nwn edition. Ah well. What I've learned simplifies bg2 in some ways.

I will still continue my full clear as much as I can, get a read on everything and then attempt solos.

Still love the game. And yes. Still worth the $10 I paid to download on the phone.

I'm actually glad I can't mod it. (I don't have a computer) so I'm stuck with about as pure as it can get.

Thanks all for the tips and such.

moody_mage

Gotcha. Yeah you are mixing third edition rules in there.

If you want stupidly good saves then dwarf or gnome with a high constitution would be good. No paladin types for those races though.

Gotural

Paladins have a built in -2 bonus to every saves (replaced later in 3rd edition by a Charisma based bonus to saving throws) right from the start so they are capable of reaching below 0 saving throws easily (especially with hell trials).

It's not as good as a Shorty but it's not bad either

Abi_Dalzim

Your OP mentioned using Azuredge, but that axe can only be used by Good characters, IIRC.

Edit: Or maybe that changed when I wasn't looking. Huh.

Aewyrven

No its good aligned, i grabbed the stonefire from Bernard at copper coronet for use at d'arnise against the trolls until I could put together the Foa.

I'm playing through and having a fairly good run using a different roll set.

Base:
18/77
18
18
13
10
18
Axe 1*
Flail 2*
Dual wield 3*

Went 18 cha just to make it a tad harder than going higher int. Besides, who doesn't like gold?

Level 15 now and added Warhammer 2* and brought axe to 2*

I absolutely LOVE balas wizard slayer axe. That sucker is such a help at low level against mages.

Usually dualing Foa and defender of easthaven.

I'd say I'm about 75% solo. I brought Yoshi along for the sphere (and valygar) but mostly only run him around to where I need him to wait and unlock things.

Aside from that it's just drag the char in question around for its quest and then kick them once the quest is done.

Biggest surprise so far was taking down the shadow dragon with Mazzy in her stock gear and only 1 stair abuse in a duo at 15. I got lucky on poison weapon stacks I guess since he went from barely injured to 3 critical screams from my charname to dead.

Also loving cloak of sewers to troll regen while moving around instead of resting.

My biggest issue fight so far was actually the sewers under the coronet by lilarcor. .. those freaking dual hobgoblin shamans and their double hold persons.... almost threw the phone....

Adding in that his rest until healed is finally down to 16 hours instead of 24 days due to priest spells... I'm thinking this guy is going to be insane by the time I get to the end of the game...

My only issue I'm dreading right now is firkraag.... but I'm going to post that in a different thread.

Thanks for all the help and comments guys (and gals). Really appreciate it.

Edit: that and I have to go smack some guards to drop rep. It's at 14.... not good.was comic having keldorn and him walk side by side against the unseeing eye though. ..

Bad joke beginning? "So a black guard and an inquisitor walk into a bar covered in blood and ichor, to share a drinkover a hard fought victory. Both cast detect alignment to know who the tgreats are..."