BG 2: initial HPs

MatteoTurini

This is a BG 2 thread, but I thought I'd open it anyway. I searched on the forums, but didn't manage to find a thread that addressed this issue.

I'm not sure this is actually a bug, or simply a feature due to the divine nature of CHARNAME, but anyway, I've noticed that sometimes in BG 2 the initial HPs of CHARNAME are actually higher than what would be possible for their class and level.

Here's a screenshot for a character that I've just rolled, and that should have 42 HPs (6x7), but actually has 46 (I lowered the difficulty to try this):

http://s10.postimage.org/88zvrhw5z/neyvasa.jpg

I have installed BG 2 Fixpack and Widescreen Mod, but this happened even when I didn't have any mod installed.

So...

CURRENT BEHAVIOUR: initial HPS, in BG 2, are sometimes calculated wrongly.

EXPECTED BEHAVIOUR: initial HPs are calculated in the right way.

Awong124

Your image doesn't work.

MatteoTurini

Yep. I provided the link. Does it work?

Awong124

Oh yeah, works fine now.

I do remember vaguely reading a long time ago that for some reason Baldur's Gate 2 gives the PC double hit points for level 1. I'm trying to look for it, but not having any luck so far.

jolly_bb

Awong124 said:

Oh yeah, works fine now.

I do remember vaguely reading a long time ago that for some reason Baldur's Gate 2 gives the PC double hit points for level 1. I'm trying to look for it, but not having any luck so far.

But the those surplus HP for lvl 1 is calculated without CON bonus. I've read about it somewhere as well.

Honestly: it would probably inbalance the game, so too late to introduce at this point, but it would actually made a lot of sense to have DOUBLE HP at lvl 1 and then gain more in a normal way. I mean - for the roleplay and realism purposes - that would make sense to me.

Awong124

I think giving max HP for level 1 is sufficient. But since he's talking about BG2, where you start at like level 8, it doesn't really matter that much.

bigdogchris

I believe this 'issue' would apply even for BG:EE as it's the same engine.

What I'd like to see is that the characters for BG2 start the game with the proper hit dice, randomly rolled + modifier. I suppose if the developers script it to start you at maximum hit point per hit dice, then I understand, as this is just a game.

mlnevese

I really think maximum HP on first level should be kept.

Once we had a mage in a P&P game that had 1 HP. If he got minimum splash damage he´d be dead. It was not fun for anyone involved and we ended up house ruling that at first level everyone should start with maximum HP.

Wraith_Sarevok

Everyone is just going to continuously reload the game to get max HP at every level anyway, so there's no point in trying to make it random. I did it in Baldur's Gate 1 even when there WASN'T an option to give static HP on level ups.

MatteoTurini

Wraith_Sarevok said:

Everyone is just going to continuously reload the game to get max HP at every level anyway, so there's no point in trying to make it random. I did it in Baldur's Gate 1 even when there WASN'T an option to give static HP on level ups.

Well, not everyone, I suppose. Sometimes someone may prefer to slightly force the rules to have max HPs, sometime someone may not. It would be nice to account for both kinds of play.

For initial HPs, though, it may be different. Even in some incarnations of Ad&d they were set to max, and I think in BG it is actually more sensible to do it than in PnP, where you can overcome obstacles in more ways than simply fighting them or escaping.

aldain

Wraith_Sarevok said:

Everyone is just going to continuously reload the game to get max HP at every level anyway, so there's no point in trying to make it random. I did it in Baldur's Gate 1 even when there WASN'T an option to give static HP on level ups.

Um.. no? Max HP is just another thing that wrecks the difficulty of the game. I for one will absolutely be using random HP rolls, and I am certainly expecting that to be the norm (as it should be in 2nd ed D&D).

With that said, you definitely need max HP on first level in BG1. Hell, you're expected to take on two thugs by yourself at the very beginning (Carbos and Shank), that's difficult if you wind up with 1-2 HP and no Con bonus. I wonder what would happen if a 1 HP mage went through the ambush cutscene at the start, would the flame arrow kill him?

Awong124

I want average rolls.

mlnevese

If you had only 1HP you'd die as soon as the cutscene was over.

Flashburn

mlnevese said:

If you had only 1HP you'd die as soon as the cutscene was over.

This. It probably adds some HP to your character so he won't be seriously wounded or dead from Irenicus' experiments.

bigdogchris

I think maximum HP on first level is a DM decision, and for a video game I have no problem with it. Since BG2 has the 'max hp per level' check box it won't be an issue.

Awong124

mlnevese said:

If you had only 1HP you'd die as soon as the cutscene was over.

This would never happen, you gain at least 1 hp per level, and you start BG2 at around level 7 or 8.

mlnevese

Yes, but in BG1 you suffer 1hp damage in the cutscene. In BG EE it could and would happen.

Awong124

Oh, I quoted the wrong quote. I meant to quote the comment below yours, because it mentioned Irenicus' dungeon.

mlnevese

DeathKnight

Beginning the game in Normal Difficulty (hps hit max, all spells automatically leaned, no permanent death), always ends in imported or newly made characters with trimmed down hitpoints. To keep the actual hitpoints from your BG1 imported character, you have to put difficulty in Core Rules, then begin game, and only after that import your characters (or create new ones). They won't have *higher* hitpoints, but their NORMAL ones! Then you can save/export those newly imported or newly made characters (all stats including HPs will be kept as are) and after that, change the difficulty into any you like. After all is said and done, continue adventuring with those characters.

Battlehamster

I had the same issue - My lv. 8 Paladin had 104 HP. When I exported him to BG2 he had 200hp. No idea how or why...I re-imported to get it right, right before I exported the character w/ the hp that is!